Post-Brexit - buying bike parts abroad . . (incl. Rose/DutchBikeParts)

[Psamathe]

I don't think that it has:
https://spacycles.co.uk

Screenshot 2021-01-14 at 10.59.35.png
Is "import duties" the correct term?

Jonathan

It depends. There's no import duty for UK products, but does a Spa bike have enough UK components to count as a UK product.

I don't understand import taxes but if there are too many non-UK components, those components would have been imported to UK and are thus being re-exported so I'd assume the import to UK duty would be reclaimed on re-export. That said, I assume SPA would be buying these components from a distributor and the distributor pays any import to UK duty and resells so maybe SPA cannot reclaim the import to UK duty and even if they could it probably becomes a bureaucratic nightmare.

Ian

[st599_uk]

I don't think that it has:
https://spacycles.co.uk

Screenshot 2021-01-14 at 10.59.35.png
Is "import duties" the correct term?

Jonathan

It depends. There's no import duty for UK products, but does a Spa bike have enough UK components to count as a UK product.

I don't understand import taxes but if there are too many non-UK components, those components would have been imported to UK and are thus being re-exported so I'd assume the import to UK duty would be reclaimed on re-export. That said, I assume SPA would be buying these components from a distributor and the distributor pays any import to UK duty and resells so maybe SPA cannot reclaim the import to UK duty and even if they could it probably becomes a bureaucratic nightmare.

Ian

It doesn't work like that I'm afraid.

See: https://publications.parliament.uk/pa/l ... /12908.htm

It has a box explaining rules of origin on import.

[Jdsk]

I don't think that it has:
https://spacycles.co.uk

Is "import duties" the correct term?

It depends. There's no import duty for UK products, but does a Spa bike have enough UK components to count as a UK product.

I don't understand import taxes but if there are too many non-UK components, those components would have been imported to UK and are thus being re-exported so I'd assume the import to UK duty would be reclaimed on re-export. That said, I assume SPA would be buying these components from a distributor and the distributor pays any import to UK duty and resells so maybe SPA cannot reclaim the import to UK duty and even if they could it probably becomes a bureaucratic nightmare.

Thanks x2.

Jonathan

[RickH]

This may explain some of the problems

BBC News - Brexit export EU costs a 'nasty shock' for small business owners

[st599_uk]

The issue for Spa is likely that their bicycles whilst assembled in Britain use parts from major manufacturers like Shimano which are not British. You need to have a fairly large proportion of the item's value being produced in Britain to avoid import duty, plus of course VAT would be due on the imported price and the fees for whoever works out the dues and VAT that's due.

[Bmblbzzz]

Regardless of whether or not there are duties, there is paperwork and, as a bike is over E150, from June Spa would have to collect VAT at the applicable rate for the destination state and register with that country's VAT office. There are also, as we see, delays in shipping, which might possibly lead to customer complaints they don't want to deal with. Easier on a customer website to say "import duties" as shorthand than explain it all (and get into argument with angry customers nitpicking the details).

[st599_uk]

Regardless of whether or not there are duties, there is paperwork and, as a bike is over E150, from June Spa would have to collect VAT at the applicable rate for the destination state and register with that country's VAT office. There are also, as we see, delays in shipping, which might possibly lead to customer complaints they don't want to deal with. Easier on a customer website to say "import duties" as shorthand than explain it all (and get into argument with angry customers nitpicking the details).

If it's over 150euros, then it's VAT collected by the courier. But yes for components he'd have to register. And there is the paperwork issue that is needed to work out if a product is British or not.

[sun ra]

Hope folk don’t mind my asking on this thread? I purchased a few cycling components from one of the online German stores in mid December. My bank account and the email confirmation received clearly show when the purchase was made. Unsurprisingly the parcel hasn’t yet arrived.

What can I do if the courier company try to add the extra charges that apply to purchases made after 1st January even though I purchased the item in December 2020? I realise I can refuse to pay and the item would then get sent back. When I last looked at guidelines on the government website any purchases made before 1st Jan would be exempt (as one would expect). I’m now worried the courier companies might be eager to take advantage and make a quick buck.

Hopefully I’m wrong and I won’t be receiving one of those letters from parcel force claiming I owe VAT.

[Bonzo Banana]

A summary of the new legislation here in regards the bicycle industry;

https://www.bicycleassociation.org.uk/n ... of-origin/

It will be interesting to see how this all works out, obviously the EU previously benefitted from a huge trade surplus with the UK and so many more of their products will be effected. The last significant process rule where typically you get a bike fully made in Asia but given final packing in Germany and a 'Made in Germany' sticker will now I assume get additional tariffs coming to the UK. Such companies now may as well bypass that process in Germany and simply ship the product directly from Asia to the UK and pay the tariffs even if that means it will no longer have that 'Made in Germany' sticker which was pretty meaningless anyway for that type of product.

So I assume bicycle products with a high non UK/EU content will be hit with tariffs but other products will purely be hit with sales tax but as is the case with most bicycle products they are mainly manufactured in Asia. In time we may get cheaper bicycle products in the UK if any Asian countries get favoured non tariff trading with the UK but such products cannot be re-exported to the EU without tariffs being paid.

[UpWrong]

That's a clear explanation. So rules of origin tariffs were comimg anyway, regardless of Brexit. The German recumbent firms Hase and HP Velotechnic will be clobbered by this because less than 55% of their bikes are made in Germany.

[markjohnobrien]

That's a clear explanation. So rules of origin tariffs were comimg anyway, regardless of Brexit. The German recumbent firms Hase and HP Velotechnic will be clobbered by this because less than 55% of their bikes are made in Germany.

Agree: tariffs were coming from the EU anyway.

[Jdsk]

That's a clear explanation. So rules of origin tariffs were comimg anyway, regardless of Brexit. The German recumbent firms Hase and HP Velotechnic will be clobbered by this because less than 55% of their bikes are made in Germany.

Agree: tariffs were coming from the EU anyway.

I'm lost: please can someone explain. How will consumers in Member States be affected by the changes?

Thanks

Jonathan

[Bmblbzzz]

From the Bicycle Association document:

Finally on standards, the BA funds expert UK participation in standards development at BSI (the UK standards body), CEN (the European organisation) and ISO (where world standards are developed).

Following Brexit, activities with BSI and ISO are unaffected, and UK experts can also continue to work at CEN until at least the end of 2021, when CEN review their statutes; BSI is optimistic that close participation will continue after that, too.

That's a pleasant surprise.

The information about the CA mark is less encouraging:

Don’t panic! Suppliers of goods to be placed on the UK market (with very few exceptions) will be able to carry on using the CE mark just as before, until the end of December 2021. Only from Jan 2022 will the UKCA mark be compulsory for goods placed on the GB market. And even then, the new UKCA mark can be applied via labels or on the product’s documentation until the end of 2022. From Jan 2023 it must be “permanently attached”. Artwork and further guidance is here.

So suppliers and manufacturers have one year to get their CA documentation sorted out. Do we really think this is going to happen?

[Bmblbzzz]

That's a clear explanation. So rules of origin tariffs were comimg anyway, regardless of Brexit. The German recumbent firms Hase and HP Velotechnic will be clobbered by this because less than 55% of their bikes are made in Germany.

Agree: tariffs were coming from the EU anyway.

I'm lost: please can someone explain. How will consumers in Member States be affected by the changes?

Thanks

Jonathan

I think what it means, in very simple terms is:
A Mercian can probably be sold to a consumer in EU at 0% import duty, because the UK-made frame will be at least 55% of the total value.
A Brompton might meet this threshold or might not. If it does not, it will face duties between 14% and 50% depending on what is made where.
If at some point in the future, the UK should decide to reduce or remove the duties levied on bikes imported from East Asian countries, these bikes will be cheaper in the UK than in EU. But if an enterprising business were to import such bikes and sell them to the EU as eg Dawes or Falcon, they would be subject to the applicable duties on entering the EU.
It also means that a British bike like a Thorn or White, which is designed in UK but substantially made in China or Taiwan (or Vietnam or wherever), will face 14% duty when sold in EU.
And a European bike like a Cinelli will face the same duties when sold in UK.

[Jdsk]

Thank you.

I'll try and get my mind round that.

Jonathan