Fixing A Safe To Thermalite Wall Blocks

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NATURAL ANKLING
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Fixing A Safe To Thermalite Wall Blocks

Post by NATURAL ANKLING »

Hi,
So house is 80's reverse level detatched.
Entry lookes like bungalow, then beds downstairs, rear looks conventional detatched house.
All internal walls are thermalite.
There does not appear to be a supporting wall but ocupant says yes, I just tapped walls with my fingers and they sound hollow, there is maybe a lintel above a door, but I dont want to penetrate that.
I want to mount a safe 230 x 170 x 170 MM. (to store password book etc)
Safe is 5 KG approx.
Under floor safe would be ok for me but ocupant at mid seventies has dodgy knees.

Only idea I have come up with is two drill right through an internal wall and use a metal plate on the other side of safe with long studs / bolts.
Ok so you could still remove safe with a sledge hammer if so inclined.
It will be mounted high up and accessed with a sturdy two step ladder, the higher the better as removal will prove difficult up high.

Ideas?
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NATURAL ANKLING
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Re: Fixing A Safe To Thermalite Wall Blocks

Post by NATURAL ANKLING »

Hi,
Whats the most secure Key Safe, type of key?
Hard to drill out?
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Carlton green
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Re: Fixing A Safe To Thermalite Wall Blocks

Post by Carlton green »

I hear what you say above knees but I think that a floor safe, together with some revised approach to access would be best. A few alternative body positions come to my mind and then there’s simply sitting on a chair and using simple mobility aids (like a grabber) to manipulate the door and safe contents. Being on a step ladder isn’t necessarily a good idea for older folk …

I haven’t got a safe (maybe I should have but I don’t believe that I’ve anything of value) but if I had a safe then it’s best defence is in both being invisible and being positioned in an unlikely place. The internal walls will all be soft thermo-brick and a safe could be ripped out of them. I’m wondering about a small and concealed compartment in a heavy piece of furniture. A simple key is, I think, enough to prevent casual theft and the determined theft will always get what they want. Someone finding a safe key will look for a safe …

With luck you’ll get better answers, I hope that I’ve given you a start.
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NATURAL ANKLING
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Re: Fixing A Safe To Thermalite Wall Blocks

Post by NATURAL ANKLING »

Hi,
Yes I prefer a hidden floor safe.
Key would always be on the person when not at home.
Yes I hear what you say about the step ladder.
They are already using a single step platform, those nasty cheap A4 sized things.
They are also climbing the stairs many times a day.
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Carlton green
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Re: Fixing A Safe To Thermalite Wall Blocks

Post by Carlton green »

The elderly sometimes fall down stairs, stuff happens but a slip on stairs can be inconsequential and you’ve a banister to hold onto. Momentary loss of balance - easy done - and slipping off of steps can result in a sudden uncontrolled fall and broken old bones. What someone feels that they can safely enough do now may be either incorrect or very changed in just a few years - best to design out actual, unrealised and future hazards now. A thief will happily stand on a chair and prise something out of the wall, the greater height isn’t a significant obstacle to him - or rather it certainly wouldn’t be to me.

Consider where the safe or simple locked box could be positioned out of sight and out of thought. You can’t open a safe or simple locked (and secured) box that you haven’t discovered … For potential positioning several ideas come to mind but obviously I’m not going to share them on a public platform like this.
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tim-b
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Re: Fixing A Safe To Thermalite Wall Blocks

Post by tim-b »

I'd sink it into the wall and screw through from the sides, top and bottom. It's easier to conceal and less easy to attack with tools
The average burglar will do a quick toss-everything search and be gone, possibly without noticing a concealed safe

I'd be concerned about the steps up/elderly interface as other posters are
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rjb
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Re: Fixing A Safe To Thermalite Wall Blocks

Post by rjb »

Safes which have a front resembling a 13amp double socket are available. You could leave an appliance plugged in to disguise it. :wink:
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Mick F
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Re: Fixing A Safe To Thermalite Wall Blocks

Post by Mick F »

NATURAL ANKLING wrote: 2 Dec 2022, 10:17pm Hi,
Whats the most secure Key Safe, type of key?
Hard to drill out?
I have more than a passing acquaintance with key safes from my time in the RN.
We used a small safe maybe 6" wide by 4 or 5" tall, and maybe 2" deep. There was a wooden insert with cup hooks for the confidential and secret keys.

The locks were combination ones and almost bullet proof.
Turn it left to gather up all the wheels, and stop at the first number.
Turn it twice to the right and stop at the second number.
Turn it once to the left for the third number, then right to align the zero, then the latch should drop in and you turn to the left to lift the bolt, and open the door.
To lock, you spin the dial.

The standard combination was 40/50/60 but each safe had an insert key.
You opened the safe as usual, then locked it with the door open.
Then use the 40/50/60 on a line to the left of the main line, and then you could insert the key. This released the tumblers.
Then, set the numbers you want to use.

In one job I had in Scotland, we used Fred's birthday! 25/10/50. :D
Every six months, you have to change the numbers, so we altered it to 35/20/60 - then six months later to 45/30/70 .......... then 55/40/80. I left that job soon after then, so I have no idea what the numbers are now.

The locks looked very much like this.
image.png
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reohn2
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Re: Fixing A Safe To Thermalite Wall Blocks

Post by reohn2 »

NA
The wall in question if it is a supporting wall and sounding hollow,is most likely drylined ie;Thermolite or clinker block with plasterboard stuck on witb plaster adhesive 'dabs',going off the '80's built house.
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NATURAL ANKLING
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Re: Fixing A Safe To Thermalite Wall Blocks

Post by NATURAL ANKLING »

Hi,
reohn2 wrote: 3 Dec 2022, 9:36am NA
The wall in question if it is a supporting wall and sounding hollow,is most likely drylined ie;Thermolite or clinker block with plasterboard stuck on witb plaster adhesive 'dabs',going off the '80's built house.
So do so-called supporting walls, are they constructed with thermal light blocks?
I did a brief look and was looking at seven Newton metres for thermal light?
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NATURAL ANKLING
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Re: Fixing A Safe To Thermalite Wall Blocks

Post by NATURAL ANKLING »

Hi,
Okay so I'm going to scrap the high-level safe for safety reasons.
I think concealed safe re-inforced with something metal which makes it difficult to remove from where it is fitted.
Thanks for all your comments.
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reohn2
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Re: Fixing A Safe To Thermalite Wall Blocks

Post by reohn2 »

NATURAL ANKLING wrote: 3 Dec 2022, 10:07am , are they constructed with thermal light blocks?
Yes
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Psamathe
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Re: Fixing A Safe To Thermalite Wall Blocks

Post by Psamathe »

NATURAL ANKLING wrote: 2 Dec 2022, 10:15pm .... (to store password book etc)
Safe is 5 KG approx.
...
A safe to burglars will be like honey to bees - big statement there is something valuable inside. If it's small documents like a password book then e.g. in the middle of a pile of magazines or in a jar marked "coffee" on a kitchen shelf.

Ian
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NATURAL ANKLING
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Re: Fixing A Safe To Thermalite Wall Blocks

Post by NATURAL ANKLING »

Hi,
But the cornflake packet, and the peas in the freezer stuffed with Coke or diamonds, are well known to crooks.
If you don't have a safe what do you have?
I'm talking now of a concealed safe of course.
Are you going to trust to luck that your password book is not found amongst the jam and the coffee jar.

How you record your passwords and backups of course and keep them safe is another question for another post.
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thirdcrank
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Re: Fixing A Safe To Thermalite Wall Blocks

Post by thirdcrank »

NATURAL ANKLING wrote: 4 Dec 2022, 12:11pm Hi,
But the cornflake packet, and the peas in the freezer stuffed with Coke or diamonds, are well known to crooks.
If you don't have a safe what do you have?
I'm talking now of a concealed safe of course.
Are you going to trust to luck that your password book is not found amongst the jam and the coffee jar.

How you record your passwords and backups of course and keep them safe is another question for another post.
I/m way, way out of date and the days when bogus officials conned the elderly into revealing where their cash was stashed may be long-gone. Going only by media reports which may hype things up, an increasing number of intruders seem to use violence or threats to get older people to hand over their savings etc. I don't know the solution because if there's nothing to hand over, the intruder may be hard to convince.

Are you sure your help is appreciated? It may well be the people involved already have their own system for hiding stuff. If this is somebody elderly who is likely to need increasing support, consider Lasting Powers of Attorney while they still have the capacity to confirm their trust in you or somebody else. Then, the appointed "Attorney" can look after a lot on their behalf
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