Dead calm:killing in the Med.

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Mike Sales
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Dead calm:killing in the Med.

Post by Mike Sales »

A documentary now showing on BBC 2 shows the horrible inhumanity in the treatment of desperate refugees by Greece, by coastguards and vigilantes. It shames the human race.
I fear that Reform UK's policies would lead to scenes like this in the Channel.
The vast majority of immigrants to the UK are legal, and needed. The few desperate refugees should not be treated like this.
The trite slogan is 'Stop the boats'. Is should be 'Stop the people '
It's the same the whole world over
It's the poor what gets the blame
It's the rich what gets the pleasure
Isn't it a blooming shame?
tim-b
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Joined: 10 Oct 2009, 8:20am

Re: Dead calm:killing in the Med.

Post by tim-b »

I fear that Reform UK's policies would lead to scenes like this in the Channel.
You're making the huge assumption that a) Reform UK will be in any kind of position of power and b) the party likely to be in power would adopt Reform's policies

Nigel Farage doesn't seem to understand that you can't navigate an ocean liner full of refugees from Clacton to Rwanda
~~~~¯\(ツ)/¯~~~~
Mike Sales
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Joined: 7 Mar 2009, 3:31pm

Re: Dead calm:killing in the Med.

Post by Mike Sales »

tim-b wrote: 18 Jun 2024, 7:21am
I fear that Reform UK's policies would lead to scenes like this in the Channel.
You're making the huge assumption that a) Reform UK will be in any kind of position of power and b) the party likely to be in power would adopt Reform's policies

Nigel Farage doesn't seem to understand that you can't navigate an ocean liner full of refugees from Clacton to Rwanda
Note the conditional 'would'.
It's the same the whole world over
It's the poor what gets the blame
It's the rich what gets the pleasure
Isn't it a blooming shame?
reohn2
Posts: 45636
Joined: 26 Jun 2009, 8:21pm

Re: Dead calm:killing in the Med.

Post by reohn2 »

tim-b wrote: 18 Jun 2024, 7:21am
I fear that Reform UK's policies would lead to scenes like this in the Channel.
You're making the huge assumption that a) Reform UK will be in any kind of position of power and b) the party likely to be in power would adopt Reform's policies

Nigel Farage doesn't seem to understand that you can't navigate an ocean liner full of refugees from Clacton to Rwanda
That's not to say he and his sycophants wouldn't like to given the chance,eh?
-----------------------------------------------------------
"All we are not stares back at what we are"
W H Auden
tim-b
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Joined: 10 Oct 2009, 8:20am

Re: Dead calm:killing in the Med.

Post by tim-b »

Mike Sales wrote: 18 Jun 2024, 7:41am
tim-b wrote: 18 Jun 2024, 7:21am
I fear that Reform UK's policies would lead to scenes like this in the Channel.
You're making the huge assumption that a) Reform UK will be in any kind of position of power and b) the party likely to be in power would adopt Reform's policies

Nigel Farage doesn't seem to understand that you can't navigate an ocean liner full of refugees from Clacton to Rwanda
Note the conditional 'would'.
I noted the word "fear". You are David Cameron and I claim £5 for spotting your latest project
~~~~¯\(ツ)/¯~~~~
Mike Sales
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Joined: 7 Mar 2009, 3:31pm

Re: Dead calm:killing in the Med.

Post by Mike Sales »

tim-b wrote: 18 Jun 2024, 8:02am
Mike Sales wrote: 18 Jun 2024, 7:41am
tim-b wrote: 18 Jun 2024, 7:21am
You're making the huge assumption that a) Reform UK will be in any kind of position of power and b) the party likely to be in power would adopt Reform's policies

Nigel Farage doesn't seem to understand that you can't navigate an ocean liner full of refugees from Clacton to Rwanda
Note the conditional 'would'.
I noted the word "fear". You are David Cameron and I claim £5 for spotting your latest project
I always try to be pithy.
I am sorry if you have got hold of the wrong end of the stick.
Long version.
I think that if Reform UK's policies on immigration were, by some unlikely mischance, to be implemented, the result would be similar to the scenes depicted by the BBC's documentary on the treatment of refugees by the Greeks.
I hope that you would think this an undesirable outcome.
This was meant to be a criticism of Farage's rabble rousing. You will find such criticism from many political quarters.
It's the same the whole world over
It's the poor what gets the blame
It's the rich what gets the pleasure
Isn't it a blooming shame?
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al_yrpal
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Re: Dead calm:killing in the Med.

Post by al_yrpal »

Had several holidays on the lovely island of Samos which is just a mile from the Turkish coast and which has become a migrant magnet overwhelming the island. But...these reports are terrible, how can people be so cruel?

Al
Reuse, recycle, thus do your bit to save the planet.... Get stuff at auctions, Dump, Charity Shops, Facebook Marketplace, Ebay, Car Boots. Choose an Old House, and a Banger ..... And cycle as often as you can......
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Cugel
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Re: Dead calm:killing in the Med.

Post by Cugel »

al_yrpal wrote: 18 Jun 2024, 9:23am But...these reports are terrible, how can people be so cruel?

Al
*It starts with a certain variety of human nature, akin to that of C9th viking rape&pillage folk. But that ain't enough of itself.

* There's a number of nurture-methods employed on children which can produce a disdain for, and absence of, both empathy and sympathy. See 1950s style violent patriarchy and certain public school regimes as just two of many more examples.

* Various polities (and now the planet as a whole) are subject to a toxic mass media that seeks to promote and amplify both of the above, for all sorts of "reasons". Some nations also have long and toxic histories/myths and associated evil traditions. (See various British Empire traditions for details) on which such media feeds.

*****************

So, if one doesn't wish to fall into Farago-thunk, it may be necessary to: be more introspective (know thyself and hence others); forget or reject the running mental sores from childhood abuses; stop reading the likes of The Daily Hate Mail, Torygraft, a whole host of pus-filled internet websites et al.

Of course, certain human nature varieties will find it very difficult to give up their desire to "other" and persecute someone-anyone to salve their various personality-wounds, especially in nations full to the brim of both the wounded and the wound-givers (often the same folk).
“Practical men who believe themselves to be quite exempt from any intellectual influence are usually the slaves of some defunct economist”.
John Maynard Keynes
tim-b
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Re: Dead calm:killing in the Med.

Post by tim-b »

I always try to be pithy.
I am sorry if you have got hold of the wrong end of the stick
You were in "fear that Reform UK's policies would lead to scenes like this in the Channel." That's neither pithy nor precisely meaningful, unless you were in fear.
I think that if Reform UK's policies on immigration were, by some unlikely mischance...
That's pithy
I hope that you would think this an undesirable outcome
It's one of many reasons why I won't be voting for either Reform UK or any other party that considers immigration in general to be a bad thing.
~~~~¯\(ツ)/¯~~~~
Mike Sales
Posts: 8107
Joined: 7 Mar 2009, 3:31pm

Re: Dead calm:killing in the Med.

Post by Mike Sales »

You seem to have grasped my meaning now, that's good.
It's the same the whole world over
It's the poor what gets the blame
It's the rich what gets the pleasure
Isn't it a blooming shame?
axel_knutt
Posts: 3132
Joined: 11 Jan 2007, 12:20pm

Re: Dead calm:killing in the Med.

Post by axel_knutt »

tim-b wrote: 18 Jun 2024, 7:21am
I fear that Reform UK's policies would lead to scenes like this in the Channel.
You're making the huge assumption that a) Reform UK will be in any kind of position of power and b) the party likely to be in power would adopt Reform's policies

Nigel Farage doesn't seem to understand that you can't navigate an ocean liner full of refugees from Clacton to Rwanda
"When I said I would introduce policies to stop the immigrants ten years ago you all laughed at me. Well I have to say, you're not laughing now, are you".
Nigel Farage, 2034.
“I'm not upset that you lied to me, I'm upset that from now on I can't believe you.”
― Friedrich Nietzsche
axel_knutt
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Joined: 11 Jan 2007, 12:20pm

Re: Dead calm:killing in the Med.

Post by axel_knutt »

al_yrpal wrote: 18 Jun 2024, 9:23amBut...these reports are terrible, how can people be so cruel?
When people see out-groups being harmed, their brain response shows the same lack of empathy found in psychopaths:
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=TDjWryXdVd0
“I'm not upset that you lied to me, I'm upset that from now on I can't believe you.”
― Friedrich Nietzsche
tim-b
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Joined: 10 Oct 2009, 8:20am

Re: Dead calm:killing in the Med.

Post by tim-b »

Mike Sales wrote: 18 Jun 2024, 11:59am You seem to have grasped my meaning now, that's good.
It's a pity that you haven't grasped sarcasm
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DaveReading
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Re: Dead calm:killing in the Med.

Post by DaveReading »

tim-b wrote: 18 Jun 2024, 9:55pmIt's a pity that you haven't grasped sarcasm
Probably studying the various forms of wit in descending order, just hasn't got that far yet ...
pwa
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Re: Dead calm:killing in the Med.

Post by pwa »

My reaction on hearing these dreadful accounts was a mix of horror, anger, despair and a sense of grim inevitability. The last of those feelings was based on an appreciation of how empathy can decline and brutality thrive when societies feel under pressure. But the severity of that decline in humanity did surprise and shock me. I wouldn't have been all that surprised by a bit of roughness or verbal abuse, whilst not condoning either of those. But calculated murder! This is humanity at its worst.

Well done to the Beeb for exposing this.
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