If you were an MP how would you vote on Brexit Trade deal?

Debs · Post by **Debs** » 26 Dec 2020, 4:35pm

This is the House of Commons, and we here are all MPs with an option to vote on Johnson's Brexit Trade Agreement!

How would you cast your vote [ or not ] ?

The British government has said it would summon MPs back to parliament on December 30 to vote on the deal. MPs are still waiting for the full text of the agreement, which UK chief Brexit negotiator David Frost said would be published soon.

Vote for it: This is agreeing and supporting the agreement.
Vote against it: A majority of against votes would plunge the UK onto WTO terms come Jan 1st.
Abstaining: The vote is very likely to get enough Tory MP approval to win, whilst abstaining ensures that Johnson and his Tory-Brexit negotiators own the agreement condition and terms.

We have the advantage of changing vote choice, and voting expires end of January.

Jdsk · Post by **Jdsk** » 26 Dec 2020, 4:37pm

What happened? There were several interesting responses...

Jonathan

Cyril Haearn · Post by **Cyril Haearn** » 26 Dec 2020, 4:39pm

I voted abstain
What might happen if it is defeated? No deal, more endless negotiations?

Trying (and succeeding) to not worry about This b----t Madness, to keep my blood pressure down

Debs · Post by **Debs** » 26 Dec 2020, 4:45pm

Jdsk wrote:What happened? There were several interesting responses...

Jonathan

Sorry about that, my fault, i accidentally gave everyone 3 options to choose, so we could vote for both for and against, and vote to abstain too :lol:

Anyway this new version is the same but with just 1 vote option :wink:

Psamathe · Post by **Psamathe** » 26 Dec 2020, 4:46pm

(I've not participated in the poll because for me there is no good answer).

The complication with Johnson's vote scheme is that you are not voting on the merits of his deal but also on his indirectly offered alternative to his deal. i.e. vote against is in reality a vote for a "no deal". So the question becomes "do you support (and vote for) Johnson's deal" or "do you support (and vote for) no deal" and if you believe neither is a good choice then how do you vote, particularly when there are alternative ways forward just than Johnson has refused to offer those paths. Johnson has in effect offered "do I kick you in the head" or "do I kick you in the crotch" when the best way forward for "the recipient" is not to be kicked at-all.

Ian

Jdsk · Post by **Jdsk** » 26 Dec 2020, 4:47pm

Cyril Haearn wrote:What might happen if it is defeated? No deal, more endless negotiations?

Treaties to which the UK is a party don't have to be ratified by Parliament. But changes to rights and to domestic law now do... and of course many treaties require such changes. And the power of Parliament to disapprove is now codified:
"Parliament’s role in ratifying treaties"
https://commonslibrary.parliament.uk/research-briefings/sn05855/

Sovereign states such the UK and the Member of States off the EU can negotiate and renegotiate whenever they want. This Agreement won't change that power whether it's ratified or not.

Jonathan

Debs · Post by **Debs** » 26 Dec 2020, 4:49pm

Cyril Haearn wrote:I voted abstain
What might happen if it is defeated? No deal, more endless negotiations?

Trying (and succeeding) to not worry about This b----t Madness, to keep my blood pressure down

It will probably get voted in by the Tory majority anyway.

I think also, the EU members have to formally agree and ratify, not sure if there will be any hiccup there...

Jdsk · Post by **Jdsk** » 26 Dec 2020, 4:52pm

Thanks for the explanation, Debs.

From memory ; - )

I'd abstain because:
1 There's no impact assessment despite multiple requests.
2 The Prime Minister and the majority party should own this decision, as you said.
3 My abstention won't result in anything worse.

But I'd understand if the Leader of the Opposition makes a different decision: we need to get rid of this rotten Government as soon as possible.

Jonathan

Debs · Post by **Debs** » 26 Dec 2020, 4:56pm

Psamathe wrote: (I've not participated in the poll because for me there is no good answer).

Ian

But this is hypothetically not a poll, you are an elected MP, and you either vote or abstain

Debs · Post by **Debs** » 26 Dec 2020, 4:57pm

Jdsk · Post by **Jdsk** » 26 Dec 2020, 4:57pm

Debs wrote:
Cyril Haearn wrote:What might happen if it is defeated? No deal, more endless negotiations?

I think also, the EU members have to formally agree and ratify, not sure if there will be any hiccup there...

Yes, each Member State has the power of veto.

If they don't veto then the European Council can approve.

After that the European Parliament can be asked for consent. Then it goes back to the Council.

https://ec.europa.eu/commission/presscorner/detail/en/ip_20_2531

Jonathan

reohn2 · Post by **reohn2** » 26 Dec 2020, 4:58pm

Psamathe wrote:(I've not participated in the poll because for me there is no good answer).

Ian

Then you abstain?

Psamathe · Post by **Psamathe** » 26 Dec 2020, 4:59pm

reohn2 wrote:
Psamathe wrote:(I've not participated in the poll because for me there is no good answer).

Ian

Then you abstain?

I suppose it happens by default when you don't vote for and don't vote against. So yes, I've added an abstain.

Ian

[XAP]Bob · Post by **[XAP]Bob** » 26 Dec 2020, 5:14pm

Everyone should abstain - with the possible exception of Johnson and his yes men.

Since no one else has had any opportunity to scrutinise the deal they cannot possibly vote *for* it, and voting against it is voting for a no-deal outcome which is suicidally bad.

Tangled Metal · Post by **Tangled Metal** » 26 Dec 2020, 5:28pm

So you're really asking if we want a no deal, a poor supporters of brexit deal or you're not happy to vote for either under a mistaken pov that abstaining means a protest vote or something similar. Better not to vote at all or take part.

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