Four year old killed by bike helmet.

For all discussions about this "lively" subject. All topics that are substantially about helmet usage will be moved here.
Bonefishblues
Posts: 8008
Joined: 7 Jul 2014, 9:45pm
Location: Near Bicester Oxon

Re: Four year old killed by bike helmet.

Postby Bonefishblues » 16 Feb 2020, 9:20am

Mick F wrote:
Oldjohnw wrote:
Bonefishblues wrote:
Who should we alert/lobby here?


The Health and Safety Executive and local authorities.
I'm getting quite emotional about this subject. This question of "who" has been in my brain these past couple of days.

Our "local" MP isn't local, and TBH I think she's a waste of space, so I won't be contacting her.
https://members.parliament.uk/member/4100/contact

Another idea of mine was to go to a major outlet and speak to the manager. Halfords for instance.
Maybe write a nice but strong letter to the major helmet manufacturers.

I agree Mick - this is a thing worth doing.

I wonder if in an indirect way I could/should contact the parents? I am - (or at least have been up to a couple of days ago) a member of a local group with representatives from their community who have a very overt safety agenda.

Oldjohnw
Posts: 4495
Joined: 16 Oct 2018, 4:23am
Location: Northumberland

Re: Four year old killed by bike helmet.

Postby Oldjohnw » 16 Feb 2020, 9:26am

Bonefishblues wrote:
Oldjohnw wrote:
Bonefishblues wrote:
...and these guys get it: https://helmets.org/playgrou.htm
...citing previous incidents.

Who should we alert/lobby here?


The Health and Safety Executive and local authorities.

I understand the HSE, but why LAs?


LAs because they still have some consumer role - ok think.

Local Trading Standards also, which I believe are now accessed through Citizens Advice.
John

User avatar
Mick F
Spambuster
Posts: 49213
Joined: 7 Jan 2007, 11:24am
Location: Tamar Valley, Cornwall

Re: Four year old killed by bike helmet.

Postby Mick F » 16 Feb 2020, 9:35am

What about Mums Net?
https://www.mumsnet.com
Mick F. Cornwall

Bonefishblues
Posts: 8008
Joined: 7 Jul 2014, 9:45pm
Location: Near Bicester Oxon

Re: Four year old killed by bike helmet.

Postby Bonefishblues » 16 Feb 2020, 9:48am

I've just dropped a note to Jeremy Vine - as a cyclist I thought he might pick this up. As I pointed out, it's a zero cost measure, for goodness sake.

Bonefishblues
Posts: 8008
Joined: 7 Jul 2014, 9:45pm
Location: Near Bicester Oxon

Re: Four year old killed by bike helmet.

Postby Bonefishblues » 16 Feb 2020, 9:49am

Mick F wrote:What about Mums Net?
https://www.mumsnet.com

Crack on. I suspect you may be different to their average demographic, but perhaps a wig could be called into play :wink:

Oldjohnw
Posts: 4495
Joined: 16 Oct 2018, 4:23am
Location: Northumberland

Re: Four year old killed by bike helmet.

Postby Oldjohnw » 16 Feb 2020, 10:33am

Anyone able to get the WI on board? When they get the bi between their teeth there's no stopping them.

I will be with Citizens Advice later this week as I am a director. I will send what the consumer person has to say.

Could someone please briefly outline the issue re child helmets? Three or your bullet points.
John

User avatar
Mick F
Spambuster
Posts: 49213
Joined: 7 Jan 2007, 11:24am
Location: Tamar Valley, Cornwall

Re: Four year old killed by bike helmet.

Postby Mick F » 16 Feb 2020, 10:42am

Playgrounds and helmets don't mix. Serious risk of strangulation and have already caused deaths.

There is a European standard CE 1080 for a weaker child's buckle with a green colour code, but in UK they don't seem to exist. All helmets here are at CE 1078.

Recall all children's helmets with normal "adult" CE 1078 buckles immediately.
Mick F. Cornwall

niggle
Posts: 3423
Joined: 11 Mar 2009, 10:29pm
Location: Cornwall, near England

Re: Four year old killed by bike helmet.

Postby niggle » 16 Feb 2020, 10:54am

Bonefishblues wrote:...and these guys get it: https://helmets.org/playgrou.htm
...citing previous incidents.

Who should we alert/lobby here?

Ahh I think I get it now, from the link above:

Slatis said that for this reason the Swedish child helmet standard will require a strap to hold at 90 N (9 kg) but release before 160 N (16kg), which Slatis believes might have saved two of the six lives lost. The European EN 1080 standard for child helmets now has such a buckle, colored green to distinguish it from other buckles, but it is optional. In the period after it was added to the standard there were reports that it was problematic, and that parents were avoiding it. At present, there are green buckles on child helmets sold in major toy stores and department retailers, but regular buckles on child helmets sold in some other stores where the retailer believes in stronger straps.

(My bold)

Mind you the article also glibly says:

A strong strap is necessary to keep a helmet on the child's head during a crash, and helmets with strong straps have saved hundreds or thousands of lives, so these incidents must be seen in that perspective.


:evil:

mattheus
Posts: 1542
Joined: 29 Dec 2008, 12:57pm
Location: Western Europe

Re: Four year old killed by bike helmet.

Postby mattheus » 16 Feb 2020, 10:56am

There are loads of optional CE standards out there.

e.g. the adult helmet standard - you don't have to wear one, and you are free to wear one with no CE mark!

User avatar
Cunobelin
Posts: 10732
Joined: 6 Feb 2007, 7:22pm

Re: Four year old killed by bike helmet.

Postby Cunobelin » 16 Feb 2020, 6:21pm

mattheus wrote:There are loads of optional CE standards out there.

e.g. the adult helmet standard - you don't have to wear one, and you are free to wear one with no CE mark!

Helmet standards are a farce

One group UK Cycling Events for many years excluded EN1078 helmets (the requirement for UK sale ) frem their events, eventually they added EN1078

Even now they state:

5. You must wear a safety-approved cycling helmet complying with latest EN1078, ANSI Z90/4 or SNELL standards during your participation in the event. Any rider not wearing a helmet will not be covered by the event insurance and will be disqualified from the event and could be liable for damages if involved in an accident on that basis. You must accept this as a condition of entry.



(My emphasis)

The ANSI committee last met in 1996 - the standard was superseded by ASTM over 20 years ago!!!!!

They are asking you to wear 25-year-old helmets for their events.

This is an ANSI helmet...

Image

Image




With an organisation that is responsible for a massive number of UK events showing such ignorance... what hope do we have?

User avatar
Mick F
Spambuster
Posts: 49213
Joined: 7 Jan 2007, 11:24am
Location: Tamar Valley, Cornwall

Re: Four year old killed by bike helmet.

Postby Mick F » 16 Feb 2020, 6:53pm

Cunobelin wrote: ... what hope do we have?
Exactly.
Mick F. Cornwall

User avatar
Mick F
Spambuster
Posts: 49213
Joined: 7 Jan 2007, 11:24am
Location: Tamar Valley, Cornwall

Re: Four year old killed by bike helmet.

Postby Mick F » 18 Feb 2020, 4:00pm

Off into Plymouth tomorrow afternoon and I'm going to pop into Evans and have a shufti at the kids' helmets.
I'll also ask the staff about them.

No doubt I'll be blanked as they'll have no idea what I'll be ranting about. :oops:
I may possibly get my point across, and I may get some realisation of the issues here. Fingers crossed.

Not a Jeremy Vine fan in the slightest, but it would be good if his programme raised the question. Bonefishblues has "dropped him a line" as stated above.

Daughter1 is going to stay overnight tonight after going out this evening in town, and I know she is/was a member of Mums Net. I'll get some advice from her over breakfast tomorrow morning.
Mick F. Cornwall

Cyril Haearn
Posts: 13550
Joined: 30 Nov 2013, 11:26am
Location: Between the woods and the water

Re: Four year old killed by bike helmet.

Postby Cyril Haearn » 18 Feb 2020, 6:00pm

Mick F, try to play dumb if they do not know you, ask questions, say little, that is the best way to learn :wink:
Entertainer, intellectual, idealist, PoB
Cycling-of course, but it is far better on a Gillott
We love safety cameras, we hate bullies

User avatar
Cunobelin
Posts: 10732
Joined: 6 Feb 2007, 7:22pm

Re: Four year old killed by bike helmet.

Postby Cunobelin » 18 Feb 2020, 8:02pm

Mick F wrote:Off into Plymouth tomorrow afternoon and I'm going to pop into Evans and have a shufti at the kids' helmets.
I'll also ask the staff about them.

No doubt I'll be blanked as they'll have no idea what I'll be ranting about. :oops:
I may possibly get my point across, and I may get some realisation of the issues here. Fingers crossed.

Not a Jeremy Vine fan in the slightest, but it would be good if his programme raised the question. Bonefishblues has "dropped him a line" as stated above.

Daughter1 is going to stay overnight tonight after going out this evening in town, and I know she is/was a member of Mums Net. I'll get some advice from her over breakfast tomorrow morning.


An 'Evans" in Plymouth......Civilisation approacheth the West Country....

User avatar
Mick F
Spambuster
Posts: 49213
Joined: 7 Jan 2007, 11:24am
Location: Tamar Valley, Cornwall

Re: Four year old killed by bike helmet.

Postby Mick F » 18 Feb 2020, 8:58pm

:lol:

The Rotunda.
The building dates back to the 60s. Very modern for the day, and the first time we moved down here in Jan 1980, it was a Chrysler(?) dealership. Prior to that, it was Turnbulls garage.

https://www.oldclassiccar.co.uk/garage_plymouth.htm

Same building, now Evans.
the-premises-of-evans-cycles-in-the-rotunda-charles-cross-plymouth-H7RD5F.jpg
Mick F. Cornwall