More Schwalbe Marathon Woes

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geomannie
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More Schwalbe Marathon Woes

Post by geomannie »

Back in December simonineaston posted about poor bead wires in Schwalbe Marathon tyres.
viewtopic.php?p=1662671&hilit=Schwalbe+ ... n#p1662671

I am now posting to express my equal frustration with a similar problem. My wife's bike recently experienced a series of repeated rapid punctures. I went through the usual hoops, embedded objects, new rim tape, new tube etc. Nothing apparent. After the third blow out I went over the tyre inch by inch, to find a 9mm sidewall slit just above the bead, only visible on flexing. On pumping the tyre, this was observed to bulge.

The tread has years of life but the tyre (only 3years moderate use) is useless. I am p*ssed. This has never happened before on any tyre I have owned.

Be warned about Schwalbe Marathons.
IMG_20220119_100705218_HDR.jpg
geomannie
Jdsk
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Re: More Schwalbe Marathon Woes

Post by Jdsk »

Which type of Marathon is that, please?

Thanks

Jonathan
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simonineaston
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Re: More Schwalbe Marathon Woes

Post by simonineaston »

I just bought a pair of Marathon Racers, which get a mixed-but-generally-positive review at bicyclerollingresistancedotcom... I await them with excitement! re December's faulty Marathon, I cut off the offending wire and am cautiously using the tyre once more - there was nothing else wrong with it so it seemed a shame to waste it.
PS Does anyone on this forum subscribe to the premium version of bicyclerollingresistance?
S
(on the look out for Armageddon, on board a Brompton nano & ever-changing Moultons)
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interestedcp
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Re: More Schwalbe Marathon Woes

Post by interestedcp »

I had similar issues with another brand of tyres some years ago when I went from 28mm to 32 mm tyres on my commuter bike. I am pretty sure it was because I often rode with way too low tyre pressure, since the wider tyres and excellent road masked the problem.
Apparently riding with too low pressure, especially with stiffer tyres, puts tremendous strain on the sidewall because it deforms and flex more than it was designed for.
My problems went way when I started to top up my tyre pressure in due time so I no longer ride with tyre pressure below the recommended minimum as stated on the sidewall.

I am not saying that low tire pressure was the cause of the described tyre problem, just that it could be a possibility.
(edit: typo)
Last edited by interestedcp on 19 Jan 2022, 7:58pm, edited 1 time in total.
--
Regards
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geomannie
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Re: More Schwalbe Marathon Woes

Post by geomannie »

Jdsk wrote: 19 Jan 2022, 1:34pm Which type of Marathon is that, please?

Thanks

Jonathan
Marathon Plus, the indestructable one!
geomannie
Jdsk
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Re: More Schwalbe Marathon Woes

Post by Jdsk »

Thanks

Jonathan
colin54
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Re: More Schwalbe Marathon Woes

Post by colin54 »

On Greenguard Marathons (HS420), I've had issues seating the tyre square on the rim, there is a rubbing strip at the bead which can sit below the rim edge if the tyres have not seated correctly, causing the rim to fret on the sidewall itself, something to look out for perhaps ?
The rubbing strip is just above the split in your picture.
Nu-Fogey
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531colin
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Re: More Schwalbe Marathon Woes

Post by 531colin »

download/file.php?id=83251&mode=view
Thats "backnotes" picture from this thread....viewtopic.php?p=1606403&hilit=flange+split#p1606403
..sorry, I don't know how to post it directly as a picture.
It shows a classic "flange split" or "rim split" where the rim has abraded through the chafing strip on the tyre. You can see a line of ali. deposited on the tyre at the bottom of the picture, which changes into a split in the tyre. This typically happens if the tyre is run under-inflated, or if the chafing strip is misplaced during the tyre construction, or if salt corrosion has made the rim edge rough or abrasive.

However, in geomannie's picture at the top of this thread, I think I can see a line of ali. further down the tyre than the split....there is certainly a line of something grey/silver in colour. Can you have a look and report back please geomannie?

Here is a picture showing that line of ali. on one of my tyres .....where the screwdriver is .....
Image019 by 531colin, on Flickr
Last edited by 531colin on 19 Jan 2022, 6:00pm, edited 5 times in total.
borisface
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Re: More Schwalbe Marathon Woes

Post by borisface »

After multiple similar failures with marathons and my unanswered complaints to schwalbe, I've decided that there are companies that deserve my money more and so I am no longer spending my ill gotten gains on schwalbe tyres. I suggest we all do the same. It's a pity that a once reliable tyre has become anything but.
backnotes
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Re: More Schwalbe Marathon Woes

Post by backnotes »

531colin wrote: 19 Jan 2022, 5:40pm Thats "backnotes" picture from this thread....
Thank you for this unexpected reminder of an unplanned sojourn by the side of the A142 near Soham. I've not had any similar problems before or since with Gatorskins on the same rim, so my money is on a bad batch, but I will now carefully check the rim edges as well - thanks!
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531colin
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Re: More Schwalbe Marathon Woes

Post by 531colin »

backnotes wrote: 19 Jan 2022, 6:06pm
531colin wrote: 19 Jan 2022, 5:40pm Thats "backnotes" picture from this thread....
Thank you for this unexpected reminder of an unplanned sojourn by the side of the A142 near Soham. I've not had any similar problems before or since with Gatorskins on the same rim, so my money is on a bad batch, but I will now carefully check the rim edges as well - thanks!
There are loads of threads about flange (or rim) splits....yours was the first really good picture I came across!
Jodel
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Re: More Schwalbe Marathon Woes

Post by Jodel »

I've used Marathon Plus tyres for more than 10 years with no issues. I've had one puncture on a ordinary Marathon and none at all with a Marathon Plus. It's not good to learn that the sidewalls on these tyres may be a bit suspect.

I use the MP on my tandem and have the latest e-bike type fitted. The tyres have covered about 2,000 miles in the 12 months since they were fitted and look as good as new. Apparently, these e-bike tyres have 'anti-ageing' sidewalls, so perhaps Schwalbe have modified the construction to address this issue?

I'm interested in the comments regarding using these tyres at low pressure. How low is 'low'? I don't always agree with the views expressed by Andy Blance at Thorn cycles, but I do go along with his observation that many riders often use tyre pressures that are far too high. I try to follow the rule that the optimum pressure for the minimum rolling resistance will give a deflection (a flattening of the tyre) of 15% when the bike is loaded.

My tandem has been modified for electric assist and has a rear hub motor. We currently run the 700c x 38 Marathon Plus at 55psi front, 60psi rear and for our all-up weight of 160Kg, that seems to give quite a supple ride even on the MP. We have tried much higher pressures, but the ride became very harsh and I could see little benefit in going to higher pressures.

I've not seen any evidence of sidewall abrasion or the alloy deposits highlighted by 531colin in his photo. I use Ryde Sputnik rims which are quite robust and the MP is a very snug fit indeed on those rims.
Jdsk
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Re: More Schwalbe Marathon Woes

Post by Jdsk »

Jodel wrote: 20 Jan 2022, 10:19am I've used Marathon Plus tyres for more than 10 years with no issues. I've had one puncture on a ordinary Marathon and none at all with a Marathon Plus. It's not good to learn that the sidewalls on these tyres may be a bit suspect.

...
We have Marathon Plus on our solo tourers, a couple of tandems, and several other bikes in the family.

I'm watching these failures with interest, but they're nowhere near making me choose something else.

I didn't want to open up the issue of optimal pressures again, but it does look as if it might be directly relevant. We run them at around the maximum marked on the tyre.

Jonathan
Psamathe
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Re: More Schwalbe Marathon Woes

Post by Psamathe »

Jodel wrote: 20 Jan 2022, 10:19am ....
I'm interested in the comments regarding using these tyres at low pressure. How low is 'low'? I don't always agree with the views expressed by Andy Blance at Thorn cycles, but I do go along with his observation that many riders often use tyre pressures that are far too high. I try to follow the rule that the optimum pressure for the minimum rolling resistance will give a deflection (a flattening of the tyre) of 15% when the bike is loaded.
.....
i've used M+ for many years now (20k'ish miles) generally max 4 bar (or lower) and never had any problems. Only ever been replaced due to wearing out tread or a thorn removal where I've damaged the tyre.

Ian
simonhill
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Re: More Schwalbe Marathon Woes

Post by simonhill »

Marathon Originals: over the years, I have used the last 3 versions, culminating in the current Greenguard.

Marathon Supremes, been using since 2016.

Never had a problem with them except when I slipped down a pothole and skinned the sidewall of my rear Supreme.

We have had a few reports of problems and often it is someone who has multiple problems. Plenty of reports with no problems and (presumably) plenty with no report and no problem.

Is there a problem and if so what is the scale of it?
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