Stupid motorist on club run

[Mark1978]

One car is not a long queue, but pulling in *when it is safe* is still a reasonable thing to do - there is no requirement for that to be instant. On narrow enough roads that there isn't room to overtake (i.e. where the primary position is default) then there are inevitable passing places, so I'd wait for the next one.

Quite often a passing place is on the right, so I make it very obvious to a following car it's there by pointing at it, and making a 'come around' sweeping gesture. It still usually takes them a while to figure out what I'm saying.

But then most drivers are bad at single track, e.g. the number of times I've seen people pull into a passing place on their right..

[meic]

But then most drivers are bad at single track, e.g. the number of times I've seen people pull into a passing place on their right..

If I have met a larger vehicle than myself on the lanes, I will use the passing place so that they can have a straight run through rather than having to maneuver their vehicle around my car/bike.
If that passing place happens to be on the right and I have plenty of time to signal and get into it, then I will still use it.

[661-Pete]

For anyone who still thinks it is 'fair game' to hold up another road user unreasonably:

I can't help thinking of this guy...
...and see what happened to him!

The roads are there to be shared, and there's no such thing as 'losing face' by letting an idiot have his/her way...

[[XAP]Bob]

But what is unreasonable.

That's the crux of the matter. As a vehicle making progress there is no way that I am being unreasonable. I could very easily argue that unless there is room to overtake me safely (i.e. another lane) then the progress I am making is very likely reasonable for the road I'm on.

Maybe all cars should stop and let a queue of more than 5 cars pass them - even in rush hour. That is patently absurd. Maybe all cars should be in the gutter whenever they are in heavy traffic (that *would* be a good idea ) because they're holding everyone else up.

As a vehicle making decent progress I am not wilfully holding people up, if they can't overtake it's because there is either:
a) not enough room (i.e. no "other lane") OR
b) oncoming traffic (see a))

And frankly there's nothing I can really do about either.

[hubgearfreak]

But what is unreasonable.

getting frustrated and starting a thread over a minute's delay.

one time i drove my car, and loads of other people were also driving their cars, blocking MY way. infact, i think that's most times i drive my car. i can't be alone in this observation? but do we start threads every time it happens?

[661-Pete]

But what is unreasonable.

getting frustrated and starting a thread over a minute's delay.

Errr.... it wasn't the motorist who started the thread...

I had an interesting exercise in [not] getting frustrated today. Sort of psychological test, I suppose. This is nothing to do with cycling: today I chose to drive to work, having commuted by bike, Monday Tuesday and Wednesday, wore me out!

I had a rather off-day at work and decided (having got permission) to leave work early and work from home instead. On the way home, I got caught behind a white van which itself was following an L-driver which was wending its way along the twisty Sussex lanes at a steady 30mph. Now, these lanes are not built for speed, true, but I would guess speeds of up to 45-50mph are reasonable along parts of these roads (which I know well). But there I was caught behind this convoy for several miles. What I was thinking was, here is a situation to test my patience! I've just come away from a rare old set-to with people at work, can I contain myself and not shout, swear, or get angry and impatient, on the way home?

I think I succeeded. I stayed behind this convoy all the way without even raising a bead of sweat. I know people will think, "we've only got 661-P's word for this...", I'm asking you to believe what I'm saying, I stayed calm throughout the journey. Of course I wasn't in any hurry.

Discussing this with my wife this evening, she says, perhaps it's the sense of being in control of things when I'm driving (or, indeed, when I'm cycling) that calms me down. At work, when things are going wrong, I feel the sense of not being in control of things, then I start losing my rag.

If so, why does exactly the opposite happen to so many motorists? Psychologists on here, anyone?

[snibgo]

I'm no psychologist, but I reckon time is subjective.

A recent drive, about 35 miles, took nearly an hour. My car can easily do 60 mph so loads of things slowed me down, "wasting" about 20 minutes. I reckon they were:

- speed limits
- junctions, including roundabouts
- queues of motorists at junctions
- a single cyclist who delayed me by about 10 seconds.

The cyclist was in secondary position, on a road with 50 mph limit. With oncoming traffic I couldn't give him enough space to overtake, so I waited for a gap in the oncoming traffic. Some drivers would doubtless have squeezed past him. If there had been two cyclists abreast, drivers would be forced to wait for an oncoming gap.

I wasn't in a rush, and don't regularly drive anywhere, so the "waste" of 20 minutes didn't trouble me. If I did that journey twice a day, 250 days a year, it would trouble me.

If the cyclist (or multiple cyclists) had delayed me for a whole minute, it would have made no significant difference to my trip. But that minute would have seemed like a long time. If I wasn't a cyclist myself, it would have seemed like an eternity.

[Mark1978]

It's unbounded time. You don't know when the delay starts that it's going to be 30 seconds.

[reohn2]

Discussing this with my wife this evening, she says, perhaps it's the sense of being in control of things when I'm driving (or, indeed, when I'm cycling) that calms me down. At work, when things are going wrong, I feel the sense of not being in control of things, then I start losing my rag.

If so, why does exactly the opposite happen to so many motorists? Psychologists on here, anyone?

People,whatever they're doing,are not always in control.
The problems start when they want to be in control when they can't be.
This is exasperated when they feel that they should be in control of something or someone they see as being inferior, ie; L driver,cyclist,caravan,smaller person,lower rank,etc,etc.
The source is one of unreasonable selfishness,seeing themselves as more important than anyone else instead of seeing themselves as just a small part of the whole.
It's humbling to see one's self as just a small part,modern society doesn't do humble very well,as it sees it,erroneously,as weakness,no one wants to be seen as weak.
Such an attitude is prevalent in UK society and more so on the roads.
My 2d's worth

EDIT:- There's a 2mile long twisty country lane,near to me at the end of which there's a double set of TL's,after 4.30pm on weekdays there's always atleast a 500m line of traffic waiting for the TL,it's a main commuting route.
The overtakes I've had when cycling on that stretch at that time of day are plain bonkers.
I protect myself by riding primary where appropriate and the number of drivers I've had words with when I caught them up as they've sat in the inevitable jam at the TL has been numerous,they never seem to understand that they haven't got anywhere by their stupid driving.I recently even had a chap in a big white Range Rover boot it past me whilst I was travelling at 20mph in primary even though I was 100m from the back of the stationary jam,only for me to overtake him and the rest of the jam.
The psychology with this small though significant element of drivers,is one of perceived power,however stupid and unreasonable.
They are powerless and they know it,so there has to be some kind of small victory won so they don't feel so bad about themselves in the face of lesser vehicles.

[hubgearfreak]

I recently even had a chap in a big white Range Rover boot it past me whilst I was travelling at 20mph in primary even though I was 100m from the back of the stationary jam,only for me to overtake him and the rest of the jam.
The psychology with this small though significant element of drivers,is one of perceived power,however stupid and unreasonable.

you may be right, or maybe he's not got the abilities/skill to read the road 100m ahead? i get it at least once a week, where they overtake stupidly and pointlessly, even 50m from a queue of stopped cars. solid white lines, zigzags are no deterrent either

[drossall]

...when I caught them up as they've sat in the inevitable jam at the TL...

Some drivers love traffic jams. If they can see one up the road, they will take enormous risks to spend longer in it.

[cycrow]

Some drivers can just be impatient and lose all common sense when they see a bike on the rode.

one time when i was on my bike i had a bus driver behind me trying to get past even thou there was no room. Constantly beeping his horn behind me and waving at me to move.
The worst part was when it came within inches of my back wheel.

Not sure what he expected me to do thou, was going over a narrow bridge at the time, the only way for me to move out the way to let him past was to jump into the river below, which i wasn't prepared to do.

its not like i was even holding him up, the speed limit of the road was 20, and i was travelling about 22, and there was even a car right infront of me as well, so if he got past me there would be no where he could go anyways

[aprildavy]

You can (in a car) get stuck behind a tractor for 5 miles or so, most drivers don't throw their hands up in horror, but it makes sense to pull over and let other road users pass if you are holding up the other traffic, as tractors normally will when they can. I have no hesitation in doing this if it is an artic with and oversize trailer- I could insist on my rights to use the road...