Ten Miles a Day

Commuting, Day rides, Audax, Incidents, etc.
Ayesha
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Re: Ten Miles a Day

Postby Ayesha » 31 Jul 2014, 12:29pm

I measured my 'Baseline' calorific expenditure on a chassis dynamometer in a controlled laboratory with my exhaled breath going into O2 and CO2 analysers.
Using the Carbohydrate / Oxygen formula, I could estimate the amount of CHO used during the exercise, and my Air/Fuel Ratio. ( I didn't need to shove a UEGO sensor up my jacksee ).
It came to between 45 and 50 kCals per mile along a flat road through still air ( simulated with a speed tracking fan ).
The equipment used cost more than a commercial HR monitor with kCals ‘hotch-potch’ calculation. :wink:

Ayesha
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Re: Ten Miles a Day

Postby Ayesha » 31 Jul 2014, 12:41pm

There’s another great big long thread on this forum which flogs kCals to death, so I’m not going to continue that subject on this thread.
25 kCals per km + 25 kCals for every 100m climbing, has got me through Audax for nineteen years.
However, Its NOT correct.
If it was diabolically wrong, I’d be dead. If it was moderately wrong, I would either gain or lose fat %.
Reality is it is slightly wrong and I maintain fat % without feeling depleted after 200 km.

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NATURAL ANKLING
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Re: Ten Miles a Day

Postby NATURAL ANKLING » 31 Jul 2014, 2:52pm

Hi,
We know that with a HR monitor it can be as much as 20 % out.
I was just pointing out that withOUT a HRM in the mix at all it could be far worse, comonly quoted as 40 % out and maybe even more.

I dont doubt for one minute that Ayesha does the miles and the effort.
I use mine as a comparitor from one ride to the next, and its interesting that when you have a bad time the heart rate can go up and hence the supposed energy kcals etc, goes up, but how can that be if you are the same or slower, so take care of reading kcals with minimum inputs.
NA Thinks Just End 2 End Return + Bivvy
You'll Still Find Me At The Top Of A Hill
Please forgive the poor Grammar I blame it on my mobile and phat thinkers.

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Mick F
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Re: Ten Miles a Day

Postby Mick F » 31 Jul 2014, 4:12pm

That was exactly my thought about HR.
I don't use it nowadays, and rely on my computer working it out from the GPX track.
As it happens, I have records of all my rides since I went to Garmins.

I have a favourite ride, and have done it exactly 49 times with a Garmin since Feb 2008.
30miles with 2,900ft of ascent.

Calories varied wildly with HR input. Highest 2,473 and lowest 1,634 with all levels in between. 41 rides with HR.
Since doing away with HR, the figure is much more constant. Highest 1,489 and lowest 1,428. 8 rides without HR.

Personally, I believe the "without HR" more than "with HR", as the computer works out the energy required to lift my bulk+bike up and down the hills at the speed I do it. It cannot vary very much.
Mick F. Cornwall

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easyroller
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Re: Ten Miles a Day

Postby easyroller » 31 Jul 2014, 5:26pm

Having just bought a powermeter (from a forum member, thanks!) apparently I can pretty accurately measure my calorie burn using data from that. Haven't delved into that yet as the number of calories I'm burning while riding isn't high on my list of things to know. Would be interesting, but I don't want it to tell me to eat less cake...

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NATURAL ANKLING
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Re: Ten Miles a Day

Postby NATURAL ANKLING » 31 Jul 2014, 5:32pm

Hi,
Think it would be a good idea to start another thread or resurect the old one on energy expenditure :?:

Miles a day...........its probably how you do it and that would depend on what you are aiming for / just pleasure................
NA Thinks Just End 2 End Return + Bivvy
You'll Still Find Me At The Top Of A Hill
Please forgive the poor Grammar I blame it on my mobile and phat thinkers.

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Mick F
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Re: Ten Miles a Day

Postby Mick F » 31 Jul 2014, 7:40pm

By the way, I've just started a new spreadsheet including feet per mile per day.
I'm aiming for 1,300 feet per day for 2014.

1,263ft so far.
I need even more hills. :D
Mick F. Cornwall

David_S
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Re: Ten Miles a Day

Postby David_S » 2 Aug 2014, 6:37pm

Mick F wrote:By the way, I've just started a new spreadsheet including feet per mile per day.
I'm aiming for 1,300 feet per day for 2014.

1,263ft so far.
I need even more hills. :D

Try moving away from the flat lands of Cornwall to a hilly area such as Lake District!!!!! :D

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Mick F
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Re: Ten Miles a Day

Postby Mick F » 2 Aug 2014, 7:49pm

:D :D

Only 14miles today.
Mind you, I had 1,900ft of ascent.
Is that hilly enough?
Mick F. Cornwall

David_S
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Re: Ten Miles a Day

Postby David_S » 3 Aug 2014, 2:08pm

Mick F wrote::D :D

Only 14miles today.
Mind you, I had 1,900ft of ascent.
Is that hilly enough?


It's getting there. Keep it up! :D

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Mick F
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Re: Ten Miles a Day

Postby Mick F » 3 Aug 2014, 4:59pm

:D :D
No riding today, but I went for a walk.
Just checking on my route ...... to the mini mart way up the hill (to buy cooking apples) and then down to the boozer (for beer!) then back home ..... back up the hill a bit.

Tracing my walk via bikehike.co.uk
500ft total ascent.
1.75miles

This gives 286ft per mile. :shock:
Good job I wasn't cycling. :lol:
Mick F. Cornwall

Ayesha
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Re: Ten Miles a Day

Postby Ayesha » 4 Aug 2014, 7:21am

A simple measure of one’s cycling trips is to count the Category 4, 3, 2, 1 & HC climbs one achieves.
Every 10 km of flat cycling will be 1 point. A Cat 4 will add 1 point to the ride total. A Cat 3 will add 2 points. A Cat 2 will add 3 points. A Cat 1 will add 6 points and a HC will add 10 points.

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[XAP]Bob
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Re: Ten Miles a Day

Postby [XAP]Bob » 4 Aug 2014, 11:07am

Ayesha wrote:A simple measure of one’s cycling trips is to count the Category 4, 3, 2, 1 & HC climbs one achieves.
Every 10 km of flat cycling will be 1 point. A Cat 4 will add 1 point to the ride total. A Cat 3 will add 2 points. A Cat 2 will add 3 points. A Cat 1 will add 6 points and a HC will add 10 points.

Now you need to define your categories....

There isn't a mathematical formula for them afaik
A shortcut has to be a challenge, otherwise it would just be the way. No situation is so dire that panic cannot make it worse.
There are two kinds of people in this world: those can extrapolate from incomplete data.

Ayesha
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Re: Ten Miles a Day

Postby Ayesha » 4 Aug 2014, 1:21pm

[XAP]Bob wrote:
Ayesha wrote:A simple measure of one’s cycling trips is to count the Category 4, 3, 2, 1 & HC climbs one achieves.
Every 10 km of flat cycling will be 1 point. A Cat 4 will add 1 point to the ride total. A Cat 3 will add 2 points. A Cat 2 will add 3 points. A Cat 1 will add 6 points and a HC will add 10 points.

Now you need to define your categories....

There isn't a mathematical formula for them afaik


It’s a weird Lookup Table where the % gradient is replaced by “Increase in effort”.

For example, instead of a 10% gradient, the axis has “110% effort”. This, I deduced, was IN ADDITION to effort on the flat.

The baseline datum is energy required to cover 10 km on the flat. The ‘effort’ multiplier is for the same speed ( 20 kmh ).
For example, up a 10% ( 110% effort ) gradient, the distance reads off at 0.909 km to be equivalent to 10 km along the flat.
Therefore, if a hill is 10% gradient for 1 km, it qualifies to be a Cat 4. Ala Ditchling Beacon.

A 5% gradient has ‘60% effort’. A 15% gradient has ‘160% effort’. Which tells me its an offset linear plot.

The next stage is to define the breakpoints for Cat 3, 2, 1 and HC.
Threshold for Cat 4 is 1x the effort of 10 km on the flat.
For Cat 3, its 1.66x. For Cat 2, its 3x, for Cat 1 its 6x and for HC, its 10x.

I’ve tried for fifteen years off and on to devise a calculation, but every time, gave up and reverted to the Lookup Table. Clear as mud.

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[XAP]Bob
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Re: Ten Miles a Day

Postby [XAP]Bob » 4 Aug 2014, 1:29pm

At least on t'Tour there is also a "does it come at the end of a stage" variable, and the "is it between two other massive lumps" or "after a rest stage" variance.

They probably don't shift by more than 1 cat in either direction though.

Do you have a link of this lookup table?
A shortcut has to be a challenge, otherwise it would just be the way. No situation is so dire that panic cannot make it worse.
There are two kinds of people in this world: those can extrapolate from incomplete data.