Shoreham air crash

[TonyR]

The Times is reporting this morning that two of the dead in the Shoreham air crash were cyclists.

[Bonefishblues]

I saw that on other Forums, too.

[Lance Dopestrong]

Jeez, what an awful way to go

[TonyR]

I often go to watch the air displays from a road at the back of a local airfield. A few years ago one of the planes crashed while I was watching and I still have unsettled moments even now from the sound a plane makes as its pulling out of a dive.

[firedfromthecircus]

I'm not a fan of airshows for a number of reasons, but I'll just park that for a moment.
The thing I don't understand is why planes are allowed to do dangerous acrobatics outside of the airfield space. If a plane crashes in an airfield then that is tragic and any loss of life would be sad, but there is a level of risk associated with these things and hopefully the people involved understand this before they attend. But trying a loop the loop when the fail zone is a major public road, or a village or town or even hamlet just seems incredible!

[al_yrpal]

It horrifies me, I used to cycle to the fence at North Weald in the 50s to watch the Hunters. One of my best friends was killed two years ago learning to fly a new type of microlight. And, my son recently got his PPL.

Al

[Mick F]

http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-england-sussex-34029764

[TonyR]

I'm not a fan of airshows for a number of reasons, but I'll just park that for a moment.
The thing I don't understand is why planes are allowed to do dangerous acrobatics outside of the airfield space. If a plane crashes in an airfield then that is tragic and any loss of life would be sad, but there is a level of risk associated with these things and hopefully the people involved understand this before they attend. But trying a loop the loop when the fail zone is a major public road, or a village or town or even hamlet just seems incredible!

Because airfields are typically too small to contain the aircraft manoeuvres within their boundaries.

[Brucey]

anytime you are near an airfield there is a significantly increased chance that a plane will 'land' on you. The vast majority of normal air crashes occur when take off or landing goes wrong.

Near me there is a large airfield with a motorway at one end of the runway. The motorway has been blocked several times when things have gone wrong.

These days airshows use a different protocol for aerobatic manoeuvres over the airfield itself, which is designed to very much reduce the risk to the paying public. An unintended consequence of this is that if a plane goes down, it is more likely to go down someplace else, and anyone in the near vicinity is perhaps in more danger.

So it is best to watch airshows either close-up, or far away, using binoculars perhaps. Places to avoid would be the ends of the runway and a three-quarter-mile radius of there. It is dreadful that bystanders were killed in this crash, and it does bring into question the whole idea of such airshows. Mind you, they are very popular and if there was no danger at all then maybe they wouldn't be?

FWIW I suspect that the pilot may have had a medical emergency of some kind or he honestly believed (right up to the last moment) that he wasn't going to crash as he did; were it otherwise I would suppose that he would have punched out.

cheers

[beardy]

were it otherwise I would suppose that he would have punched out.

Doesnt the Hunter pre-date the "zero-zero" seats? Ejection without such a seat would not have helped.

[Bonefishblues]

anytime you are near an airfield there is a significantly increased chance that a plane will 'land' on you. The vast majority of normal air crashes occur when take off or landing goes wrong.

Near me there is a large airfield with a motorway at one end of the runway. The motorway has been blocked several times when things have gone wrong.

These days airshows use a different protocol for aerobatic manoeuvres over the airfield itself, which is designed to very much reduce the risk to the paying public. An unintended consequence of this is that if a plane goes down, it is more likely to go down someplace else, and anyone in the near vicinity is perhaps in more danger.

So it is best to watch airshows either close-up, or far away, using binoculars perhaps. Places to avoid would be the ends of the runway and a three-quarter-mile radius of there. It is dreadful that bystanders were killed in this crash, and it does bring into question the whole idea of such airshows. Mind you, they are very popular and if there was no danger at all then maybe they wouldn't be?

FWIW I suspect that the pilot may have had a medical emergency of some kind or he honestly believed (right up to the last moment) that he wasn't going to crash as he did; were it otherwise I would suppose that he would have punched out.

cheers

The last time civilians were killed at an airshow was in 1952 in the Farnboro' air disaster. For the general public they are typically very safe whether on field or off (although of course not yesterday )

[Brucey]

were it otherwise I would suppose that he would have punched out.

Doesnt the Hunter pre-date the "zero-zero" seats? Ejection without such a seat would not have helped.

As I understand it the plane (WV372) was a T7 variant and should have been fitted with a MB Mk4HA seat, which ought (if armed) to be operable at ground level?

cheers

[Bonefishblues]

were it otherwise I would suppose that he would have punched out.

Doesnt the Hunter pre-date the "zero-zero" seats? Ejection without such a seat would not have helped.

As I understand it the plane (WV372) was a T7 variant and should have been fitted with a MB Mk4HA seat, which ought (if armed) to be operable at ground level?

cheers

Aiui routinely disabled on civilian planes (reading elsewhere).

[Brucey]

ah, disarmed.... that would make ejection difficult!

cheers

[TonyR]

FWIW I suspect that the pilot may have had a medical emergency of some kind or he honestly believed (right up to the last moment) that he wasn't going to crash as he did; were it otherwise I would suppose that he would have punched out.

Its quite normal for pilots to stay with their plane while they still have some control to try and steer it clear of people when it crashes. I suspect that is much more likely than a medical emergency. The highest probability is pilot error followed much further down by aircraft failure.