Long day ride advice - 240 miles

Commuting, Day rides, Audax, Incidents, etc.
donnieban
Posts: 147
Joined: 21 May 2011, 10:39am
Location: Isle of Skye

Long day ride advice - 240 miles

Postby donnieban » 14 Jan 2013, 6:08pm

Last year I marked my (47th) Birthday with a 120 mile bike ride:

http://www.bikeroutetoaster.com/Course. ... rse=492247

I enjoyed last years trip that much that I am daftly planning on doubling the distance this year - 5 months to go...

Enjoyable as it was I had some numbness issues up front, nope not my hands :shock: B17 saddle and cheapo lycra shorts. So this year I will tension the saddle a quarter turn or two and will get some proper bib shorts:

De Soto 400 mile?

Castelli Endurance?

Assos F1 Mille s5?


Any thoughts on the above or alternative bibs gratefully received. What sort of break times should I be taking. On the previous trip I don't think I helped myself given I only had about 4 breaks in total. 3 of about 5 to ten minutes and a 3/4 hour lunch break at 105 miles. Also conscious that I didn't get out of the saddle at all really. Total ride time was about 8 1/2 hours which I was happy with on a steel touring bike.

The plan this year, is to cycle the same route to Inverness and then simply cycle back home - all within 24 hrs. Last year it was with my TREK 520 with pun-t-guard 700 x 32 Bontrager tyres at 100 psi although this time round I may opt for the new addition - lightweight road bike running 700 x 23 shod with Vittoria Rubino Pro?

So in no particular order, improved circulation, improved comfort from saddle / shorts and break times. Not for charity by the way.

donnieban

eileithyia
Posts: 7741
Joined: 31 Jan 2007, 6:46pm
Location: Horwich Which is Lancs :-)

Re: Long day ride advice - 240 miles

Postby eileithyia » 14 Jan 2013, 10:46pm

1. Do not tension your saddle, just get plenty of miles in on it as it is, never re-tension before a big ride, someone 'kindly' this for me before a big ride once!!!!! :?
2. Assos Shorts everytime and use some of their 'chamois cream' or http://www.evanscycles.com/products/nat ... b-ec009819
3. If possible carry a change of shorts and change halfway thru.
4. Breaks every 25-30 miles... that's the sort of distance many audax events have between 'controls'/stops
5. Remember you may not have cafes available in the night so make sure you have supplies for your stoppage time to have a munch on
I stand and rejoice everytime I see a woman ride by on a wheel the picture of free, untrammeled womanhood. HG Wells

fatty
Posts: 101
Joined: 5 Nov 2012, 3:26pm
Location: swinton south yorkshire

Re: Long day ride advice - 240 miles

Postby fatty » 14 Jan 2013, 10:56pm

I use rock racing bib shorts from Planet X and I rate them over all my others....

User avatar
NATURAL ANKLING
Posts: 10186
Joined: 24 Oct 2012, 10:43pm
Location: English Riviera

Re: Long day ride advice - 240 miles

Postby NATURAL ANKLING » 14 Jan 2013, 11:35pm

Hi,
Talking from experience of 240 + in 24h : Totally unsupported, carry all food from start.
I would ditch the saddle they might be well favoured in the touring clubs but this is no std ctc ride.
I found on long rides that it cut into inner thigh. You want a thinner saddle so no rub. I know they do a narrow version.
Half decent shorts do the job, but more important lt its your underwear that neads to be lightweight.
I always thought that a normal pair of pants would do but too much material down there holds the sweat.
Also the less seams in your crotch the better, the seams rub. Change pants and socks at 12.00
Bib shorts probably do support better and more comfort, never tried them.
How will you eat when dark, carry food for this, and fill your pockets everytime you stop.
Where will you get water in dark, identify your sources, lakes etc, tablets for purification.
How will you see at night, no street lamps, good reliable very powerful lamp.
Where and how will you rest, gets cold when you stop, need clothes or mat and bivvy.
If you rely on shops and cafes you have to get there at time they are open and when you need them.
Have you a support vehicle :?:
Dont under estimate the amount of food you will need.
Your rests will need to be 20 mins long every 3hrs after 12 hrs and you need to close your eyes too :!:
Good Luck
If You Don't Try You Don't Do.....Don't Do You Don't Get...I'm Still Trying....Well Very..
You'll Find Me At The Top Of A Hill...............Somewhere...After Dark..

User avatar
meic
Posts: 19355
Joined: 1 Feb 2007, 9:37pm
Location: Caerfyrddin (Carmarthen)

Re: Long day ride advice - 240 miles

Postby meic » 14 Jan 2013, 11:47pm

I would ditch the saddle they might be well favoured in the touring clubs but this is no std ctc ride.


I am no great lover of Brooks saddles myself but the B17 is also well favoured in Audax UK and this is pretty much a standard Audax ride.
Yma o Hyd

stewartpratt
Posts: 2566
Joined: 27 Dec 2007, 5:12pm

Re: Long day ride advice - 240 miles

Postby stewartpratt » 15 Jan 2013, 8:19am

Saddles and shorts are a personal thing. It's trial and error, really.

I'll go against some of the advice above: unless there are extraordinary circumstances you don't need changes of clothes or a mat or a bivy. It'll only weigh you down - I prefer to travel light (I've done two-dayers with no change of clothes, it's fine). Just keep riding, with stops for food.

Two suggestions for things to take: You can get thumb-sized sachets of chamois cream (Paceline Butt'r - comes in purple-and-yellow packaging) which are ideal to carry in case you need to top up mid-ride. And chocolate coated coffee beans are great at keeping you going through the night - one every half hour keeps you ticking along.

And it's worth noting some useful locations of 24hr petrol stations before you leave - they're a good fallback if you need to grab some extra calories (or caffeine) during the night.
Last edited by stewartpratt on 15 Jan 2013, 8:44am, edited 2 times in total.

The Mechanic
Posts: 1922
Joined: 23 Jul 2010, 1:38pm
Location: Scotland

Re: Long day ride advice - 240 miles

Postby The Mechanic » 15 Jan 2013, 8:41am

NATURAL ANKLING wrote:Hi,
Talking from experience of 240 + in 24h : Totally unsupported, carry all food from start.
I would ditch the saddle they might be well favoured in the touring clubs but this is no std ctc ride.
I found on long rides that it cut into inner thigh. You want a thinner saddle so no rub. I know they do a narrow version.
Half decent shorts do the job, but more important lt its your underwear that neads to be lightweight.
I always thought that a normal pair of pants would do but too much material down there holds the sweat.
Also the less seams in your crotch the better, the seams rub. Change pants and socks at 12.00
Bib shorts probably do support better and more comfort, never tried them.
How will you eat when dark, carry food for this, and fill your pockets everytime you stop.
Where will you get water in dark, identify your sources, lakes etc, tablets for purification.
How will you see at night, no street lamps, good reliable very powerful lamp.
Where and how will you rest, gets cold when you stop, need clothes or mat and bivvy.
If you rely on shops and cafes you have to get there at time they are open and when you need them.
Have you a support vehicle :?:
Dont under estimate the amount of food you will need.
Your rests will need to be 20 mins long every 3hrs after 12 hrs and you need to close your eyes too :!:
Good Luck


Do not wear underwear under your shorts. Proper cycling shorts with a padded insert are designed to be worn next to the skin.
Cancer changes your outlook on life. Change yours before it changes you.

User avatar
beachcomber
Posts: 921
Joined: 17 Jan 2009, 10:49am
Location: North Yorks

Re: Long day ride advice - 240 miles

Postby beachcomber » 15 Jan 2013, 9:21am

The numbness you experienced may be due to the angle of your saddle. Perhaps the nose was too high. Good quality shorts should also make a difference.
I don't wear anything under shorts and as far as I know that is how it should be. Underpants have seams that rub and are less able to wick away sweat which can also lead to problems.
Chamois creme comes in many brands but Sudocream available from the chemist is my choice and the choice of many long distance riders.

Getting out of the saddle even for just a few pedal strokes can allow blood to flow to numb area so instead of changing down a gear when a slope is encountered just stand out of the saddle.

Why not visit Audax UK web site and enter a 400km ride.(approx 252 miles or so) That way you will have company and the route will already be planned to include cafes/garages which will be open 24hrs to allow refreshment and toilet stops. I realise that it will involve travelling from Skye but I'm sure it would be worth the effort.

As for shorts/saddle recommendations only you can tell what works for you. My audax rides are mainly ridden using a B17 that was perfect straight out of the box. I have other B17s that were like planks far an age.

I swapped my bike for audax in 2010. I rode using a Fizik Airone saddle in the early season. A couple of 200k events without problem, then a 300k and a 200k back to back. After that I replaced the Fizik with my tried and tested B17.

I splashed out on Assos shorts to ride long distance events but to be honest I don't find them vastly superior to other make shorts I use.

Other things to consider, You will be on the road for 20 or so hours. Lights will be neccessery as will clothing to keep you comfortable throughout the day and night. Somewhere to obtain food and drink so you don't have to carry it all with you. The need for toilet stops. Depending on your route the need to carry sufficient tools and spares to keep you going in the event of mechanical failure.(Also be able to make the neccessary repair)

Personally riding a solo 400k (250mile) ride can be tedious. I find the miles pass more easily when in good company.I don't usually sleep on a 400k, so chatting through the wee small hours helps keep me alert.

It isn't such a massive challenge, so just have a go at it. You have nothing to lose. :D

Ayesha
Posts: 4192
Joined: 30 Jan 2010, 9:54am

Re: Long day ride advice - 240 miles

Postby Ayesha » 15 Jan 2013, 9:51am

beachcomber wrote:The numbness you experienced may be due to the angle of your saddle. Perhaps the nose was too high. Good quality shorts should also make a difference.
I don't wear anything under shorts and as far as I know that is how it should be. Underpants have seams that rub and are less able to wick away sweat which can also lead to problems.
Chamois creme comes in many brands but Sudocream available from the chemist is my choice and the choice of many long distance riders.

Getting out of the saddle even for just a few pedal strokes can allow blood to flow to numb area so instead of changing down a gear when a slope is encountered just stand out of the saddle.

Why not visit Audax UK web site and enter a 400km ride.(approx 252 miles or so) That way you will have company and the route will already be planned to include cafes/garages which will be open 24hrs to allow refreshment and toilet stops. I realise that it will involve travelling from Skye but I'm sure it would be worth the effort.

As for shorts/saddle recommendations only you can tell what works for you. My audax rides are mainly ridden using a B17 that was perfect straight out of the box. I have other B17s that were like planks far an age.

I swapped my bike for audax in 2010. I rode using a Fizik Airone saddle in the early season. A couple of 200k events without problem, then a 300k and a 200k back to back. After that I replaced the Fizik with my tried and tested B17.

I splashed out on Assos shorts to ride long distance events but to be honest I don't find them vastly superior to other make shorts I use.

Other things to consider, You will be on the road for 20 or so hours. Lights will be neccessery as will clothing to keep you comfortable throughout the day and night. Somewhere to obtain food and drink so you don't have to carry it all with you. The need for toilet stops. Depending on your route the need to carry sufficient tools and spares to keep you going in the event of mechanical failure.(Also be able to make the neccessary repair)

Personally riding a solo 400k (250mile) ride can be tedious. I find the miles pass more easily when in good company.I don't usually sleep on a 400k, so chatting through the wee small hours helps keep me alert.

It isn't such a massive challenge, so just have a go at it. You have nothing to lose. :D


++1

Assos shorts. Most comfy.
Personally, bibs get in the way when going for a nature break behind a hedge.

Its a challenge of its own to carry 12,000 kCals of food on a 400 km. Plan the route between 24 hr shops, filling stns etc.

LollyKat
Posts: 2828
Joined: 28 May 2011, 11:25pm
Location: Scotland

Re: Long day ride advice - 240 miles

Postby LollyKat » 15 Jan 2013, 10:19am

On that route I'd be surprised if there are any 24-hr shops or filling stations, except at Inverness. But if OP does the ride in June he'll only need lights for a few hours :) .

User avatar
NATURAL ANKLING
Posts: 10186
Joined: 24 Oct 2012, 10:43pm
Location: English Riviera

Re: Long day ride advice - 240 miles

Postby NATURAL ANKLING » 15 Jan 2013, 11:06am

The Mechanic wrote:
NATURAL ANKLING wrote: but more important lt its your underwear

Do not wear underwear under your shorts. Proper cycling shorts with a padded insert are designed to be worn next to the skin.

Hi I thought this last night in bed :wink:
I did for some time not wear underwear, makes sense. I only have cheap shorts today.
I will retract the night time blues, in scotland of course in summer you can read a book at night. So the bonus is that lights on bike will be not so important to see with. Unless you already use pick me ups :?: Be careful. I.M.O.
If You Don't Try You Don't Do.....Don't Do You Don't Get...I'm Still Trying....Well Very..
You'll Find Me At The Top Of A Hill...............Somewhere...After Dark..

User avatar
NATURAL ANKLING
Posts: 10186
Joined: 24 Oct 2012, 10:43pm
Location: English Riviera

Re: Long day ride advice - 240 miles

Postby NATURAL ANKLING » 15 Jan 2013, 11:15am

Ayesha wrote:
beachcomber wrote:The numbness you experienced may be due to the angle of your saddle. Perhaps the nose was too high. Good quality shorts should also make a difference.
Other things to consider, You will be on the road for 20 or so hours. Lights will be neccessery as will clothing to keep you comfortable throughout the day and night. Somewhere to obtain food and drink so you don't have to carry it all with you. The need for toilet stops. Depending on your route the need to carry sufficient tools and spares to keep you going in the event of mechanical failure.(Also be able to make the neccessary repair)
Personally riding a solo 400k (250mile) ride can be tedious. I find the miles pass more easily when in good company.I don't usually sleep on a 400k, so chatting through the wee small hours helps keep me alert.
It isn't such a massive challenge, so just have a go at it. You have nothing to lose. :D


++1
Its a challenge of its own to carry 12,000 kCals of food on a 400 km. Plan the route between 24 hr shops, filling stns etc.

+++1
If You Don't Try You Don't Do.....Don't Do You Don't Get...I'm Still Trying....Well Very..
You'll Find Me At The Top Of A Hill...............Somewhere...After Dark..

thirdcrank
Posts: 28648
Joined: 9 Jan 2007, 2:44pm

Re: Long day ride advice - 240 miles

Postby thirdcrank » 15 Jan 2013, 12:03pm

I'll say don't worry. As you must know, we get posts from people wanting advice about long rides who have never ridden past the end of the street. You already know most of the general answers, such as getting in the miles will help finding the anwers for yourself ( a sort of circular argument, really.)

Having said that, 240 miles is quite some distance and I've only ridden further than that in one day when I was a daft teenager.

I'd suggest giving some thought to your timetable. Everybody is different, of course, but I'd consider a really early start - perhaps 2 or 3 am. In that way, you might expect to be riding the last bit during the evening - possibly the late evening. IME, the early hours when they arrive at the end of a waking day can be real killers because the bilogical time clocks are all switching into sleeping mode. It can be difficult to keep warm, the body gets sluggish and the mind can begin to wander.

How you plan breaks is very much a personal thing, but the mind still plays a big part. Some people benefit from dividing the task into chunks - stages, if you like - each to be tackled in turn. Concentrating on waypoints is total disaster for me.

Riding in company with one or more people of a similar standard with similar attitudes and goals must be one of the biggest aids to successful distance riding.

Ayesha
Posts: 4192
Joined: 30 Jan 2010, 9:54am

Re: Long day ride advice - 240 miles

Postby Ayesha » 15 Jan 2013, 12:38pm

If you can't get anyone to ride with you, invent some other riders en-route :D
Tell them all about why you're doing what you're doing,,,, :shock:

AndyB
Posts: 921
Joined: 21 Feb 2007, 12:24pm
Location: Lancashire

Re: Long day ride advice - 240 miles

Postby AndyB » 15 Jan 2013, 1:15pm

If comfort is an issue (and it will be), I'd be wary of dropping from 32 to 23 mm tyres. Whatever, make sure you've done enough on the new lightweight road bike to be sure you can sit on it for the required time - in many ways the more relaxed fit of a typical tourer is better then the normal 'road' bike. Lets face it, at the speeds you will be sustaining for 240 miles, the aerodynamic advantage of the typical low position on road bikes is negligible. I've only done one ride of this sort of distance, and that was on my tourer rather than my lighter 'faster' bike.