Vehicle as a murder weapon

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Bonefishblues
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Re: Vehicle as a murder weapon

Postby Bonefishblues » 25 Mar 2019, 5:28pm

reohn2 wrote:
thirdcrank wrote:Driver 'rammed cyclist then attacked him' in Reading
Mr Whittaker, 46, of no fixed address, denies a charge of attempted murder.


https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-england-b ... e-47691266

Going off the report I'd be amazed if the defendent wasn't found guilty of attempted murder.


Prosecutor Michael Roques said the defendant had "sent a number of messages threatening to kill" Mr Fordred following a row involving a former partner.

Figure of speech, I'm sure, intended to scare but not to be actually carried out. It's clear to me that the Defendent had a moment of madness, fuelled by his naivite and an excess of drink and drugs, and has already pleaded guilty to GBH at the earliest opportunity.

Hope you're right though...

reohn2
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Re: Vehicle as a murder weapon

Postby reohn2 » 25 Mar 2019, 5:34pm

Bonefishblues wrote:
reohn2 wrote:Going off the report I'd be amazed if the defendent wasn't found guilty of attempted murder.


Prosecutor Michael Roques said the defendant had "sent a number of messages threatening to kill" Mr Fordred following a row involving a former partner.

Figure of speech, I'm sure, intended to scare but not to be actually carried out. It's clear to me that the Defendent had a moment of madness, fuelled by his naivite and an excess of drink and drugs, and has already pleaded guilty to GBH at the earliest opportunity.

Unfortunately the law in the UK is complete arris and can be curcumnavigated by a few words from a slick lawyer as the victim is crippled :evil:
Hope you're right though...

Me too
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Bonefishblues
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Re: Vehicle as a murder weapon

Postby Bonefishblues » 25 Mar 2019, 5:47pm

We agree on that, but not the role of the Defence Lawyer. I really don't think that holds much sway. Mr Loophole is simply a very good lawyer, for instance, because he works hard and really understands the law.

reohn2
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Re: Vehicle as a murder weapon

Postby reohn2 » 25 Mar 2019, 5:50pm

Bonefishblues wrote:We agree on that, but not the role of the Defence Lawyer. I really don't think that holds much sway. Mr Loophole is simply a very good lawyer, for instance, because he works hard and really understands the law.

No doubt you're right about Mr Loophole,but there are many tricks of the trade.............
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thirdcrank
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Re: Vehicle as a murder weapon

Postby thirdcrank » 25 Mar 2019, 6:01pm

A case like this is about much more than a detailed knowledge of the law. In a word it's advocacy. Top barristers specialise so eg there a jury advocates and judge advocates (not to be confused with courts martial.) One of the jury advocates par excellence was the late George Carman QC, who defended the late Ken Dodd and had the jury in the palm of his hand. (Not that it was ever going to be difficult to get Doddy acquitted by a Liverpool jury.) Equally skilful are barristers who can persuade a judge that their own interpretation of the law is correct.

The real Mr Loophole AKA Nick Freeman just gets the summons and checks it against the evidence ie points to prove. In an earlier existence I did the same thing in reverse, checking police reports to ensure everything was proved. Nick Freeman' big break was in getting a couple of celebrity clients acquitted with appropriate publicity. I posted a link somewhere of an explanation by another lawyer but the discussion never really got beyond people seething over the couple of well-publicised acquiitals.

Bonefishblues
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Re: Vehicle as a murder weapon

Postby Bonefishblues » 25 Mar 2019, 6:18pm

reohn2 wrote:
Bonefishblues wrote:We agree on that, but not the role of the Defence Lawyer. I really don't think that holds much sway. Mr Loophole is simply a very good lawyer, for instance, because he works hard and really understands the law.

No doubt you're right about Mr Loophole,but there are many tricks of the trade.............

There really aren't, it's about being good at your job, just like any other trade or profession.

reohn2
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Re: Vehicle as a murder weapon

Postby reohn2 » 25 Mar 2019, 6:28pm

Bonefishblues wrote:
reohn2 wrote:
Bonefishblues wrote:We agree on that, but not the role of the Defence Lawyer. I really don't think that holds much sway. Mr Loophole is simply a very good lawyer, for instance, because he works hard and really understands the law.

No doubt you're right about Mr Loophole,but there are many tricks of the trade.............

There really aren't, it's about being good at your job, just like any other trade or profession.

OK :wink:
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Farrina
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Re: Vehicle as a murder weapon

Postby Farrina » 25 Mar 2019, 6:46pm

Going somewhat off topic - but I cannot resist it ...
thirdcrank wrote:One of the jury advocates par excellence was the late George Carman QC, who defended the late Ken Dodd and had the jury in the palm of his hand. (Not that it was ever going to be difficult to get Doddy acquitted by a Liverpool jury.)

As a Liverpudlian who closely followed the trial at the time, I recall it being reported that at one stage, whilst Doddy was being cross examined by the prosecuting barrister, he still telling jokes in response. The judge, with some difficulty, was hiding his smiles behind his hand and the jury were just looking deliriously happy.

I wonder if they got out on time ?

Fatal error on the Inland Revenues part (as they then were) not applying to have the trial hosted outside Liverpool.

Frankly, Doddy could have been found over a dead body, holding the smoking gun in his hand, crying “die you ****” and if charged with murder, then a Liverpool jury would not only have unanimously acquitted him on the spot, but also recommended to the judge that the prosecuting authorities be charged with misconduct in bringing such a case.

Dear old Doddy, what a star and always completely faithful to his roots. May he rest in peace.

Ps As I recall George Carmen also had some skeletons in his cupboard as well ....

A light article partially referencing the above here http://www.standpointmag.co.uk/underrated-julyaugust11-ken-dodd-robert-low-liverpool-thatcher

brynpoeth
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Re: Vehicle as a murder weapon

Postby brynpoeth » 26 Mar 2019, 7:07pm

Two drivers who raced at 170 kmh in Berlin and killed an innocent driver have been convicted of murder a second time (the first convictions were annulled because of procedural irregularities)
They plan to appeal
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gaz
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Re: Vehicle as a murder weapon

Postby gaz » 29 Mar 2019, 4:26pm

https://www.kentonline.co.uk/gravesend/ ... an-201690/
Following a three week trial at Woolwich Crown Court, the 29-year-old was found guilty of grievous bodily harm with intent and criminal damage and was sentenced today.

10 years.
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thirdcrank
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Re: Vehicle as a murder weapon

Postby thirdcrank » 15 May 2019, 9:04pm

Re my post of 2 January 2019, the driver has been sentenced to eight years after pleading guilty to s 18 GBH with intent.

https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-england-leeds-48284273