mechanical Doping

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NUKe
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mechanical Doping

Postby NUKe » 21 Mar 2018, 4:48pm

http://www.bbc.co.uk/sport/cycling/43483161
got a mention on Radio 4's today programme.
what do you think apparently more amatures have been caught and only 1 pro .
Is this somebody going over board .
NUKe
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NATURAL ANKLING
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Re: mechanical Doping

Postby NATURAL ANKLING » 21 Mar 2018, 5:06pm

Hi,
Its old news and there are threads here too, just thought I would mention it.
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Re: mechanical Doping

Postby rjb » 21 Mar 2018, 5:42pm

Perhaps they used to level the playing field against those who have a TUE.
At the last count:- Focus Variado, Peugeot 531 pro, Dawes Discovery Tandem, 2 Dawes Kingpins, Falcon K2 MTB dropped bar tourer, On One Pompino, Longstaff trike conversion on a Falcon corsa. :D

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CJ
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Re: mechanical Doping

Postby CJ » 21 Mar 2018, 6:16pm

UCI invited the thin end of this wedge when they allowed electrically assisted shifting, without requiring that the battery charge be maintained by the motion of the bicycle.

Don't get me wrong, I have no objection to electrically-assisted cycles for general use, they are great for getting and keeping less able cyclists cycling, and up to the legal limit of 250W, I don't care whether it's just the shifting or the propulsion of the bike that's assisted. But in competition: any reliance upon mains-charged or chemical stored energy, however small, is CHEATING.

Since the invention of the electronic speed/mileometer in the 1970s, we've gradually allowed these aids to replace much of the skill that was previously required to pace oneself and allowed race radios to replace other skills, team tactics and the element of chance. We let the purity of sport be nibbled away by these artificially powered aids. Back then there was no realistic prospect of the rider self-powering these devices. But now we most certainly do have the technology.

Yes there is a little drag from a generator in the hub, bottom-bracket, jockey pulley, wherever. But the people who pooh-pooh my idea on those grounds also argue that the power consumption of shifters, radios etc, is so trivial that the spectators of cycle sport should not fuss about it. Well you can't have it BOTH ways! If the power is insignificant then so should be the drag. And if it isn't, then by making this rule the UCI would create an incentive for manufacturers to apply the state of the art and make it so!

There surely must be some performance gain from having electric-assisted shifting etc, else nobody would want these aids. So lets find out if those gains are worth the cost of a tiny extra effort. If they aren't then my point is proved beyond doubt that their use in a competitive event is CHEATING!

Why am I riding this hobbyhorse? Because the bicycle - prior to the electronic age - was a purely human-powered machine and there's something fine about that. A touring bike equipped with a hub dynamo operating its lights and recharging its gadgets, is once again made pure. Not that touring needs to be. I repeat, I've got nothing against electric assist for general use. Likewise I don't mind whatever quantity of whichever medication anyone needs simply to get them some place by bike! EPO? I could have done with some of that in the Himalayas! Sport however is supposed to be pure as the driven snow. By further refining the technology of touring, it COULD be once again. And so then it should be.

Just as sport is closing the door on drugs, it should be pushing back the thin end of the electro-mechanical-doping wedge. Because it can, and the developments that incentivises will make the bicycle even more convenient to use.
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Zoncolan
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Re: mechanical Doping

Postby Zoncolan » 1 May 2018, 6:27pm

I just don't get it. It would be like me over-taking a grand tour peleton on a motorbike and then celebrating because I'm so much better than them. Bizarre.

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Re: mechanical Doping

Postby reohn2 » 1 May 2018, 7:30pm

Zoncolan wrote:I just don't get it. It would be like me over-taking a grand tour peleton on a motorbike and then celebrating because I'm so much better than them. Bizarre.

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NUKe
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Re: mechanical Doping

Postby NUKe » 7 May 2018, 11:08pm

CJ I agree cheating of all types has to be stamped out. The point was the UCI response seemsto be steam hammer to crack a non existant nut so far.
NUKe

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ianrobo
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Re: mechanical Doping

Postby ianrobo » 9 May 2018, 8:14am

I am convinced it has happened and remeber Gaimon and Boonen have claimed FC used it and now we had recently Eddy Planckaert ...

Someone I speak to regularly is convinced that Mercy used a form because every classic he changed his bike and/or saddle and systems were available then.

And sorry to come back to Froome, but watch the Ventoux piece and tell me how that was natural in going away from Contador like that ?

Postboxer
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Re: mechanical Doping

Postby Postboxer » 10 May 2018, 11:57pm

It's not cheating if it's allowed.

If all their gadgets were to be human powered they wouldn't use a hub dynamo would they? They would use some sort of KERS system like in F1, something that would harvest energy only when they used the brakes. Would it then be ok if this energy charged a battery that then drove a motor to help them up the next climb, assuming there was no charge at the start of a race?

De Sisti
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Re: mechanical Doping

Postby De Sisti » 11 May 2018, 9:10am

ianrobo wrote:Someone I speak to regularly is convinced that Mercy used a form because every classic he changed his bike and/or saddle and systems were available then.

1). Who is that 'Someone'? (The guy in the pub?)
2). Who/what is Mercy?

thirdcrank
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Re: mechanical Doping

Postby thirdcrank » 11 May 2018, 9:45am

I'd hate to be wrong twice in two days about predictive spelling but I presume Mercy = Merckx.

We've had electric motors for a long time but there have been a lot of recent advances in battery technology. Long after the Merckx era, things like gel cells were still too heavy and bulky to disguise on a racing bike.

ianrobo
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Re: mechanical Doping

Postby ianrobo » 11 May 2018, 10:43am

thirdcrank wrote:I'd hate to be wrong twice in two days about predictive spelling but I presume Mercy = Merckx.

We've had electric motors for a long time but there have been a lot of recent advances in battery technology. Long after the Merckx era, things like gel cells were still too heavy and bulky to disguise on a racing bike.


sorry of course Eddy !!

the someone is a dutch journalist and has looked at the footage available from his time and basically in every classic/monument Eddy swapped a bike or wheel.

I mentioned Froome but look at the spinning wheel that we saw with Hesjdal or Stuff on youtube regarding Van Aert ...

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Re: mechanical Doping

Postby landsurfer » 11 May 2018, 11:06am

NUKe wrote:http://www.bbc.co.uk/sport/cycling/43483161
g
what do you think apparently more amatures have been caught and only 1 pro . .


Don't you mean "Armatures" ........ :lol:
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reohn2
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Re: mechanical Doping

Postby reohn2 » 11 May 2018, 11:14am

landsurfer wrote:
NUKe wrote:http://www.bbc.co.uk/sport/cycling/43483161
g
what do you think apparently more amatures have been caught and only 1 pro . .


Don't you mean "Armatures" ........ :lol:

That's a rather dynamic post,I s'pose it could alternate with a battery of others in a similar vein.
Power to the people I say! :wink:
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landsurfer
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Re: mechanical Doping

Postby landsurfer » 11 May 2018, 11:42am

reohn2 wrote:
landsurfer wrote:
NUKe wrote:http://www.bbc.co.uk/sport/cycling/43483161
g
what do you think apparently more amatures have been caught and only 1 pro . .


Don't you mean "Armatures" ........ :lol:

That's a rather dynamic post,I s'pose it could alternate with a battery of others in a similar vein.
Power to the people I say! :wink:


I'll relay it to a few others.... :wink:
The Road Goes On Forever.