Bringing EU purchased bike into UK

General cycling advice ( NOT technical ! )
UpWrong
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Re: Bringing EU purchased bike into UK

Post by UpWrong »

Definitely shouldn't pay the german VAT on it. Can you get agreement from the shop in advance not to charge you their VAT?
PH
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Re: Bringing EU purchased bike into UK

Post by PH »

UpWrong wrote: 7 Jun 2023, 3:26pm Definitely shouldn't pay the german VAT on it. Can you get agreement from the shop in advance not to charge you their VAT?
No, you have to pay it and re-claim. There is an EU scheme which if a shop is participating in should be fairly straightforward (I have no experience) I don't know if you can reclaim when the retailer isn't in that scheme, theoretically the principal is that you shouldn't pay VAT twice, it's an end user tax, you can't be the end user twice... whether there is a mechanism for turning theory into practice I don't know. If it were a business importing in this way, there's a mechanism for re-claiming on your own VAT returns.
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Re: Bringing EU purchased bike into UK

Post by PH »

Here's the guide to re-claiming VAT. I've only skimmed through it, I don't think it contradicts anything I've already posted...
https://taxation-customs.ec.europa.eu/g ... tors-eu_en
Galactic
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Re: Bringing EU purchased bike into UK

Post by Galactic »

I suspect the picking the bike up and riding it around for a bit may provide a VAT headache. If a bike is bought eg online and sent abroad, the shop can easily demonstrate that the good has been exported outside the EU and that they therefore needn't apply domestic VAT.

However, if a bike is picked up, the shop can't prove it's been exported, so must charge the VAT. That leaves it to the purchaser to deal with all the paperwork.

There may be easements making things simpler, but if I were a bike shop I probably wouldn't know about them, nor would the manufacturer since they probably don't deal with consumers too often.

If ml108 wants to make sure everything is above board and done by the book (rather than just sneaking onto the ferry with their shiny new bike) then the best thing might be to have a chat with the shop/manufacturer (whichever the bike is coming from) and see if they have any ideas of how to cut the Gordian knot of paperwork. I suspect they may suggest something along the lines of: "come and get fitted, take it for a try out and then we'll courier it to you." That way they can sell it ex-VAT and it's a straight forward job (straight forward being relative) for the purchaser to pay for duty and VAT at this end once the package arrives.
Sparky56
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Re: Bringing EU purchased bike into UK

Post by Sparky56 »

You asked the rules about importing used goods -- I believe you have had to have owned it (and used it) for 6 months prior to import to avoid import duty.

I imported a car from Australia via this mechanism. I'd been living there for 18 months etc and drove it back (from India) so had all the passports documentation etc. The only thing that the Dover customs were interested in was whether I was smuggling arms. weren't interested in import duty etc.
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mjr
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Re: Bringing EU purchased bike into UK

Post by mjr »

Galactic wrote: 7 Jun 2023, 4:57pm I suspect the picking the bike up and riding it around for a bit may provide a VAT headache. If a bike is bought eg online and sent abroad, the shop can easily demonstrate that the good has been exported outside the EU and that they therefore needn't apply domestic VAT.
Unless the shop is registered as a "VAT-free shop" for tourists, which seems unlikely for a bike shop, then they have to charge domestic VAT and you reclaim it on exit, no matter how soon you're leaving. Also, things which can't normally go in personal luggage (such as cars) mostly can't be sold VAT-free and I suspect bikes may be the same. See the guide PH linked.

And you need to leave with the purchases basically within three months in any case, so the six month ownership idea to avoid import duty would mean you shouldn't reclaim German VAT.
MJR, mostly pedalling 3-speed roadsters. KL+West Norfolk BUG incl social easy rides http://www.klwnbug.co.uk
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Sparky56
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Re: Bringing EU purchased bike into UK

Post by Sparky56 »

mjr wrote: 7 Jun 2023, 5:23pm
Galactic wrote: 7 Jun 2023, 4:57pm I suspect the picking the bike up and riding it around for a bit may provide a VAT headache. If a bike is bought eg online and sent abroad, the shop can easily demonstrate that the good has been exported outside the EU and that they therefore needn't apply domestic VAT.
Unless the shop is registered as a "VAT-free shop" for tourists, which seems unlikely for a bike shop, then they have to charge domestic VAT and you reclaim it on exit, no matter how soon you're leaving. Also, things which can't normally go in personal luggage (such as cars) mostly can't be sold VAT-free and I suspect bikes may be the same. See the guide PH linked.

And you need to leave with the purchases basically within three months in any case, so the six month ownership idea to avoid import duty would mean you shouldn't reclaim German VAT.
What's the "need to leave with purchases within 3 months" about? Is this a german tax reg for claiming vat back?
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Re: Bringing EU purchased bike into UK

Post by PH »

Sparky56 wrote: 7 Jun 2023, 5:55pm What's the "need to leave with purchases within 3 months" about? Is this a german tax reg for claiming vat back?
EU rather than German and covered in the link I posted upthread.
Sparky56
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Re: Bringing EU purchased bike into UK

Post by Sparky56 »

PH wrote: 7 Jun 2023, 5:59pm
Sparky56 wrote: 7 Jun 2023, 5:55pm What's the "need to leave with purchases within 3 months" about? Is this a german tax reg for claiming vat back?
EU rather than German and covered in the link I posted upthread.
How soon do the goods have to leave the EU?

The goods you buy VAT-free must leave the EU by the end of the third month after that in which you buy them.

Presume this is what you were referring to.

which means that the bike could be used for a tour to non-EU countries, (e.g Turkey, Georgia etc) and then after 6 months could return to Uk having complied with all regulations…..
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mjr
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Re: Bringing EU purchased bike into UK

Post by mjr »

Sparky56 wrote: 7 Jun 2023, 6:21pm [...] the bike could be used for a tour to non-EU countries, (e.g Turkey, Georgia etc) and then after 6 months could return to Uk having complied with all regulations…..
In theory, yes. In practice, it might be difficult to collect the refund from the supplier while touring without a fixed postal address and I don't know whether there's any time limit for it which would hinder waiting until you returned home. Anyway, the OP didn't mention all this about going on tour to Turkey.

German official procedure info, for reference: https://www.zoll.de/EN/Private-individu ... _node.html
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PH
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Re: Bringing EU purchased bike into UK

Post by PH »

Sparky56 wrote: 7 Jun 2023, 6:21pm
PH wrote: 7 Jun 2023, 5:59pm
Sparky56 wrote: 7 Jun 2023, 5:55pm What's the "need to leave with purchases within 3 months" about? Is this a german tax reg for claiming vat back?
EU rather than German and covered in the link I posted upthread.
How soon do the goods have to leave the EU?

The goods you buy VAT-free must leave the EU by the end of the third month after that in which you buy them.

Presume this is what you were referring to.

which means that the bike could be used for a tour to non-EU countries, (e.g Turkey, Georgia etc) and then after 6 months could return to Uk having complied with all regulations…..
From the information in the link, I have no other knowledge on this specific aspect, you need to leave the EU in the timeframe and have to obtain a stamp when you do so.
Whenever you return to the UK, with something you didn't leave with, you are liable for import VAT and any duty applicable. Whether you declare such things or not has always been a matter of debate.
thidwick
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Re: Bringing EU purchased bike into UK

Post by thidwick »

I’ve done it!
We were in the Netherlands when my trusty old bike suffered a frame failure. Chain stay failed at the bottom bracket. Nearby bike shop (always in the Netherlands!) declared it a write-off. As we were enjoying some cycling on our holiday I bought a new bike in the bike shop, rescued a few parts, and junked the remainder (shedding quiet tears…)
The new bike came back to the UK with us, on the van bike rack, and I never even considered any import issues. Sorry.
I don’t feel bad about it though.
Jdsk
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Re: Bringing EU purchased bike into UK

Post by Jdsk »

thidwick wrote: 7 Jun 2023, 7:14pm I’ve done it!
We were in the Netherlands when my trusty old bike suffered a frame failure. Chain stay failed at the bottom bracket. Nearby bike shop (always in the Netherlands!) declared it a write-off. As we were enjoying some cycling on our holiday I bought a new bike in the bike shop, rescued a few parts, and junked the remainder (shedding quiet tears…)
The new bike came back to the UK with us, on the van bike rack, and I never even considered any import issues. Sorry.
I don’t feel bad about it though.
When was that, please?

Jonathan
Sparky56
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Re: Bringing EU purchased bike into UK

Post by Sparky56 »

So if you order it from the shop and get it posted there would be proof of export and you definitely should not pay German vat. I have ordered stuff that way from EU and have not paid vat.
thidwick
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Re: Bringing EU purchased bike into UK

Post by thidwick »

Jdsk wrote: 7 Jun 2023, 7:17pm
thidwick wrote: 7 Jun 2023, 7:14pm I’ve done it!
We were in the Netherlands when my trusty old bike suffered a frame failure. Chain stay failed at the bottom bracket. Nearby bike shop (always in the Netherlands!) declared it a write-off. As we were enjoying some cycling on our holiday I bought a new bike in the bike shop, rescued a few parts, and junked the remainder (shedding quiet tears…)
The new bike came back to the UK with us, on the van bike rack, and I never even considered any import issues. Sorry.
I don’t feel bad about it though.
When was that, please?

Jonathan
About 3 years ago I think.
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