If the mods are going to cull interesting and pertinent political threads at will, then the case for a separate Politics Only section seems overwhelming.
The far right is on the rise throughout Europe by stifling legitimate debate like this you help the cause of democracy not one bit.
Two Threads culled in two days
Re: Two Threads culled in two days
Oops, to the best of my knowledge I was last to post on one of them. 
It isnt actually the CUK forum's job to support the cause of democracy. The tea shop is just a place for social chit chat, not speakers' corner.
It isnt actually the CUK forum's job to support the cause of democracy. The tea shop is just a place for social chit chat, not speakers' corner.
Yma o Hyd
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NATURAL ANKLING
- Posts: 13780
- Joined: 24 Oct 2012, 10:43pm
- Location: English Riviera
Re: Two Threads culled in two days
Hi,
Resistance is futile
Keep you head down
Resistance is futile
Keep you head down
NA Thinks Just End 2 End Return + Bivvy - Some day Soon I hope
You'll Still Find Me At The Top Of A Hill
Please forgive the poor Grammar I blame it on my mobile and phat thinkers.
You'll Still Find Me At The Top Of A Hill
Please forgive the poor Grammar I blame it on my mobile and phat thinkers.
Re: Two Threads culled in two days
oh which 2 were they? I hadnt noticed
Re: Two Threads culled in two days
Whilst I am probably one of the main contributors to the political threads (I read the cycling threads but don't have the technical knowledge to offer much input), it is a cycling forum and the discussion of politics is a minor aspect and should not dominate. Sometimes, particularly when there is so much going on in the world, there is a big upsurge in political discussions and maybe limits need to be put when such threads excessively dominate the entire forum. Other times less so.
Made worse as often multiple threads will be very active on the same subject (unsure quite why people don't just contribute to an existing thread rather than starting another. And given how in no time such threads can become lengthy I suspect it would be a major job for moderators to merge threads and the real reason for the forum is cycling ...
All threads drift from their original topic, political ones more so than many. I think there is not the need for the number of different political threads and that taking an existing thread a bit off-topic would often be far better (given that it has probably drifted off-topic after the 1st 3 posts anyway). e.g. there is a long thread about Brexit meaning Brexit, yet the other day a new thread about Ms May now seeking a "red, green and blue" Brexit, something that would have been pretty much on-topic under the long existing thread.
I enjoy the chatting about non-cycling issues and there is certainly a grey area when it comes to "is it related to cycling" e.g. the Guy Martin thread at the moment where he is a prominent figure in the cycling world yet it seems he is also a collector of points and used of "exceptional hardship" to avoid punishment - does that relate to cycling or not ?
Maybe it is made worse as so often people read some news report on the internet and feel the need to post it to the forum for a discussion; and that seems to be happening very frequently these days making the "swamping" worse.
Ian
Made worse as often multiple threads will be very active on the same subject (unsure quite why people don't just contribute to an existing thread rather than starting another. And given how in no time such threads can become lengthy I suspect it would be a major job for moderators to merge threads and the real reason for the forum is cycling ...
All threads drift from their original topic, political ones more so than many. I think there is not the need for the number of different political threads and that taking an existing thread a bit off-topic would often be far better (given that it has probably drifted off-topic after the 1st 3 posts anyway). e.g. there is a long thread about Brexit meaning Brexit, yet the other day a new thread about Ms May now seeking a "red, green and blue" Brexit, something that would have been pretty much on-topic under the long existing thread.
I enjoy the chatting about non-cycling issues and there is certainly a grey area when it comes to "is it related to cycling" e.g. the Guy Martin thread at the moment where he is a prominent figure in the cycling world yet it seems he is also a collector of points and used of "exceptional hardship" to avoid punishment - does that relate to cycling or not ?
Maybe it is made worse as so often people read some news report on the internet and feel the need to post it to the forum for a discussion; and that seems to be happening very frequently these days making the "swamping" worse.
Ian
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SpannerGeek
- Posts: 722
- Joined: 12 Nov 2015, 2:16pm
Re: Two Threads culled in two days
mercalia wrote:oh which 2 were they? I hadnt noticed
Oh, just trivial stuff:
The rise of the far right in Europe, the likelihood it could happen here, espousing of far right rhetoric in the press, online forums, jingoistic, flag waving, one nation Britain guff from our politicians.
Better watch what I'm saying or they'll cull this one too.
What was it the mods said about far right elements infiltrating the forum. In order to stifle dissent?
Oh shush, that could never happen. Could it @
Re: Two Threads culled in two days
The last thread was pulled just after someone compared me to 'Der Fuhrer' and I responded in my usual polite but assertive way.
When people descend to comparing other forum members to Hitler then I can see why unpaid moderators can't be bothered and just hit the delete button.
When people descend to comparing other forum members to Hitler then I can see why unpaid moderators can't be bothered and just hit the delete button.
Re: Two Threads culled in two days
It couldnt just be that people have had enough of political threads.
Or that somebody (me) posted something that was taken the wrong way?
Ah now I see Blackbike's post.
I didnt compare him to the Fuhrer but I can see it may look that way and I am sorry it did.
Ironic though that it does very much prove my point throughout the whole thread that you still can not have an objective discussion about Fascism or Nazism, without falling foul.
Or that somebody (me) posted something that was taken the wrong way?
Ah now I see Blackbike's post.
I didnt compare him to the Fuhrer but I can see it may look that way and I am sorry it did.
Ironic though that it does very much prove my point throughout the whole thread that you still can not have an objective discussion about Fascism or Nazism, without falling foul.
Yma o Hyd
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SpannerGeek
- Posts: 722
- Joined: 12 Nov 2015, 2:16pm
Re: Two Threads culled in two days
blackbike wrote:The last thread was pulled just after someone compared me to 'Der Fuhrer' and I responded in my usual polite but assertive way.
When people descend to comparing other forum members to Hitler then I can see why unpaid moderators can't be bothered and just hit the delete button.
If ever there was am argument for an 'opt in, visible to those opted in only, less moderated' Political sub section, this is it.
It's definitive.
Re: Two Threads culled in two days
I removed both threads because they had descended into insults and name-calling.
If you wish, you may appeal to the other moderators.
Having a politics ghetto won't make insults and name-calling any more acceptable than they are in The Tea Shop.
p.s. I have no problem with objective discussion about almost anything. But it needs to remain objective.
If you wish, you may appeal to the other moderators.
Having a politics ghetto won't make insults and name-calling any more acceptable than they are in The Tea Shop.
p.s. I have no problem with objective discussion about almost anything. But it needs to remain objective.
“In some ways, it is easier to be a dissident, for then one is without responsibility.”
― Nelson Mandela, Long Walk to Freedom
― Nelson Mandela, Long Walk to Freedom
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roubaixtuesday
- Posts: 5818
- Joined: 18 Aug 2015, 7:05pm
Re: Two Threads culled in two days
Blessed are the moderators, for they shall inherit the earth.
Thank you Vorpal.
Just imagine, as a member of an ethnic minority, coming here to ask a question about bottom brackets only to see the most active thread is a vigorous debate about how it’s really OK to “black up”. I’m sure it’s not done with that intent, but the effect is to exclude people who are aghast at perceived racist tropes being, doubtless unintentionally, perpetuated.
Thank you Vorpal.
Just imagine, as a member of an ethnic minority, coming here to ask a question about bottom brackets only to see the most active thread is a vigorous debate about how it’s really OK to “black up”. I’m sure it’s not done with that intent, but the effect is to exclude people who are aghast at perceived racist tropes being, doubtless unintentionally, perpetuated.
Re: Two Threads culled in two days
I am sorry if my post was taken as name calling.
I make a distinction between attacking what somebody has posted and attacking them. It was only my intent to do the former, especially as that was pretty much a substantive point of the broad argument which I was making at the time.
No complaints about moderators pulling my post if it read not quite as intended.
This is after all a cycling forum, not speakers' corner.
I make a distinction between attacking what somebody has posted and attacking them. It was only my intent to do the former, especially as that was pretty much a substantive point of the broad argument which I was making at the time.
No complaints about moderators pulling my post if it read not quite as intended.
This is after all a cycling forum, not speakers' corner.
Yma o Hyd
Re: Two Threads culled in two days
the case for a separate Politics Only section....
Hope folks will excuse my direct plug, but if people feel strongly about this, whether for or against, please feel free to vote in the online poll.
Suppose that this room is a lift. The support breaks and down we go with ever-increasing velocity.
Let us pass the time by performing physical experiments...
--- Arthur Eddington (creator of the Eddington Number).
Let us pass the time by performing physical experiments...
--- Arthur Eddington (creator of the Eddington Number).
Re: Two Threads culled in two days
Vorpal wrote:Having a politics ghetto won't make insults and name-calling any more acceptable than they are in The Tea Shop.
Insults and name-calling will occur wherever there is online communication of any sort. It's an unavoidable by-product of the internet age. For example: I have in the past year or two taken to playing online bridge, on a site which has an accompanying chatline. You should see some of the vile, abusive stuff that passes over there! I'm sure their team of Moderators are kept busy, 24/7 (the site has a very international clientele). It always starts with fairly innocuous but slightly patronising remarks like "you shouldn't have bid ...." or whatever. And inevitably descends into the worst kind of mudslinging....
So what to do? Moving sections of this forum around to different sections is merely a matter of shuffling the insults somewhere else. That's why, I suppose, deletion is the only recourse. Hence we have to have Moderators, both here and on every other forum, social media, or whatever. They're always going to have a busy time!
But just as rotten meat attracts bluebottles, extremely political and contentious threads attract .... well the only word I can think of is 'trolls', sorry! And this may well be trolls from outside of the forum, drawn here by a Google search with the sole intent of signing up and then causing trouble.
That's why I think a visible-to-members-only section - which would effectively de-index the politics from Google's bots, might be a better option.
Suppose that this room is a lift. The support breaks and down we go with ever-increasing velocity.
Let us pass the time by performing physical experiments...
--- Arthur Eddington (creator of the Eddington Number).
Let us pass the time by performing physical experiments...
--- Arthur Eddington (creator of the Eddington Number).
Re: Two Threads culled in two days
My visits to this forum ebb and flow somewhat: one week I'm here a lot, the next I might stay away. A major factor in the latter is certainly the content of The Tea Shop. (FWIW I always visit via the "new posts" page, which shows me what's appeared since I last visited.)
I did, out of curiosity rather than offence, report a post recently because it was expressing support for far right groups. Personally I have no compulsion to see opinions completely suppressed but what needs to be considered is whether this forum should appeal to people who cycle or merely to people who post frequently. Off-topic areas of forums can serve as the glue that binds its contributors together but if unchecked they can become rather offputting to new visitors and to those who simply read rather than post. To my mind, and this is of course subjective, there has been a lot of material in The Tea Shop over the past few months which pushes the forum more to that latter effect than the former.
The description for The Tea Shop says, "Use this board…to introduce yourself to the forum." I'm not convinced that the numerous negative threads about the French and migrants or some of the discussions of gender issues are exactly welcoming beyond what might be viewed as the stereotypical cycle touring demographic, let alone the thread titled "Blacking up". Less objectively, even the less demographically charged political stuff about Brexit and whatnot becomes tiresome: I suspect most people outside of the busily-typing vocal few are utterly tired of reading polarised opinions about this stuff and come to cycling forums to read about cycling.
As a very frequent user of social media—forums and otherwise—I certainly feel less and less inclined to visit this forum over time, thanks to the content of The Tea Shop. Naturally I don't have the analytics, but if it's driving me away then I have to wonder how it plays out with people who aren't cycling-obsessed, Internet-addicted white British males.
And that is probably the question that is most pressing for the organisation whose name and logo sit above every opinion expressed on every topic of discussion on this site.
I did, out of curiosity rather than offence, report a post recently because it was expressing support for far right groups. Personally I have no compulsion to see opinions completely suppressed but what needs to be considered is whether this forum should appeal to people who cycle or merely to people who post frequently. Off-topic areas of forums can serve as the glue that binds its contributors together but if unchecked they can become rather offputting to new visitors and to those who simply read rather than post. To my mind, and this is of course subjective, there has been a lot of material in The Tea Shop over the past few months which pushes the forum more to that latter effect than the former.
The description for The Tea Shop says, "Use this board…to introduce yourself to the forum." I'm not convinced that the numerous negative threads about the French and migrants or some of the discussions of gender issues are exactly welcoming beyond what might be viewed as the stereotypical cycle touring demographic, let alone the thread titled "Blacking up". Less objectively, even the less demographically charged political stuff about Brexit and whatnot becomes tiresome: I suspect most people outside of the busily-typing vocal few are utterly tired of reading polarised opinions about this stuff and come to cycling forums to read about cycling.
As a very frequent user of social media—forums and otherwise—I certainly feel less and less inclined to visit this forum over time, thanks to the content of The Tea Shop. Naturally I don't have the analytics, but if it's driving me away then I have to wonder how it plays out with people who aren't cycling-obsessed, Internet-addicted white British males.
And that is probably the question that is most pressing for the organisation whose name and logo sit above every opinion expressed on every topic of discussion on this site.