English Language - what "Does your head in" ??

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mattheus
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Re: English Language - what "Does your head in" ??

Post by mattheus »

thirdcrank wrote: 17 Mar 2023, 11:04am I've just noticed another of my niggles: "perfectly" to mean "quite" or something similar.

Perhaps the worst case is "perfectly legal" when it means something like "within the law but deplorable."
He.

That's an interesting one. I really like that usage, and use it quite* a lot so I'm intrigued to understand your niggle - whilst defending your right to indulge it!

May I make a couple of points:
- "quite" has multiple meanings (often it means something like slightly *see above).
- the other related usage would be something like "Never jump out of a perfectly good aeroplane." (in the context of recreational parachuting)
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Re: English Language - what "Does your head in" ??

Post by Bmblbzzz »

thirdcrank wrote: 17 Mar 2023, 11:04am I've just noticed another of my niggles: "perfectly" to mean "quite" or something similar.

Perhaps the worst case is "perfectly legal" when it means something like "within the law but deplorable."
Is your objection linguistic or moral? Or both?
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Re: English Language - what "Does your head in" ??

Post by thirdcrank »

Personal prejudice
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Audax67
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Re: English Language - what "Does your head in" ??

Post by Audax67 »

One of the Graun's favourites: making the verb agree with the wrong noun:
The report from House Democrats, citing state department records, says the number of gifts reported by Trump and his family are lower than the number disclosed by previous presidents.
https://www.theguardian.com/us-news/202 ... gn-nations
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horizon
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Re: English Language - what "Does your head in" ??

Post by horizon »

Here's a small but I think largely unnoticed change to UK English:
The SNP candidate that could be Sunak’s secret weapon
That was Katy Balls writing in the Spectator but the use of "that" as a relative pronoun for human beings is fairly universal now. I hate to say that it is an adopted Americanism but I think it is. Obviously Katy Balls considers SNP candidates to be sub-human.

AIUI this is new and who and whom would be the word of choice to give dignity to the human form but do correct me if I am wrong.

(Just to add that I can safely say now that the plural use of There is has now been abandoned completely, even by people who regard themselves as intelligent and well-educated.)
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Cowsham
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Re: English Language - what "Does your head in" ??

Post by Cowsham »

The word "close" must be very confusing for anyone learning English.

When you close the door is it nearly shut or close to shut. Or a jar
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mattheus
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Re: English Language - what "Does your head in" ??

Post by mattheus »

Cowsham wrote: 26 Mar 2023, 9:09pm The word "close" must be very confusing for anyone learning English.

When you close the door is it nearly shut or close to shut. Or a jar
Then there is the description of humidity:

"It's very close today" aaaargh. Does my head in! Fortunately more of my grand parent's generation than my grandchildren's. But it always jars ...
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simonineaston
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Re: English Language - what "Does your head in" ??

Post by simonineaston »

The gradual disappearance of the pronoun an, which is what you're supposed to use before a word that starts with a vowel sound. This tendency began, I think, as part of a general and misguided attempt to emphasise a word or phrase, usually due to the speaker over estimating their self importance or else wishing to sound posh, eg Masterchef contestants. "Today Greg, I will be preparing for you a Omelette Arnold Bennett... I'm serving it alongside a humus of beetroot and peanut and a Hirondelle Syllabub..."
I wish they'd just get on with teaching English grammar, spelling and punctuation properly across all our schools, then when kids rock up on Masterchef, they coud hold their heads up high and pronounce an (and other things) properly and confidently :-)
Last edited by simonineaston on 27 Mar 2023, 11:46am, edited 1 time in total.
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Jdsk
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Re: English Language - what "Does your head in" ??

Post by Jdsk »

simonineaston wrote: 27 Mar 2023, 11:41am The gradual disappearance of the pronoun an, which is what you're supposed to use before a word that starts with a vowel sound. This tendency began, I think, as part of a general and misguided attempt to emphasise a word or phrase, usually due to the speaker over estimating their self importance or else wishing to sound posh, eg Masterchef contestants. "Today Greg, I will be preparing for you a Omelette Arnold Bennett... I'm serving it alongside a humus of beetroot and peanut and a Hirondelle Syllabub..."
I wish they'd just get on with teaching English grammar, spelling and punctuation properly across all our schools...
Has there been a gradual disappearance, or does usage simply vary?

Thanks

Jonathan
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simonineaston
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Re: English Language - what "Does your head in" ??

Post by simonineaston »

Dunno - it's a bit like spotting cars - once your friend buys a Jeep Renegade, suddenly whereas you've never seen one before, they're everywhere!
They're everywhere !!
They're everywhere !!
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Re: English Language - what "Does your head in" ??

Post by Bmblbzzz »

I agree that "an" is becoming less common. But I don't know that it's an attempt to emphasise a word, more just part of a pronunciation shift.
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Re: English Language - what "Does your head in" ??

Post by Jdsk »

simonineaston wrote: 27 Mar 2023, 11:50am Dunno - it's a bit like spotting cars - once your friend buys a Jeep Renegade, suddenly whereas you've never seen one before, they're everywhere!IMG_1192.jpg
: - )

There's also the effect of us being exposed to more use by other users....

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mattheus
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Re: English Language - what "Does your head in" ??

Post by mattheus »

simonineaston wrote: 27 Mar 2023, 11:41am The gradual disappearance of the pronoun an, which is what you're supposed to use before a word that starts with a vowel sound. This tendency began, I think, as part of a general and misguided attempt to emphasise a word or phrase, usually due to the speaker over estimating their self importance or else wishing to sound posh, eg Masterchef contestants. "Today Greg, I will be preparing for you a Omelette Arnold Bennett... I'm serving it alongside a humus of beetroot and peanut and a Hirondelle Syllabub..."
I think you undermine your point if you think people should be saying
an humus
or an Hirondelle* ..
My dear chap!

*that's a bike brand, n'est-ce pas??
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simonineaston
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Re: English Language - what "Does your head in" ??

Post by simonineaston »

I think it's a swallow :-)
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Re: English Language - what "Does your head in" ??

Post by Bmblbzzz »

An Hirondelle (being French, it has a silent h) should be clad in Schwalbe tyres.
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