Working out what ANT+ devices your eBike has

[LittleGreyCat]

I have a Specialized Vado 4 SL.
I also have an old Garmin Edge Explore.
I discovered the other day that it had an option to connect to an eBike.
Telling the Garmin to connect to an eBike worked, and I can now see battery status, and the level of boost selected (that is, from off, 1,2,3).
So there is some ANT+ capability which can be found by another device which is searching for it.

The Vado manual is not very clear about the ANT+ capabilities.
As a minimum the central power unit must know the torque being applied through the pedals, as this is used to control the power output of the motor.
However it is not clear if this information is made available to external devices.

Is there an App on Android which can be used to discover ANT+ devices which are powered on?
I've searched, and looked in the App store, but so far have found nothing which is the equivalent to the Bluetooth search for available devices for pairing.

[Paulatic]

There is a comprehensive list of everything ant+ you could maybe use https://www.thisisant.com/directory

[rareposter]

The Vado manual is not very clear about the ANT+ capabilities.
As a minimum the central power unit must know the torque being applied through the pedals, as this is used to control the power output of the motor.
However it is not clear if this information is made available to external devices.

In theory (although I've never tested this), the routing capabilities of the Garmin should take the battery level into account. So if you're 30 miles from home and the range says 32 miles, the Garmin will route you home the shortest / flattest route it can find.

Depending on how old your Vado is, you may well find that the Specialized app does pretty much the same thing. I know the new Tero can pair all sorts of sensors to the motor and it'll calculate routing based on battery needs and it'll take into account distance, elevation etc.

[LittleGreyCat]

The Vado manual is not very clear about the ANT+ capabilities.
As a minimum the central power unit must know the torque being applied through the pedals, as this is used to control the power output of the motor.
However it is not clear if this information is made available to external devices.

In theory (although I've never tested this), the routing capabilities of the Garmin should take the battery level into account. So if you're 30 miles from home and the range says 32 miles, the Garmin will route you home the shortest / flattest route it can find.

Depending on how old your Vado is, you may well find that the Specialized app does pretty much the same thing. I know the new Tero can pair all sorts of sensors to the motor and it'll calculate routing based on battery needs and it'll take into account distance, elevation etc.

Interesting.
However I am not trying to pair external sensors to the motor.
I am searching for ANT+ sensors already present in the motor and other parts of the bike to display on my Garmin.
I am looking for something which can scan the bike and report any active ANT+ sensors.
As you might scan for Bluetooth devices near you, for example.

[rareposter]

Interesting.
However I am not trying to pair external sensors to the motor.
I am searching for ANT+ sensors already present in the motor and other parts of the bike to display on my Garmin.
I am looking for something which can scan the bike and report any active ANT+ sensors.
As you might scan for Bluetooth devices near you, for example.

ANT+ is just a transmission protocol (like Bluetooth) but much shorter range. It's used a lot within the fitness industry to pair health / workout sensors to a phone or app for example, in fact I think the protocol is actually owned by Garmin in the first place.

All you do is find "the motor" (or maybe even "the bike") and pair it to the head unit, it's not a case of finding a torque sensor here and a cadence sensor there.

Depends how old your bike and your head unit are as well. Obviously newer ones will have far more capability than older ones...

[drossall]

Fewer and fewer modern Android devices support Ant+. This is very frustrating for anyone who wants to use Zwift or whatever, and who has Ant+ sensors or power meter. So an Ant+ app would not be that useful.

But is the Ant+ Plugin Sampler any use, assuming that your phone is an exception?

[LittleGreyCat]

Fewer and fewer modern Android devices support Ant+. This is very frustrating for anyone who wants to use Zwift or whatever, and who has Ant+ sensors or power meter. So an Ant+ app would not be that useful.

But is the Ant+ Plugin Sampler any use, assuming that your phone is an exception?

Tried that but didn't really show me anything.
I am assuming that the Vado has ANT+ transmitters (more than just battery, boost level that are picked up by the eBike setting on the Garmin) because of slightly ambiguous wording about what you can display on the Specialized head unit.

I have seen articles about USB ANT+ receivers for tablets and mobiles but don't want to go down that route unless I have some assurance that there are sensors transmitting data which can be picked up.

All I am asking is a "scan for nearby devices" option with a nice big button, but can't find one.

[Paulatic]

Surely your Garmin searches for nearby wireless sensors?

I found a Vado manual online which says

ANT+ can be used to connect to the sensors for Speed, Rider Power, and Cadence. The sensor data can be received via the ANT+ module built into the MasterMind TCD.

They might only be available to the module but ( I’m not a Garmin user) but with my Lezyne head unit I’d simply search for each type of sensor and see if they were found.

[sizbut]

Fewer and fewer modern Android devices support Ant+. This is very frustrating for anyone who wants to use Zwift or whatever, and who has Ant+ sensors or power meter. So an Ant+ app would not be that useful.

But is the Ant+ Plugin Sampler any use, assuming that your phone is an exception?

It's no problem for Zwift, they are happy with Ant+ or Bluetooth. In fact most of their own hardware is Bluetooth. It's only an issue for those on Apple TV which has a very low number of Bluetooth connections.

[LittleGreyCat]

Surely your Garmin searches for nearby wireless sensors?

I found a Vado manual online which says

ANT+ can be used to connect to the sensors for Speed, Rider Power, and Cadence. The sensor data can be received via the ANT+ module built into the MasterMind TCD.

They might only be available to the module but ( I’m not a Garmin user) but with my Lezyne head unit I’d simply search for each type of sensor and see if they were found.

I shall give that a go.
It is strange that just searching for an eBike (which I did successfully) didn't pick up all the sensors available.
Will report back.

[rareposter]

I shall give that a go.
It is strange that just searching for an eBike (which I did successfully) didn't pick up all the sensors available.
Will report back.

Select Menu symbol > Sensors.
Select your eBike.
To view eBike details, such as the odometer or travel distance, select Sensor Details > eBike Details.
To view eBike error messages, select Warning symbol.

This is going to depend a lot on how compatible that Vado is with the older edition of the Edge Explore - those instructions above are for the Edge Explore 2 which I just tried to pair with my e-cargo bike which was having none of it.

But equally, it's actually not designed for that so I'm not bothered one way or the other; the e-cargo bike has a built in head unit which tells me all the useful stuff and because it just gets used for short local trips (as per its design and intent) I never need to navigate on it.

You may need to refer to the Vado owners manual to find out explicitly what sensors it has and what it can pair with. Might find that some sensors simply report to the bike and/or the internal Battery Management System, not any external display.

[LittleGreyCat]

I shall give that a go.
It is strange that just searching for an eBike (which I did successfully) didn't pick up all the sensors available.
Will report back.

Select Menu symbol > Sensors.
Select your eBike.
To view eBike details, such as the odometer or travel distance, select Sensor Details > eBike Details.
To view eBike error messages, select Warning symbol.

This is going to depend a lot on how compatible that Vado is with the older edition of the Edge Explore - those instructions above are for the Edge Explore 2 which I just tried to pair with my e-cargo bike which was having none of it.

But equally, it's actually not designed for that so I'm not bothered one way or the other; the e-cargo bike has a built in head unit which tells me all the useful stuff and because it just gets used for short local trips (as per its design and intent) I never need to navigate on it.

You may need to refer to the Vado owners manual to find out explicitly what sensors it has and what it can pair with. Might find that some sensors simply report to the bike and/or the internal Battery Management System, not any external display.

And there you go, summarising the extent of my problem!

The User Manual is not very forthcoming about which of the sensors are exported via ANT+, although it implies that the add on extra head unit might be able to display these.

The Edge Explore models are designed to integrate with all sorts of sensors including power and cadence.
the eBike setting doesn't seem to pick these up.

Update:
I've fiddled around with the Sensor menus and picked up speed and cadence sensors. No sign of power/torque sensor.
Spinning the transmission up on a stand shows that speed is being picked up from the bike.
I am now wondering if it also still displays speed from the GPS, or how it decides which one to use.
The Edge Explore was showing a little trip when spun up but not moving.
I think that this might work well with a static trainer (but not for an eBike).

[LittleGreyCat]

Noting that the Edge Explore got very confused and would hardly display any useful information.
I deleted the sensor and it now seems back to normal.
Further testing required.