School shootings... how awful

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simonineaston
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School shootings... how awful

Post by simonineaston »

We read with a sinking feeling, of another school shooting in the US - those poor poor parents! I'd heard that these dreadful events are increasingly common but I have no idea exactly how common until I visited the K12 website which is keeping count... this year, it's about one a day. I can barely get my head round that.
https://k12ssdb.org/all-shootings
S
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Mike Sales
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Re: School shootings... how awful

Post by Mike Sales »

I am wondering if there is something about US society, not just insane gun laws. Are there such a number of simmering killers in the UK, but they just can't get hold of the guns? Surely not.
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reohn2
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Re: School shootings... how awful

Post by reohn2 »

Increasingly I look across the pond and conclude that the US is a difunctional society(kettle calling pan I know,though only by degree),by complete contrast,only yesterday I read of a school principal in Florida being forced to resign over "exposing" 11 to 13year olds to a picture of Michelangelo's statue of David,on the grounds it was pornagraphic.
Bizarre doesn't begin to describe such an outlook:- https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/world-europe-65087218
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Jdsk
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Re: School shootings... how awful

Post by Jdsk »

Mike Sales wrote: 28 Mar 2023, 11:16am I am wondering if there is something about US society, not just insane gun laws. Are there such a number of simmering killers in the UK, but they just can't get hold of the guns? Surely not.
The USA has roughly similar rates of criminal acts and violence to similar countries. But the extraordinary availability of guns turns these into many more serious injuries and deaths. It's possible that no other deep societal dysfunction is needed to explain the statistics.

Jonathan
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simonineaston
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Re: School shootings... how awful

Post by simonineaston »

There is though, something partic. upsetting, unnecessary and deeply sad, about school shootings... their little lives snuffed out, when hardly begun and the grief afflicted on the parents (who may or may not be gun owners themselves, for what good it did them), which will never go away...
S
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Vorpal
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Re: School shootings... how awful

Post by Vorpal »

There is a gun culture there, where a large percentage of the population has had some exposure to firearms; handled them, used them, etc., even if it was just shooting drink cans off a wall at grandpa's farm or something.

When I was young in the Midwestern USA. I would estimate that 80% of my peers had BB guns, and only a few less had gone hunting or shot a rifle or handgun at some point.

Add to that, that the few places that regulate firearms are surrounded by those that don't.

The result is a natural outcome of the system.

Gun violence recently overtook traffic violence as the leading cause of death for children and adolescents in the USA. It is horribly sad and tragic.
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axel_knutt
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Re: School shootings... how awful

Post by axel_knutt »

simonineaston wrote: 28 Mar 2023, 11:10amit's about one a day
And nearer two a day when you include non-school.

What always puzzles me is how the media pick the odd one to publicise.
reohn2 wrote: 28 Mar 2023, 11:21am Increasingly I look across the pond and conclude that the US is a difunctional society
There was a program about Social Prescribing on Radio 4 a few minutes ago. Basically, if you fix the dysfunctional society you'll fix the mental health epidemic, but the presciptions are political, not just social. If someone's suicidal because the house is black with mould, the solution is to fix the mould, not a ticket to a social club, or a packet of pills, or gaslighting from a therapist telling you it's all about your potty training.
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rualexander
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Re: School shootings... how awful

Post by rualexander »

Seems to have gone up dramatically in the past few years though, from the data in the OP's link.
Has gun accessibility also gone up dramatically?
Jdsk
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Re: School shootings... how awful

Post by Jdsk »

The best approach that I can see is to move this to the domain of public health. There's been very little improvement when it's been handled through disputes over constitutional rights or the idea of "defending oneself". The rate of deaths and serious injuries to children is massive and is probably the best place to start. And with "accidents" rather than "crimes" or "violence".

Unfortunately publicly funded research was blocked for some time by the effective ban on funding.

"Treating Gun Violence with a Public Health Approach":
https://www.amjmed.com/article/S0002-93 ... 2/fulltext

Jonathan
reohn2
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Re: School shootings... how awful

Post by reohn2 »

axel_knutt wrote: 28 Mar 2023, 12:16pm
reohn2 wrote: 28 Mar 2023, 11:21am Increasingly I look across the pond and conclude that the US is a difunctional society
There was a program about Social Prescribing on Radio 4 a few minutes ago. Basically, if you fix the dysfunctional society you'll fix the mental health epidemic, but the presciptions are political, not just social. If someone's suicidal because the house is black with mould, the solution is to fix the mould, not a ticket to a social club, or a packet of pills, or gaslighting from a therapist telling you it's all about your potty training.
I couldn't agree more,and similarly so people working all the hours god sends and can barely make ends meet.I classic case of dysfunction is to tell such people they should work harder or get a better job :?
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Audax67
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Re: School shootings... how awful

Post by Audax67 »

rualexander wrote: 28 Mar 2023, 12:51pm Seems to have gone up dramatically in the past few years though, from the data in the OP's link.
I'd expect that the increase parallels the growth of social media, which have become the greatest amplifier of extreme ideas and hate since radio was invented - with the nuance that while mass-diffusion radio was always state-controlled or -regulated, with the Internet everyone can be their own demagogue, or be influenced by others' deeds strongly enough to imitate them.
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reohn2
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Re: School shootings... how awful

Post by reohn2 »

Audax67 wrote: 28 Mar 2023, 1:51pm
rualexander wrote: 28 Mar 2023, 12:51pm Seems to have gone up dramatically in the past few years though, from the data in the OP's link.
I'd expect that the increase parallels the growth of social media, which have become the greatest amplifier of extreme ideas and hate since radio was invented - with the nuance that while mass-diffusion radio was always state-controlled or -regulated, with the Internet everyone can be their own demagogue, or be influenced by others' deeds strongly enough to imitate them.
Yes,suicide in the young seems to follow that narrative unfortunately.
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Audax67
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Re: School shootings... how awful

Post by Audax67 »

Including "suicide by cop".
Have we got time for another cuppa?
reohn2
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Re: School shootings... how awful

Post by reohn2 »

axel_knutt wrote: 28 Mar 2023, 12:16pm There was a program about Social Prescribing on Radio 4 a few minutes ago. Basically, if you fix the dysfunctional society you'll fix the mental health epidemic, but the presciptions are political, not just social. If someone's suicidal because the house is black with mould, the solution is to fix the mould, not a ticket to a social club, or a packet of pills, or gaslighting from a therapist telling you it's all about your potty training.
I've just read this in the Guardian:- https://www.theguardian.com/world/2023/ ... gees-homes
It seems some people in charge believe refugees deserve ill health and even death.
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reohn2
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Re: School shootings... how awful

Post by reohn2 »

Audax67 wrote: 28 Mar 2023, 2:16pm Including "suicide by cop".
Yer not wrong.
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