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RULES for posting about EVENTS ( charity or otherwise )

Posted: 24 Nov 2014, 9:16am
by Vorpal
Eligibility for posting an event
=======================
To post about an event on this forum please contact forum staff, in order to prove one or more of the following:
- that the (charity) ride is already advertised through Cycling UK formal channels. e.g. Cycle Magazine ; website : other . . . .
- that you are a representative of a Cycling UK Group
- that you are posting about a Cycling UK and/or Cyclenation event
- that you are an established Cycling UK Forum contributor
- that you are posting on behalf of a nonprofit bike hub or cycling oriented community enterprise

If you are a first time user, submitting a post about an eligible event, please include pertinent information in your first post (for example, that you advertise in Cycle), if it isn't already clear from the title.

Re: Rules for posting about events

Posted: 24 Nov 2014, 9:51am
by beardy
This is only for events with an entry fee, isnt it?

Those that are doing it for profit reasons, whether openly or deceitfully.

If it is a non CTC ride that isnt for money, does that still need approval?

How about Audaxes (those which do have a fee but seldom are for making money) which are not run by a CTC club?

Re: Rules for posting about events

Posted: 24 Nov 2014, 10:19am
by mjr
I think if it's from an organisation that CTC has strong links with, such as Audax UK or Cyclenation, then it should be allowed (but I would say that, wouldn't I?)

Re: Rules for posting about events

Posted: 24 Nov 2014, 10:44am
by Vorpal
Established contributors may still post events that may be of interest to forumites.

However, I have added Cyclenation. 8)

Re: Rules for posting about events

Posted: 27 Nov 2014, 11:37am
by bikepete
Would it be OK for me to continue to post updates about the York Rally? It is not now a CTC-run event, but it is being run by a purely volunteer committee. And given the CTC's long history with the event we are keen to see many CTC members, local groups and of course the national CTC at the Knavesmire next year. Entry will be free, including the trade show. FWIW Dan Joyce did kindly also feature the revival of the Rally in the CTC magazine a few issues ago:

Image

TIA - feel free to PM or email me (publicity@yorkrally.org) if you wish to discuss.

Peter Eland
Publicity Officer
York Rally Committee

Re: Rules for posting about events

Posted: 27 Nov 2014, 12:31pm
by Vorpal
bikepete wrote:Would it be OK for me to continue to post updates about the York Rally?

Of course. The rules have actually been in place for some time, now. They just disappeared when the Charity rides section was eliminated.

Re: Rules for posting about events

Posted: 27 Nov 2014, 12:39pm
by bikepete
Many thanks :-)

Re: Rules for posting about events

Posted: 27 Nov 2014, 12:59pm
by Psamathe
I am confused to to why these imitations are being imposed. Given that the CTC Strategy (2012-2020) aims include:
    We inspire people to cycle
    We promote cycling
I would have thought the more word about an event is circulated the better and that such promotion would be in line with CTC strategy. Note that the strategy does not refer to "only for CTC events".

From the same strategy
As the national cycling charity we will reach over 100,000 members and serve the interests of cycling and cyclists throughout the four nations of the UK.
Note how it says "serve in the interests of cycling and cyclists" - nothing limiting it to "members only".

Again, from the same strategy
We will be widely regarded as the leading organisation bringing people to cycling and removing barriers to diverse groups of potential cyclists.

Allowing non-CTC organisations to promote their events on this forum is one way to help achieve this strategy. Letting people know about events (even non-CTC related events) can only help encourage people.

So, the limits on events that can be promoted here strike me as being contrary to the CTC strategy.

Ian

Re: Rules for posting about events

Posted: 27 Nov 2014, 1:18pm
by Si
We did go into this in some depth but as vorpal says, the discussion is in the bit that isn't there any more. And, as you can probably imagine, views ranged wildly.

The issue partly stemmed from the fact that a lot of these 'charity' events were commonly viewed as just being cycling holidays where there was a charity element tacked on to encourage people to select that particular company's offering. Likewise, there was a well publicised charity sportive where the actual amount that appeared to go to charity was very small compared to what the organisers were making out of it.....people suggested that the organisers of such events were being a bit cynical.

There was also the argument that cycling should be portrayed as a normal day-to-day activity rather than a special one-off challenge event that required all sorts of special training and organisation, etc.

And also there were a few 'discussions' about those events that had mandatory h*lm*t rules.

Plus, a number of charities pay the CTC to advertise in its magazine, just as the CTC (a charity) pays to advertise it self elsewhere. So why should we give other charities free air time here? And why should those that contribute to the magazine continue to do so if they can advertise for free here instead. We did point out that any charity that has paid for space in the magazine is allowed to advertise via the forum....as long as they talk to the forum staff about it first.

Anyway.....these are my recollections of some of the arguments - but not necessarily, I hasten to add, my own opinions.

Re: Rules for posting about events

Posted: 27 Nov 2014, 1:32pm
by Psamathe
Si wrote:The issue partly stemmed from the fact that a lot of these 'charity' events were commonly viewed as just being cycling holidays where there was a charity element tacked on to encourage people to select that particular company's offering. Likewise, there was a well publicised charity sportive where the actual amount that appeared to go to charity was very small compared to what the organisers were making out of it.....people suggested that the organisers of such events were being a bit cynical.

Make it a rule for 'charity' events being promoted that what is posted on the forum clearly states the charities and the way the income/profits are being divided.

Si wrote:There was also the argument that cycling should be portrayed as a normal day-to-day activity rather than a special one-off challenge event that required all sorts of special training and organisation, etc.

Then shuld the CTC be promoting any such events ? If the CTC promote them, then how can their forum have a contrary policy ?

Si wrote:Plus, a number of charities pay the CTC to advertise in its magazine, just as the CTC (a charity) pays to advertise it self elsewhere. So why should we give other charities free air time here? And why should those that contribute to the magazine continue to do so if they can advertise for free here instead. We did point out that any charity that has paid for space in the magazine is allowed to advertise via the forum....as long as they talk to the forum staff about it first.

Adverts in the magazine will probably reach a wider audience. But the CTC have a strategy. Commercial advertising revenues seem to be taking higher priority than the strategy. Is this the way a charitable organisation should operate: profit before achieving their aims ?

But it is not a massive issue I want to argue against (as I've pretty well given up on the CTC as an organisation). It was just strange how the CTC's forum was not working to help the CTC achieve its strategy.

Ian

Re: Rules for posting about events

Posted: 27 Nov 2014, 1:35pm
by Si
Make it a rule for 'charity' events being promoted that what is posted on the forum clearly states the charities and the way the income/profits are being divided.


We did. Most of them were just blatting their adverts around the net so just cut'n'pasted into our forum with out any heed to the rules. Thus we get to another reason why we got rid of them....they were causing the volunteer forum staff too much wasted time trying to get the advertisers to amend their posts to put this info in....a good number couldn't be bothered anyway even after our requests.

Re: Rules for posting about events

Posted: 27 Nov 2014, 7:52pm
by gaz
Rules of the "Charity Rides / Not-for-profit organised rides" board were last updated June 2013. I can't find that one but the Jan 2011 edition was:

Graham wrote:In view of the number of events being posted that require significant sums of money to participate, here is a reminder of the forum rules.

The CTC Forum invites/permits the posting of Charity / Not-for-profit rides and events.

It does NOT permit the posting of commercial events ( i.e. with a non-trivial profit motive ).

Costs / Fees / Donations
Where there is a significant entry cost/fee/contribution please be explicit about that cost.

Please also openly state the percentage or money-value of the :-
-- charitable donation
-- running cost
-- any profit element
-- any other cost element that is outside the above categories

Helmets
Please state clearly whether there is an obligation to wear a helmet ( or not ).

Viewers
If you have any comment or concerns about something posted on these boards, please report it using the "report-this-post" button.


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I do recall the introduction of further rules requiring the Event to have some connection to the CTC or to an established forum member. This was open to some degree of interpretation, some "established forum members" had simply been posting their annual Charity ride details over a number of years and making no other contribution.

IIRC sometime in 2013 the entire board was locked, presumably to ensure that posters approached the moderation team first. The board had disappeared completely by 11 May 2014 although it's departure went largely unremarked.

Re: Rules for posting about events

Posted: 27 Nov 2014, 7:55pm
by gaz
It may be worth adding that I'd expected a sudden influx of Charity Ride posts to the event boards but I didn't see it materialise, perhaps thanks to the work of the mods.

The CTC website invites free advertising of charity rides on the forum.

For free advertising for your charity ride, why not try our forum? It is visited by many thousands of cyclists every year looking for somewhere to ride and someone to ride with.


The link now goes to the "Women's cycling interests" board which took the board number of the previous "Charity Rides" board.

Re: Rules for posting about events

Posted: 22 Dec 2014, 9:02pm
by Graham
Gaz,
Thanks for bringing this to our attention.

I have notified this conflict of intention to Matt Mallinder.

Re: Rules for posting about events

Posted: 2 Feb 2015, 8:27pm
by Graham
2nd attempt to get this conflict resolved -
Hi Matt,

Please be aware of the conflict between this statement on the main website and the forum rules for posting charity events.

Main
For free advertising for your charity ride, why not try our forum? It is visited by many thousands of cyclists every year looking for somewhere to ride and someone to ride with.
Forum


Forum Rules for posting about events
Postby Vorpal ยป Mon Nov 24, 2014 9:16 am

Eligibility for posting an event
=======================
To post about an event on this forum please contact forum staff, in order to prove one or more of the following:
- that the charity ride is already advertised through CTC formal channels. e.g. Cycle Magazine ; website : other . . . .
- that you are a representative of a CTC Group
- that you are posting about a CTC and/or Cyclenation event
- that you are an established CTC Forum contributor



The main website page in question is :-
http://www.ctc.org.uk/support-ctc/cycli ... ertise-ctc

Probably best to remove the specific reference to Andy Hawes on that page too.

Best Wishes
Graham