Clipping and running

Commuting, Day rides, Audax, Incidents, etc.
maxcherry
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Joined: 22 Mar 2011, 5:53pm

Clipping and running

Postby maxcherry » 8 Oct 2014, 2:56pm

Having a polite (cough*) discussion as who is to blame for this accident. I say that it is the cyclist behind, but the chap
in front does not come out looking very honest.

Honestly chaps, I'm a female!

Postboxer
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Joined: 24 Jul 2013, 5:19pm

Re: Clipping and running

Postby Postboxer » 8 Oct 2014, 5:06pm

I have very little experience of group riding, but I would say the guy in front is at fault, as he's the one who moves, it's up to him to make sure there's room, he knew someone was there, just because he'd waved an arm doesn't give him the right to swerve into the other guy, taking down at least three riders.

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[XAP]Bob
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Re: Clipping and running

Postby [XAP]Bob » 8 Oct 2014, 7:22pm

Guy in front at fault - I was waiting for the camera bike to clip a wheel.

Although he indicated there simply wasn't enough room, despite the guy behind (who had been drafting OK for a while) falling back for him.

Very sudden motion
A shortcut has to be a challenge, otherwise it would just be the way. No situation is so dire that panic cannot make it worse.
There are two kinds of people in this world: those can extrapolate from incomplete data.

SteveHunter
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Re: Clipping and running

Postby SteveHunter » 8 Oct 2014, 7:42pm

The guy in front is at fault.

Bicycler
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Re: Clipping and running

Postby Bicycler » 8 Oct 2014, 7:46pm

Agreed, if blame has to be attributed then that is where it lies. Though it is one of those cases where the person behind could have anticipated the movement after seeing the signal. A bit like a car indicator - once it is on expect the vehicle to start drifting :shock:

Gearoidmuar
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Location: Cork, Ireland. Corcaigh, Éire má tá Gaeilge agat.

Re: Clipping and running

Postby Gearoidmuar » 9 Oct 2014, 7:08am

Chap in front is totally at fault.

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[XAP]Bob
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Re: Clipping and running

Postby [XAP]Bob » 9 Oct 2014, 9:57am

Bicycler wrote:Agreed, if blame has to be attributed then that is where it lies. Though it is one of those cases where the person behind could have anticipated the movement after seeing the signal. A bit like a car indicator - once it is on expect the vehicle to start drifting :shock:


They did, and they started to leave room - but then the bloke just swiped across pretty suddenly and without a second check.
A shortcut has to be a challenge, otherwise it would just be the way. No situation is so dire that panic cannot make it worse.
There are two kinds of people in this world: those can extrapolate from incomplete data.

Postboxer
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Joined: 24 Jul 2013, 5:19pm

Re: Clipping and running

Postby Postboxer » 9 Oct 2014, 1:25pm

I think maybe the guy behind left a bit of a gap, expecting the guy in front to slowly drift across into it, instead he makes a sudden movement, which in theory, means he travels further than if he slowly drifted across, so although the guy behind was maybe actually behind and going the same speed to begin with, due to the extra distance travelled across the road, the collision occurred. Does this make sense? Also, if it is the guy behind shouting 'go ahead' it still doesn't mean it's his fault.

It's scary how many people fall though given that they seem fairly spaced out.

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[XAP]Bob
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Re: Clipping and running

Postby [XAP]Bob » 9 Oct 2014, 8:31pm

Riding round wales last month I didn't take a corner because I coyld see that the people following wouldn't have been able to deal with it. We all made the corner (mostly safely - quite a few locked wheels) but I was basically parked at the outside until the group had overshot, since any other action would have resulted in multiple pile up.


It's not that hard to work out what is around you.... is it?
A shortcut has to be a challenge, otherwise it would just be the way. No situation is so dire that panic cannot make it worse.
There are two kinds of people in this world: those can extrapolate from incomplete data.

PaulSB
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Joined: 23 Mar 2010, 8:50pm

Re: Clipping and running

Postby PaulSB » 10 Oct 2014, 9:01am

Guy in front 100%

maxcherry
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Re: Clipping and running

Postby maxcherry » 10 Oct 2014, 9:33am

Thank you for explaining. Good job I am not a judge.
Honestly chaps, I'm a female!

Tonyf33
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Joined: 17 Nov 2007, 3:31pm
Location: Letchworth N.Herts

Re: Clipping and running

Postby Tonyf33 » 11 Oct 2014, 12:50pm

Please explain why in the context of the rules this is 100% the guy in fronts fault?
the guy stuck his arm out AND gave an auidble warning of his intention, and yes that doesn't give him priority and yes he moved over without checking over his shoulder.

That said the chap behind ignored his signal in reality, did not brake, did not adjust his own position & did NOT give him enough space when there WAS ample time (he stopped pedalling if you look), two wrongs don't make a right.
What if the guy in front had hit an obstacle or had to swiftly swerve to avoid something..what then?
the rider behind had ample opportunity to brake and move to the inside..50/50 if you ask me

gplhl
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Re: Clipping and running

Postby gplhl » 11 Oct 2014, 4:26pm

The guy in front. Although the group riding looks poor, they are not staying in formation. The guy who comes off keeps pedalling then stopping pedalling (coming forward, then dropping off) instead of keeping a smooth pedalling action. However, this still does not make the accident his fault. Before changing course a rider should always without fail make sure it's safe and that he's not going to cause others problems. After all they weren't in a bunch sprint!

Gary
www.longbikeride.co.uk

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[XAP]Bob
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Re: Clipping and running

Postby [XAP]Bob » 11 Oct 2014, 4:53pm

He did start to slow, as you say he stopped pedalling.

The person in front then made a ferociously abrupt move
A shortcut has to be a challenge, otherwise it would just be the way. No situation is so dire that panic cannot make it worse.
There are two kinds of people in this world: those can extrapolate from incomplete data.

velotrev
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Joined: 30 Apr 2009, 3:16pm

Re: Clipping and running

Postby velotrev » 11 Oct 2014, 5:25pm

I have just added the link to this clip for our next club newsletter.... the tag being..a good illustration that you should never make sudden manouvres when riding in a close line/group!!