The Badge of Honour: Overtaking beyond the speed limit?

Commuting, Day rides, Audax, Incidents, etc.
ChrisButch
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Re: The Badge of Honour: Overtaking beyond the speed limit?

Postby ChrisButch » 25 Mar 2014, 9:11am

Vorpal wrote:IMO, the tractors themselves are less of a problem than the trailers they pull. The braking systems on agricultural trailers are largely inadequate, and poorly regulated.


I made exactly that point in my submission to the consultation.Trailers have increased in size and weight in proportion with the tractors. Moreover the combination can be driven on the roads by 16-year-olds.

I was going to attach Roy Russell's draft CTC submissions on the tractor consultation (max road speed and weight) , but the forum doesn't seem to allow attachments. As I mentioned, I don't know what's happened about this consultation.

pstallwood
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Re: The Badge of Honour: Overtaking beyond the speed limit?

Postby pstallwood » 25 Mar 2014, 9:24am

661-Pete wrote:
jezer wrote:
pstallwood wrote:Agricultural vehicles have a nil VED.

What is more, they're allowed to run on red diesel, I believe.


See here re red diesel use for agricultural vehicles:-

http://www.fwi.co.uk/articles/10/02/201 ... -rules.htm

Pleasure boats cannot use red diesel for propulsion but can for domestic purposes:-

http://www.britishmarine.co.uk/what_we_ ... iesel.aspx

Fridges in lorries using a diesel generator to power the fridge can also use red diesel.

We used to send our agricultural vehicles through/over the Dartford Crossing as we had some land in Essex with the main farm being in Kent- bet that would have caused some interesting comments - especially the big sprayer that was technically too wide unless it had an escort, it was only stopped once in all the dozens of times it went across the Thames.

Peter

MikeF
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Re: The Badge of Honour: Overtaking beyond the speed limit?

Postby MikeF » 25 Mar 2014, 10:34am

Strider42 wrote:I've just come back from a very pleasant, though cold, ride. On my way back into the city I noticed something unsettling that I haven't experienced for quite some time. I was sitting comfortably on a down-hill section at the speed limit (varying between 30mph and 20mph) and yet all the motor vehicles, excepting a lorry, were insistent on overtaking me and cutting into the lane. While the overtakes were 'safe' - excluding the exceeding the speed limit element - , I noticed that they slowed back down to within the speed limit almost immediately. I was wondering if this is a common phenomenon?

Is there some badge of honour that must be gained by overtaking any vehicle with only two wheels?

With some drivers it seems there is. After all it is a speed target - isn't it? :shock:
I think because 20mph areas are "zoned" usually without repeaters, some drivers assume they are in a 30mph limit - which in real terms means 35mph for them, which is considerably faster than most cyclists.
On the plus side, at least you thought the overtakes were "safe".
"It takes a genius to spot the obvious" - my old physics master

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661-Pete
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Re: The Badge of Honour: Overtaking beyond the speed limit?

Postby 661-Pete » 25 Mar 2014, 11:52am

MikeF wrote:I think because 20mph areas are "zoned" usually without repeaters, some drivers assume they are in a 30mph limit
In our area, the message is reinforced by white "20"s painted on the road surface at frequent intervals. No driver can have any excuse for not knowing.
Suppose that this room is a lift. The support breaks and down we go with ever-increasing velocity.
Let us pass the time by performing physical experiments...
--- Arthur Eddington (creator of the Eddington Number).

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Redvee
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Re: The Badge of Honour: Overtaking beyond the speed limit?

Postby Redvee » 25 Mar 2014, 12:04pm

661-Pete wrote:
MikeF wrote:I think because 20mph areas are "zoned" usually without repeaters, some drivers assume they are in a 30mph limit
In our area, the message is reinforced by white "20"s painted on the road surface at frequent intervals. No driver can have any excuse for not knowing.


They still try to pass though. I was riding along at 21mph in a 20 zone outside a school in primary position when a car passed then came the left hand pointing to the gutter etc then the driver had to make a drastic change in direction to avoid hitting the pavement.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=fnISI_rThz0

Ayesha
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Re: The Badge of Honour: Overtaking beyond the speed limit?

Postby Ayesha » 25 Mar 2014, 12:18pm

What would you prefer? Two small tractors towing two small trailers, or one large tractor towing a trailer twice the size, producing 75% of the emissions of the two smaller tractors?

Postboxer
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Re: The Badge of Honour: Overtaking beyond the speed limit?

Postby Postboxer » 25 Mar 2014, 12:25pm

Plus all of your food costing more.

Bicycler
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Re: The Badge of Honour: Overtaking beyond the speed limit?

Postby Bicycler » 25 Mar 2014, 12:52pm

MikeF wrote:I think because 20mph areas are "zoned" usually without repeaters, some drivers assume they are in a 30mph limit

Does anybody know if this is actually the case legally? Round here the local council have been diligently putting repeaters every few yards along even the most minor of residential streets which are now 20mph. As far as I'm aware repeaters have to be used unless one of the national speed limits (30, 60, 70) applies.

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[XAP]Bob
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Re: The Badge of Honour: Overtaking beyond the speed limit?

Postby [XAP]Bob » 25 Mar 2014, 2:00pm

Ayesha wrote:What would you prefer? Two small tractors towing two small trailers, or one large tractor towing a trailer twice the size, producing 75% of the emissions of the two smaller tractors?

One, driven by someone who can actually see what they are doing, and behaves rationally
A shortcut has to be a challenge, otherwise it would just be the way. No situation is so dire that panic cannot make it worse.
There are two kinds of people in this world: those can extrapolate from incomplete data.

Bicycler
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Re: The Badge of Honour: Overtaking beyond the speed limit?

Postby Bicycler » 25 Mar 2014, 2:41pm

[XAP]Bob wrote:
Ayesha wrote:What would you prefer? Two small tractors towing two small trailers, or one large tractor towing a trailer twice the size, producing 75% of the emissions of the two smaller tractors?

One, driven by someone who can actually see what they are doing, and behaves rationally

Provided that bigger tractor/trailer doesn't cause more danger to others because of the narrowness of local lanes

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jezer
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Re: The Badge of Honour: Overtaking beyond the speed limit?

Postby jezer » 25 Mar 2014, 4:30pm

Some of our club rides go into the Cotswolds, a lovely area to cycle in. We are often in and around Tetbury, famous for the domain of a certain well known land owner. We do encounter very large tractors on narrow lanes, sometimes driven at quite high speeds by youngsters whilst using their mobile phones. Of course I can't accuse anyone directly, but special privileges do spring to mind :?
Power to the pedals

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661-Pete
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Re: The Badge of Honour: Overtaking beyond the speed limit?

Postby 661-Pete » 25 Mar 2014, 5:16pm

jezer wrote:Some of our club rides go into the Cotswolds, a lovely area to cycle in. We are often in and around Tetbury, famous for the domain of a certain well known land owner. We do encounter very large tractors on narrow lanes, sometimes driven at quite high speeds by youngsters whilst using their mobile phones. Of course I can't accuse anyone directly, but special privileges do spring to mind :?

Aha! Your allusion to a 'well known land owner' (who, I'm sure, is quite innocent of the wrongdoings of local youngsters - I have to say that or I'll be locked in the Tower) puts me in mind of another well known - but far more infamous - landowner who haunts a considerable area of our part of Sussex.

He too aspires to membership of the elite: at least, he is constructing (and has been for the past 30 years) his very own palace to lord it in - both alive and dead. Not easy to spot from any public road, you can just see it in this street view, over to the right of the road with its golden dome.

I have cycled past there a few times - albeit somewhat nervously.

Knowing of the reputation of this individual (whom I need not name, perhaps) - I'd certainly not care to encounter him or any of his henchmen at the wheel of a tractor - or any other vehicle. Luckily he's fairly reclusive - when not doing time in prison...
Suppose that this room is a lift. The support breaks and down we go with ever-increasing velocity.
Let us pass the time by performing physical experiments...
--- Arthur Eddington (creator of the Eddington Number).

ChrisButch
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Re: The Badge of Honour: Overtaking beyond the speed limit?

Postby ChrisButch » 25 Mar 2014, 9:23pm

Ayesha wrote:What would you prefer? Two small tractors towing two small trailers, or one large tractor towing a trailer twice the size, producing 75% of the emissions of the two smaller tractors?

Tractor size is driven by labour costs. The bigger the tractor, the more output per driver hour and the greater the productivity. This may all soon change with on-farm technology which is just around the corner. Robot field machines, GPS linked, already exist as prototypes and are being widely tested. With a robot tractor/plough etc the labour cost equation changes radically, as there's no technical reason why it couldn't keep working 24/7. There could therefore be a much smaller machine (or several even smaller ones) completing the same field operation in as short a period as a large tractor and driver.
Getting a harvested crop back to the farm could be interesting, however....

stoobs
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Re: The Badge of Honour: Overtaking beyond the speed limit?

Postby stoobs » 30 Mar 2014, 3:16pm

661-Pete wrote:
jezer wrote:Some of our club rides go into the Cotswolds, a lovely area to cycle in. We are often in and around Tetbury, famous for the domain of a certain well known land owner. We do encounter very large tractors on narrow lanes, sometimes driven at quite high speeds by youngsters whilst using their mobile phones. Of course I can't accuse anyone directly, but special privileges do spring to mind :?

Aha! Your allusion to a 'well known land owner' (who, I'm sure, is quite innocent of the wrongdoings of local youngsters - I have to say that or I'll be locked in the Tower) puts me in mind of another well known - but far more infamous - landowner who haunts a considerable area of our part of Sussex.

He too aspires to membership of the elite: at least, he is constructing (and has been for the past 30 years) his very own palace to lord it in - both alive and dead. Not easy to spot from any public road, you can just see it in this street view, over to the right of the road with its golden dome.

I have cycled past there a few times - albeit somewhat nervously.

Knowing of the reputation of this individual (whom I need not name, perhaps) - I'd certainly not care to encounter him or any of his henchmen at the wheel of a tractor - or any other vehicle. Luckily he's fairly reclusive - when not doing time in prison...


Knickerless of the High Street? Who would think of a name like that? He's more of a pleb than the people he wrongly accuses of being so who have a historic right to walk across his land.

MikeF
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Re: The Badge of Honour: Overtaking beyond the speed limit?

Postby MikeF » 30 Mar 2014, 5:01pm

Bicycler wrote:
MikeF wrote:I think because 20mph areas are "zoned" usually without repeaters, some drivers assume they are in a 30mph limit

Does anybody know if this is actually the case legally? Round here the local council have been diligently putting repeaters every few yards along even the most minor of residential streets which are now 20mph. As far as I'm aware repeaters have to be used unless one of the national speed limits (30, 60, 70) applies.
Difference explained here, presumably correctly.
"It takes a genius to spot the obvious" - my old physics master