Wheel building machines

[Cyril Haearn]

One understands that many wheels are built by machines, I looked for info, did not find much. I rebuilt a wheel myself once (new hub, same type as before), not too difficult, but I am afraid of trying to get the right spoke length when building from scratch
How do wheel building machines work, are they very complicated?
What product volume is needed to justify a machine? Can a machine be adjusted to make different types of wheel? Can a machine be better than a person?
Where may I buy one?

[simonineaston]

I got one of them! It wasn't very dear, although it is a bit slow. It's infinitely programmable, but can take a while to learn new lacing patterns and wotnot - it's not cheap to run tho' insisting as it does on regular trips to Waitrose and beer...

[gxaustin]

I've used both the DT Swiss spoke calculator and the Edd one. Both worked well.
You input the rim and hub dimensions together with spoke count and number of crosses, if any. Some common rim dimensions are held on the Edd system (e.g. Open Pro).
I should imagine that wheel building machines are large and very expensive and the spokes still have to be loaded into the hubs.

[rualexander]

A few videos on youtube, just search for "wheel building machines"

e.g. https://youtu.be/EITEQLn8SUE

[Brucey]

the leading supplier of wheelbuilding machines is 'Holland Mechanics'. Searching the web for that produces many useful hits.

cheers

[Jamesh]

I've used the dt spoke calc

It's been reliable and easy to use even for me!!

Apparently it even accounts for spoke stretch.

Cheers James

[Brucey]

In reply to the OP, the manufacturers of wheelbuilding machines suggest that you should have a requirement for ~10000 wheels per year in order to utilise one of their machines.

cheers

[CJ]

I had a bit to do with them when I worked for Raleigh, but that was back in the 80s. As I recall 'Holland Mechanics' was the leading maker of these machines. I'm sure they must be much more sophiticated now.

[Manc33]

Humans beat machines hands down when it comes to wheel building.

The last machine built wheels I used (Triban 3 stock), after less than 1,000 miles the non-drive side rear spokes were so loose you could almost undo them by hand, totally unsafe! They need checking after so many miles, but how many people know to or would think they need to.

Compare that to my own hand built wheels that I check every now and then for trueness and they just never go out of true, but then they are old Mavics and built like a tank.

[mercalia]

The YouTube videos of them doing their thing are wonders to behold?

I understand they can build high quality wheels but it takes time so defeats the object of using a machine?

[Cyril Haearn]

A machine can work much faster than a person but it just can not be quite as good, I think

[scottg]

Jobst Brandt on machine built wheels....

Discuss limits of machine built wheels.


https://yarchive.net/bike/machine_built_wheels.html

[markjohnobrien]

I had a bit to do with them when I worked for Raleigh, but that was back in the 80s. As I recall 'Holland Mechanics' was the leading maker of these machines. I'm sure they must be much more sophiticated now.

See the link from Bikebiz where Raleigh invested in further machines in 2019 and made clear that all machine built wheels are hand finished as well (maybe stress relieved?)

https://www.bikebiz.com/raleigh-uk-to-i ... -machines/

[fastpedaller]

I wanted a pair of 26" mTB wheels for the Rudge folder I rebuilt 18 months ago. For 40 years I've built my own wheels, and went searching for parts on Ebay. It became apparent that I could buy complete wheels a lot cheaper than the parts, so I selected some wheels with shimano freehub, Q/R and stainless spokes (expecting them to be plain gauge spokes) with a view to stress-relieving them and trueing when they arrived. Eventually (wrong hubs) the product arrived and the seller was good about the return. Anyway, I examined them (db spokes ) put them in jig and they looked really true. No amount of stress-relieving produced any 'pinging'. I did put a bit more tension in them. I emailed the seller and expressed my delight and he confirmed 'a guy been building wheels for 40 years dos them for me'. He must have a cheap supply of rims/hubs if he's paying the guy - at the price I paid they were a steal.

[Steve O'C]

Jobst Brandt on machine built wheels....

Discuss limits of machine built wheels.

Thanks for posting this link. In the post when discussing how to reduce spoke twisting he says:

I found that unloading the spoke to be adjusted a better method, and
with a rigid truing stand this is easily done. Since one usually
holds the wheel in position with the other hand, that hand can be used
to displace the rim toward the side from which the spoke approaches.

Seems sensible and I do not think I have ever seen this mentioned before. Is that what the experts here do?

Steve