UK energy

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Jdsk
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Re: UK energy

Post by Jdsk »

"Powering Up Britain":
https://www.gov.uk/government/publicati ... up-britain

That's the new national energy strategy.

Doesn't seem to be going down well with experts who understand what's needed in a national energy strategy.

Jonathan
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al_yrpal
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Re: UK energy

Post by al_yrpal »

Nor with the public who seemingly are going to have a fine on them (in addition to the present so called 'green' one and the VAT) for daring to have a gas boiler.

All thought up by a numpty good at quoting bits of latin and his Mrs with her degree in theatre studies!

You couldnt make it up!

Al
Reuse, recycle, thus do your bit to save the planet.... Get stuff at auctions, Dump, Charity Shops, Facebook Marketplace, Ebay, Car Boots. Choose an Old House, and a Banger ..... And cycle as often as you can......
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[XAP]Bob
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Re: UK energy

Post by [XAP]Bob »

Nor with the public who seemingly are going to have a fine on them (in addition to the present so called 'green' one and the VAT) for daring to have a gas boiler.

All thought up by a numpty good at quoting bits of latin and his Mrs with her degree in theatre studies!

You couldnt make it up!

Al
A fine - that's the degree to which you're shilling for the gas companies?
Good to know
A shortcut has to be a challenge, otherwise it would just be the way. No situation is so dire that panic cannot make it worse.
There are two kinds of people in this world: those can extrapolate from incomplete data.
Biospace
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Re: UK energy

Post by Biospace »

al_yrpal wrote: 30 Mar 2023, 12:59pm Nor with the public who seemingly are going to have a fine on them (in addition to the present so called 'green' one and the VAT) for daring to have a gas boiler.
I think what has been announced is that the Skidmore review recommendations https://lordslibrary.parliament.uk/miss ... -net-zero/ will be used for future energy policies, including domestic pricing.

This means that the cost of electricity will be less affected by the price of gas. In recent months electricity prices have been pegged significantly higher than the average cost to produce (lower because of the large amounts of wind and solar power now feeding the UK grid) and this will be reduced so that the cost of electricity more fairly represents its true cost rather than the cost of gas.

Allowing people to benefit from the lower and much more stable costs of renewable energies makes sense to me.
ANTONISH
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Re: UK energy

Post by ANTONISH »

al_yrpal wrote: 30 Mar 2023, 12:59pm Nor with the public who seemingly are going to have a fine on them (in addition to the present so called 'green' one and the VAT) for daring to have a gas boiler.

All thought up by a numpty good at quoting bits of latin and his Mrs with her degree in theatre studies!

You couldnt make it up!

Al
This will impinge heavily on the poorer gas consumers who are unable to afford the expensive alternatives to a gas boiler or indeed to replace a gas boiler.
This is a punishment tax for the crime of being poor.
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al_yrpal
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Re: UK energy

Post by al_yrpal »

The people that should be fined are the people that havent insulated their lofts.

The lady over the road was complaining that her house was very cold so she was getting larger radiators fitted. I had noticed in the recent snow that her house roof thawed out well before anyone else so I asked whether her loft was insulated. It wasnt! I said insulating it would probably solve her problem. Her answer was that she lived in a much bigger house and her loft was full of stuff and therefore couldnt be touched.

This is the sort of rank stupidity that we are up against.

Insulate Britain have it right as far as I am concerned. Air source heat pumps wont work on our poorly insulated homes in very cold conditions. The subsidies should be directed at insulation not heat pumps.

Al
Reuse, recycle, thus do your bit to save the planet.... Get stuff at auctions, Dump, Charity Shops, Facebook Marketplace, Ebay, Car Boots. Choose an Old House, and a Banger ..... And cycle as often as you can......
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[XAP]Bob
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Re: UK energy

Post by [XAP]Bob »

al_yrpal wrote: 31 Mar 2023, 11:38am Insulate Britain have it right as far as I am concerned. Air source heat pumps wont work on our poorly insulated homes in very cold conditions. The subsidies should be directed at insulation not heat pumps.
Yes they have it right - though heat pumps will still work, but why bother getting any heat into a building which just throws it all away.

There is no reason not to have subsidies for both.
A shortcut has to be a challenge, otherwise it would just be the way. No situation is so dire that panic cannot make it worse.
There are two kinds of people in this world: those can extrapolate from incomplete data.
Biospace
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Re: UK energy

Post by Biospace »

Below are graphs for Brent Crude Oil and UK Gas prices, both over a 10 year period. I don't see much effect of Germany switching off its last nuclear power generation this weekend in any fossil fuel prices, but the markets have known about this for a long time.

Screenshot 2023-04-26 at 11.50.20.png
Screenshot 2023-04-26 at 11.58.05.png

Instead, the headlines have read "French Winter Power Twice as Pricey as Germany’s on Nuclear Woes" as France continues to struggle with the reliability of its ageing, increasingly expensive nuclear power. https://www.energyconnects.com/news/uti ... lear-woes/

While the UK talks up nuclear energy, reality is rather different with at most two plants in the offing. We appear to continue be all at sea with our energy policies, which recently has cost us all dearly but with fast-evolving alternative energies it would be good to see the upside (if there is one) of our procrastination.

In addition to Germany, Austria, Belgium, Denmark, Italy, Portugal and Spain are EU nations which already have ended nuclear generation or plan to phase it out, whereas Bulgaria, Croatia, Czechia, Finland, Hungary, Poland, Romania, Slovakia and Slovenia together with France remain keen to continue using the technology.
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mjr
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Re: UK energy

Post by mjr »

ANTONISH wrote: 31 Mar 2023, 11:21am This will impinge heavily on the poorer gas consumers who are unable to afford the expensive alternatives to a gas boiler or indeed to replace a gas boiler.
This is a punishment tax for the crime of being poor.
Which is better than the current punishment tax for the crime of giving a toss about the future habitability of the planet. Both carrot and stick are needed now: make insulation and renewable heating cheaper and stop subsidising gas and oil burners.
MJR, mostly pedalling 3-speed roadsters. KL+West Norfolk BUG incl social easy rides http://www.klwnbug.co.uk
All the above is CC-By-SA and no other implied copyright license to Cycle magazine.
ANTONISH
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Re: UK energy

Post by ANTONISH »

mjr wrote: 26 Apr 2023, 1:03pm
ANTONISH wrote: 31 Mar 2023, 11:21am This will impinge heavily on the poorer gas consumers who are unable to afford the expensive alternatives to a gas boiler or indeed to replace a gas boiler.
This is a punishment tax for the crime of being poor.
Which is better than the current punishment tax for the crime of giving a toss about the future habitability of the planet. Both carrot and stick are needed now: make insulation and renewable heating cheaper and stop subsidising gas and oil burners.
What would be your suggestion for carrot and stick applied to those people with virtually zero assets ?
Such people are probably already consuming less energy ( due to poverty) than more affluent people who can afford the heat pump and upgrade required in your energy utopia.
.
roubaixtuesday
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Re: UK energy

Post by roubaixtuesday »

ANTONISH wrote: 27 Apr 2023, 4:57pm
mjr wrote: 26 Apr 2023, 1:03pm
ANTONISH wrote: 31 Mar 2023, 11:21am This will impinge heavily on the poorer gas consumers who are unable to afford the expensive alternatives to a gas boiler or indeed to replace a gas boiler.
This is a punishment tax for the crime of being poor.
Which is better than the current punishment tax for the crime of giving a toss about the future habitability of the planet. Both carrot and stick are needed now: make insulation and renewable heating cheaper and stop subsidising gas and oil burners.
What would be your suggestion for carrot and stick applied to those people with virtually zero assets ?
Such people are probably already consuming less energy ( due to poverty) than more affluent people who can afford the heat pump and upgrade required in your energy utopia.
.
Various possibilities come immediately to mind. For instance, a low rate for a set amount of electricity useage per property subsidised by a higher rate for large users. Which both protects the vulnerable poor in small houses and incentivises larger users to reduce.

Obviously, subsidies should be available for insulation, again perhaps capped at a modest level.
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853
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Re: UK energy

Post by 853 »

roubaixtuesday wrote: 27 Apr 2023, 5:09pm
ANTONISH wrote: 27 Apr 2023, 4:57pm
What would be your suggestion for carrot and stick applied to those people with virtually zero assets ?
Such people are probably already consuming less energy ( due to poverty) than more affluent people who can afford the heat pump and upgrade required in your energy utopia.
.
Various possibilities come immediately to mind. For instance, a low rate for a set amount of electricity useage per property subsidised by a higher rate for large users. Which both protects the vulnerable poor in small houses and incentivises larger users to reduce.

Obviously, subsidies should be available for insulation, again perhaps capped at a modest level.
All of the above, plus the removal of the standing charge which is a kick in the teeth to frugal, low energy users
roubaixtuesday
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Re: UK energy

Post by roubaixtuesday »

853 wrote: 27 Apr 2023, 6:26pm
All of the above, plus the removal of the standing charge which is a kick in the teeth to frugal, low energy users
Good point.
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mjr
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Re: UK energy

Post by mjr »

ANTONISH wrote: 27 Apr 2023, 4:57pm
mjr wrote: 26 Apr 2023, 1:03pm
ANTONISH wrote: 31 Mar 2023, 11:21am This will impinge heavily on the poorer gas consumers who are unable to afford the expensive alternatives to a gas boiler or indeed to replace a gas boiler.
This is a punishment tax for the crime of being poor.
Which is better than the current punishment tax for the crime of giving a toss about the future habitability of the planet. Both carrot and stick are needed now: make insulation and renewable heating cheaper and stop subsidising gas and oil burners.
What would be your suggestion for carrot and stick applied to those people with virtually zero assets ?
Such people are probably already consuming less energy ( due to poverty) than more affluent people who can afford the heat pump and upgrade required in your energy utopia.
.
Surely it's the ones with near-zero income as well as assets that we need to worry about. Othors have already posted good ideas.
MJR, mostly pedalling 3-speed roadsters. KL+West Norfolk BUG incl social easy rides http://www.klwnbug.co.uk
All the above is CC-By-SA and no other implied copyright license to Cycle magazine.
ANTONISH
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Re: UK energy

Post by ANTONISH »

mjr wrote: 27 Apr 2023, 9:24pm
ANTONISH wrote: 27 Apr 2023, 4:57pm
mjr wrote: 26 Apr 2023, 1:03pm
Which is better than the current punishment tax for the crime of giving a toss about the future habitability of the planet. Both carrot and stick are needed now: make insulation and renewable heating cheaper and stop subsidising gas and oil burners.
What would be your suggestion for carrot and stick applied to those people with virtually zero assets ?
Such people are probably already consuming less energy ( due to poverty) than more affluent people who can afford the heat pump and upgrade required in your energy utopia.
.
Surely it's the ones with near-zero income as well as assets that we need to worry about. Othors have already posted good ideas.
And your carrot and stick for those people?
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