Awkward junction - advice wanted

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Nearholmer
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Re: Left Turn And Busses

Post by Nearholmer »

That looks like one of those cycle lanes that isn’t, because everyone believes it’s a parking bay.

That isn’t a shared path sign, which would be circular, and show two pedestrians and a bike.
703882BB-E140-403A-8AA4-AD43D66D3182.jpeg
Although, I confess that I’m not totally clear from the position of the sign whether the recommendation is to cycle on the pavement, the not-cycle-lane, or what.
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Cowsham
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Re: Left Turn And Busses

Post by Cowsham »

Jdsk wrote: 26 Mar 2023, 4:09pm
Cowsham wrote: 26 Mar 2023, 4:01pm
Jdsk wrote: 26 Mar 2023, 3:50pm Image

Yes, isn't that one for a cycle lane rather than a "shared use footpath"?
If so it's very confusing with it being on the inside of the footpath -- I think the car drivers are a bit confused as well -- I didn't see the cycle lane cos there's so many cars parked on top of it. At least the sign before at previous junction showed the 4 types of vehicles allowed to be on the 'full width' lane. This one only shows cycles.
I don't see anything strange about that... it probably means cycles only.

And a different sign would be used to indicate a "shared use footpath".

Jonathan
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Cowsham
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Re: Left Turn And Busses

Post by Cowsham »

jrs665 wrote: 26 Mar 2023, 4:14pm
Cowsham wrote: 26 Mar 2023, 4:03pm
jrs665 wrote: 26 Mar 2023, 3:58pm

Yes, it is for a cycle lane on the road, there is also one leading upto the junction which continues after the junction at the picture
I'd deem it too dangerous to use so I'd be on the footpath anyway -- illegal or not.
That would be awkward as no pedestrian crossing for the road on the left, or the road on the right
Agreed it's a terrible road layout.
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Bmblbzzz
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Re: Left Turn And Busses

Post by Bmblbzzz »

I think if possible I'd be looking for a different route! But you've probably tried that already.
Pete Owens
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Re: Left Turn And Busses

Post by Pete Owens »

jrs665 wrote: 25 Mar 2023, 11:34pm
Jdsk wrote: 25 Mar 2023, 10:10am Welcome.

I agree with jgurney.

Please could you add a photo, this might be easiest done with Google StreetView.

Jonathan
https://www.instantstreetview.com/@55.9 ... oZDA0EBe8w

Image
In general, where there are directional lane markings it is usually best to ride in the centre of the left most lane marked for your direction. Or if there are two directions marked for one lane to ride slightly to the left or to the right of the centre to make clear where you are heading. Do not under any circumstance be concerned about whether other drivers might be annoyed by your existence. It is not safe to overtake on that stretch so if your positioning makes that clear to other drivers you are doing the right thing. If on the other hand you try to keep out of their way by riding to the left you are effectively indicating an intention to turn left so are in inviting left turning drivers to overtake; you really really don't want them to do that.

In this particular circumstance the bus and left turn lane is not to the left of any lane for left turning traffic, and there doesn't appear to be a LH filter on the lights. So long as you keep to the right half of the lane it might be OK though I wouldn't advise it. You need to be be aware that other road users will quite reasonably assume you are turning left from a left turn lane.

If there was a bus and cycle lane approaching the junction (as there appears to be in the opposite direction) then you should take it as implicit that the straight ahead also applied to cycles and any other legitimate users of the lane, but that appears not to be the case here. The purpose appears to be to allow buses to progress from the bus stop so the signage only applies to buses.

It looks as if at some point in the past there was a narrow painted cycle lane on the left. If that is still the case you should avoid riding in ir unless you want to be left hooked.
Pete Owens
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Re: Left Turn And Busses

Post by Pete Owens »

Nearholmer wrote: 26 Mar 2023, 4:36pm
703882BB-E140-403A-8AA4-AD43D66D3182.jpeg

Although, I confess that I’m not totally clear from the position of the sign whether the recommendation is to cycle on the pavement, the not-cycle-lane, or what.
The sign indicates an advisory cycle lane (you can see the start of it under the parked cars) .

https://assets.publishing.service.gov.u ... -signs.pdf
Route recommended for pedal cycles on the main carriageway of a road. This may be marked as an advisory pedal cycle lane
Nearholmer
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Re: Left Turn And Busses

Post by Nearholmer »

It is all very confusing, and potentially dangerous, but if confronted with it, I think I would behave as if I were a (very slow and underpowered) car, plugging ahead in the ahead lane. At least that is unambiguous.

That would work fine if the cycle lane beyond the junction wasn't blocked by parked cars, because that’s the natural place to make for to slow down, get your breath back and let the queue behind you get past.

since it is blocked, and if I was holding a queue, I would probably make for the start of it, wait, and let people pass before continuing.
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Cowsham
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Re: Left Turn And Busses

Post by Cowsham »

Yep -- just use a bit of common sense in case other road users aren't using theirs. There could be a numbty at large so you could be in the right but dead right, it's not the way natural selection is supposed to work.
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Bmblbzzz
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Re: Left Turn And Busses

Post by Bmblbzzz »

There are plenty of places where, with a dedicated left turn-only lane, at least half the cyclists in it would nevertheless be heading straight on.* So, especially with the knowledge that buses go straight on from that lane, I don't think drivers will necessarily assume that you are heading left – but it all depends on local habits of drivers and cyclists. And if you're the only local cyclist, that's even tougher.

*An observation not a recommendation.
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Cowsham
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Re: Left Turn And Busses

Post by Cowsham »

There's no pedestrian crossing point at that Kirk brae junction -- how is a pedestrian meant to get across that?
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Bmblbzzz
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Re: Left Turn And Busses

Post by Bmblbzzz »

Like so:
https://www.instantstreetview.com/@55.9 ... M3xElGjn1A

But good point. Also none at Mayfield Road. Anti-pedestrianism alive and well in Edinburgh.
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jrs665
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What did I do wrong?

Post by jrs665 »

What does this car driver think I did wrong?

https://myvideo.nextbase.co.uk/XMPAY
nosmarbaj
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Re: What did I do wrong?

Post by nosmarbaj »

jrs665 wrote: 18 Apr 2023, 12:51am What does this car driver think I did wrong?

https://myvideo.nextbase.co.uk/XMPAY
(Probably just my settings, but the video wouldn't play on Firefox - worked OK on Edge).

Unless the persepctive is misleading, you appear to be cycling almost in the centre of the road, just to the left of the white line, and well to the right of even "primary" position, let alone "secondary". What makes you think the driver actually thought you were doing wrong? You were doing something unusual, s/he may just have been uncertain of your intentions and gave a quick beep to make you aware of their presence.

I would have been further to the left as there seem to be no parked cars or other obstructions for some distance ahead, but I am not arguing about whether you had a right to be cycling in that position, just saying it's unusual.
roberts8
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Re: What did I do wrong?

Post by roberts8 »

Yesterday I was cycling along and was about to turn right so checked in my bar end mirror and could see a car in the distance. A quick double check, signal then manoeuvre. After a few seconds the driver pulled along side and complained I had not looked before positioning.
I assume he had not realised I had a mirror, still it made me think so no bad thing.
Jdsk
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Re: What did I do wrong?

Post by Jdsk »

Is this the same junction that we discussed here?
[threads merged by moderator]

Thanks

Jonathan

(Video fine on Safari on macOS.)
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