Is cycling through stationary traffic illegal?

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Willpower
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Postby Willpower » 23 Jul 2008, 2:40pm

Yeah I have to deal with forking traffic too.

Every forking day. :wink:

JohnL
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Postby JohnL » 23 Jul 2008, 2:44pm

Willpower wrote:
max2008 wrote: Dangerous Opening Of A Door regulation.


there is such a thing :shock:


There is an offence of 'opening a door to danger', or something similar. I couldn't tell you where to find it though!

Don't forget that being right doesn't make the resultant accident any less painful.


Agreed!!!

John

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Postby JQ666 » 23 Jul 2008, 3:07pm

max2008 wrote:Never said I was turning left. After the lights the road continues, then later forks. So I would have to get back over to the left to be in the left lane before the traffic starts forking.


That's fine - don't need to get back over to the left 'quickly' - remember, you have just as much right to be in the middle of the lane as a car does, therefore you can just filter gently back into the lane (if you're doing 10 - 15mph, you'll easily do this as the gaps appear when stationary traffic starts moving again).

Once you're back in the lane, you can move as far left as you like.

Give it a try next time.

eileithyia
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Postby eileithyia » 23 Jul 2008, 3:22pm

I frequently cycle in slow/stationery traffic and try to pick the side that makes most sense, often on the outside of the traffic.
Always have to watch out for opening doors, pedestrians cutting throu the traffic and other cars being given a gap to cross the line of traffic.
Because i am so distrustful of the general public I rarely ride at anything more than about 8-10mph in these situations.

However it is against the law to open a car door without looking and hitting another person/car etc. It clearly sounds like they were trying to make a point, watch out for them in future and keep out of their way, don't rise to the bait (easier said than done I know).
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Mick F
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Postby Mick F » 23 Jul 2008, 4:01pm

eileithyia wrote:However it is against the law to open a car door without looking


I think that only applies to the driver.
Mick F. Cornwall

max2008

Postby max2008 » 23 Jul 2008, 4:22pm

Wouldn't have thought so. Doesn't make sense that it would only apply to the driver.

If that was the case everyone except the driver could open doors at will knocking over cyclists, motorbikes and any other traffic, and they would not be committing an offence.

I'll see if I can find the regulation in writing....

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Phil_Lee
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Postby Phil_Lee » 23 Jul 2008, 5:10pm

I seem to recall that (somewhat strangely) it comes under the construction & use regs.

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Postby 2Tubs » 23 Jul 2008, 5:38pm

Yorkshireman wrote:
2Tubs wrote:This is how I understand it.

If you were occupying the same lane, you were undertaking and making an ilegal manouvre.

If there was a cycle lane, you had a clear lane and quite at liberty to undertake the blocked lane to your right.

But lets be honest, we all overtake stationary traffic. The thnig to do is look out for those car doors.

Gazza


What law was the OP breaking ?


I thought it was covered by the laws on undertaking.

As I say, I don't have the regs in front of me. It is as I understand it.

Quite happy to be shown I'm wrong.

If you know better, please feel free to inform.

Gazza
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lauriematt
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Postby lauriematt » 23 Jul 2008, 7:19pm

they say things look smaller or further away in your mirrors...but still surely youd play it safe & let a cyclist past regardless of how far away they are???
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patricktaylor
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Postby patricktaylor » 24 Jul 2008, 10:52am

directgov: Highway Code etc

[cyclists] When approaching a junction on the left, watch out for vehicles turning in front of you, out of or into the side road. Just before you turn, check for undertaking cyclists or motorcyclists. Do not ride on the inside of vehicles signalling or slowing down to turn left.

Highway Code:

Only overtake on the left if the vehicle in front is signalling to turn right, and there is room to do so.

DO NOT overtake where you might come into conflict with other road users. For example between the kerb and a bus or tram when it is at a stop.

[Some ambiguity above and below]

All cyclists should consider the benefits of undertaking cycle training :D

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Yorkshireman
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Postby Yorkshireman » 24 Jul 2008, 11:26am

2Tubs wrote:
Yorkshireman wrote:
2Tubs wrote:This is how I understand it.

If you were occupying the same lane, you were undertaking and making an ilegal manouvre.

If there was a cycle lane, you had a clear lane and quite at liberty to undertake the blocked lane to your right.

But lets be honest, we all overtake stationary traffic. The thnig to do is look out for those car doors.

Gazza


What law was the OP breaking ?


I thought it was covered by the laws on undertaking.

As I say, I don't have the regs in front of me. It is as I understand it.

Quite happy to be shown I'm wrong.

If you know better, please feel free to inform.

Gazza


I don't 'know better' (which is why I asked), but as this subject seems to be cropping up quite a bit recently I have made a few enquiries. At the local police station (road traffic dept) I was told that (as far as they were aware) there is no specific offence of undertaking (in the circumstances given by the OP) as 'filtering' in slow/stationary traffic by pedal/m/cyclists is an accepted means of making progress. This opinion was also backed up by a m/cycle training instructor who also said that in the case of a m/cyclist not filtering on either side of stationary/slow moving traffic when safe to do so (with the proviso that no solid white lines be crossed) during a driving test could be one of the reasons for a 'fail'. I also checked the Highway Code but I can't see any 'MUST/MUST NOT' covering 'filtering', I did find this
Motorcyclists and cyclists
211
It is often difficult to see motorcyclists and cyclists, especially when they are coming up from behind, coming out of junctions, at roundabouts, overtaking you or filtering through traffic. Always look out for them before you emerge from a junction; they could be approaching faster than you think. When turning right across a line of slow-moving or stationary traffic, look out for cyclists or motorcyclists on the inside of the traffic you are crossing. Be especially careful when turning, and when changing direction or lane. Be sure to check mirrors and blind spots carefully.

(my bold), and this
88
Manoeuvring. You should be aware of what is behind and to the sides before manoeuvring. Look behind you; use mirrors if they are fitted. When in traffic queues look out for pedestrians crossing between vehicles and vehicles emerging from junctions or changing lanes. Position yourself so that drivers in front can see you in their mirrors. Additionally, when filtering in slow-moving traffic, take care and keep your speed low.



Whilst talking to the police traffic officer I asked about the situation on a motorway where a vehicle may be driving in the outer ('overtaking') lane whilst the centre lane is clear for a considerable distance (or a dual carriageway subject to NSL when the nearside lane is also clear). His reply was to the effect that providing that the vehicle being undertaken was doing considerably less than 70mph and the vehicle undertaking not more than 70 - 75mph and also being driven in an otherwise sensible manner, he personally (if present and on duty) would probably follow the vehicle blocking the lane until it returned to one of the other lanes. He also said that if the driver took an inordinate (in the opinion of the officer) amount of time/distance to carry out the action he would 'pull him/her over' to 'have a word' when safe to do so (though this last part doesn't have much relevance to cyclists).
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patricktaylor
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Re: Is cycling through stationary traffic illegal?

Postby patricktaylor » 24 Jul 2008, 12:02pm

max2008 wrote:Does anyone know the law on this?


I doubt if there's a clear cut answer. The Highway Code contains both 'advice', and 'legal requirements' identified by the use of the words 'MUST/MUST NOT' and 'an abbreviated reference to the legislation which creates the offence'.

It includes phrases such as "be aware of cyclists and motorcyclists who may be passing on either side" and I can't see 'MUST/MUST NOT' in relation to passing stationary vehicles on the inside.

I imagine the test of whether a cyclist going between kerb and stationary or slow moving cars committed an offence or whether a car occupant committed one by opening the nearside door when queueing could be determined only by a court in the circumstances of an incident.

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Postby 2Tubs » 24 Jul 2008, 12:24pm

Yorkshireman wrote:
2Tubs wrote:
Yorkshireman wrote:
2Tubs wrote:This is how I understand it.

If you were occupying the same lane, you were undertaking and making an ilegal manouvre.

If there was a cycle lane, you had a clear lane and quite at liberty to undertake the blocked lane to your right.

But lets be honest, we all overtake stationary traffic. The thnig to do is look out for those car doors.

Gazza


What law was the OP breaking ?


I thought it was covered by the laws on undertaking.

As I say, I don't have the regs in front of me. It is as I understand it.

Quite happy to be shown I'm wrong.

If you know better, please feel free to inform.

Gazza


I don't 'know better' (which is why I asked), but as this subject seems to be cropping up quite a bit recently I have made a few enquiries. At the local police station (road traffic dept) I was told that (as far as they were aware) there is no specific offence of undertaking (in the circumstances given by the OP) as 'filtering' in slow/stationary traffic by pedal/m/cyclists is an accepted means of making progress. This opinion was also backed up by a m/cycle training instructor who also said that in the case of a m/cyclist not filtering on either side of stationary/slow moving traffic when safe to do so (with the proviso that no solid white lines be crossed) during a driving test could be one of the reasons for a 'fail'. I also checked the Highway Code but I can't see any 'MUST/MUST NOT' covering 'filtering', I did find this
Motorcyclists and cyclists
211
It is often difficult to see motorcyclists and cyclists, especially when they are coming up from behind, coming out of junctions, at roundabouts, overtaking you or filtering through traffic. Always look out for them before you emerge from a junction; they could be approaching faster than you think. When turning right across a line of slow-moving or stationary traffic, look out for cyclists or motorcyclists on the inside of the traffic you are crossing. Be especially careful when turning, and when changing direction or lane. Be sure to check mirrors and blind spots carefully.

(my bold), and this
88
Manoeuvring. You should be aware of what is behind and to the sides before manoeuvring. Look behind you; use mirrors if they are fitted. When in traffic queues look out for pedestrians crossing between vehicles and vehicles emerging from junctions or changing lanes. Position yourself so that drivers in front can see you in their mirrors. Additionally, when filtering in slow-moving traffic, take care and keep your speed low.



Whilst talking to the police traffic officer I asked about the situation on a motorway where a vehicle may be driving in the outer ('overtaking') lane whilst the centre lane is clear for a considerable distance (or a dual carriageway subject to NSL when the nearside lane is also clear). His reply was to the effect that providing that the vehicle being undertaken was doing considerably less than 70mph and the vehicle undertaking not more than 70 - 75mph and also being driven in an otherwise sensible manner, he personally (if present and on duty) would probably follow the vehicle blocking the lane until it returned to one of the other lanes. He also said that if the driver took an inordinate (in the opinion of the officer) amount of time/distance to carry out the action he would 'pull him/her over' to 'have a word' when safe to do so (though this last part doesn't have much relevance to cyclists).


Good info.

Ta.

Gazza
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Postby stoatsngroats » 24 Jul 2008, 4:02pm

max2008 wrote:.....before the traffic starts forking.


:shock: I HATE forking traffic.... :D

Seriously, I think the 'Dangerous opening of a Door regulation is very interesting....That should be on ALL driving tests..!

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Mick F
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Postby Mick F » 24 Jul 2008, 4:20pm

Going back to my point about passengers opening doors .....

The driver is in charge of his vehicle. He must obey the law.
A passenger can open a door, and may not have read the HC, let alone know, or pay any attention to any vehicle laws. The law can only apply the the driver.

If it applied to the passenger, what law could the passenger have broken? You can't endorse a licence of a passenger if he hasn't got one. If he wasn't driving, he can't be guilty of a traffic offence.
Mick F. Cornwall