Best electric bikes for touring and a bit of gravel

[Jezrant]

Probably not what you have in mind Jonathan, but there are some new electric gravel bikes on the market and more in the pipeline it seems. They tend to be quite pricey, all carbon fibre, and run the cables and hoses through the headset, which makes formerly simple jobs like servicing the headset quite complicated and expensive if you need to take it to a bike shop. Cube do a few at the lower end of the price range using the impressive Bosch SX motor and an integrated 400wh battery buried in the down tube with an optional range extender. They are very lightweight for an electric bike with a Bosch motor in the crank (around 14kg). The light weight makes a real difference. You can comfortably ride them longer in the lowest power mode or without using the battery at all. Canyon do something similar for more money. Ditto Trek but with the new 60Nm TQ motor (and an easily removable battery). I think Specialized started this trend a few years ago with the Creo. They also tend to be designed for bike-packing, and some like the Cube and Canyon have fittings to take racks and full mudguards if you must have them. They're also rapidly moving towards wireless electronic rear mechs (they're all 1x drivetrains).

[rareposter]

Major disadvantage of that would be losing the front changer.

E-bikes absolutely do not need a front mech. Get a 1x 10 / 11 / 12 (in fact even a 1x 8 or 9 is fine, the only downside is you start running into bigger gaps between the gear ratios). The motor does the rest.

What with battery, mid-motor, wide tyres etc, there's no space for a front mech and losing it frees up all sorts of design options.

[Cadence]

Major disadvantage of that would be losing the front changer.

E-bikes absolutely do not need a front mech. Get a 1x 10 / 11 / 12 (in fact even a 1x 8 or 9 is fine, the only downside is you start running into bigger gaps between the gear ratios). The motor does the rest.

Yes, and no!
One of my converted bikes has a rear hub motor and retains the original gear set-up (48/38/28 triple and 11-32t freewheel). i was contemplating removing the triple and front changer until I suffered an unfathomable electrical fault 11 miles from home on a 30 mile ride. With some serious hills to climb I was mighty glad of that granny ring!

[Jezrant]

You would have a comparable lowest gear on a 1x (e)gravel bike, typically around 25".

[Cadence]

You would have a comparable lowest gear on a 1x (e)gravel bike, typically around 25".

You are no doubt correct, but other than saving a bit of weight I hadn't really thought it through that much. Suffice to say, I'm happy with it as it is now, and if I was touring I would certainly keep that way rather than go to the expense of another bike.

[Jezrant]

Two of my bikes have triples too. I've been using triples for years and have absolutely no problem with them, but you find the same sort of lowest gear on many (e)gravel bikes. The gearing differs in the gaps as rare poster mentioned. There are disadvantages of 1x drive trains, but low gears is not necessarily one of them.

[Cugel]

Major disadvantage of that would be losing the front changer.

E-bikes absolutely do not need a front mech. Get a 1x 10 / 11 / 12 (in fact even a 1x 8 or 9 is fine, the only downside is you start running into bigger gaps between the gear ratios). The motor does the rest.

What with battery, mid-motor, wide tyres etc, there's no space for a front mech and losing it frees up all sorts of design options.

Both of those assumptions are incorrect.

Many will ride an e-bike above 25kph for significant periods. Doing so is often taking significant effort over rolling roads. When making a significant pedalling effort, close ratio gears are often a help as one can find and use the ideal cadence range for extracting power at a sustainable rate. This ideal cadence range may be quite small at high efforts. It is for me and most others I know who ride with significant amounts of effort. But no motor help is available above 25kph so the motor can't make ideal-cadence less critical.

Even when getting motor help, when climbing a long hill for example, there will be a cadence sweet-spot. Having a motor might make it easier to find and maintain that spot but close ratio gears may still be of benefit in getting to it. I find them so and still notice any big ratio jump when using a motor too, typically a 3-tooth sprocket difference jump in the middle of the cassette; and even more so at the small-cog end if there is a 2 tooth jump.

************

I ride one e-bike with a fat down tube containing the battery and a chunky BB to house the motor gearing connection with the pedals. It also has 45mm wide tyres (and associated mudguards in winter-bike mode) yet could have those tyres wider still without fouling the front mech for the double chainset.

What e-bike(s) are you yourself riding and at what speeds/gear ratios?

[rareposter]

What e-bike(s) are you yourself riding and at what speeds/gear ratios?

Bosch SX mid motor e-gravel bike with a 1 x12 which keeps the ratios close. What you want though is sequential shifting. One gear harder, one gear easier. Clicking up and down through both chainrings and cassette is way too much variation in cadence. One gear either way.

The motor works across a reasonable cadence range (although it's very much optimised for spinning, it really doesn't like using low revs) but in use, you're only ever needing slight changes at a time - nothing that would ever justify dropping from big ring to middle for example, which is why a 1x is so good for e-bikes.

My average speed is basically the top of the motor assist, 24-25kph. Going faster is certainly possible, can easily get 50+ kph downhill but I adjust my riding style on that bike to sit at the top of the assist. Pushing it much harder on the flat is pointless unless it's a good tailwind!

My e-cargo bike has a 1x 10 and it really doesn't need any more. Again, different riding style.

[Jdsk]

Major disadvantage of that would be losing the front changer.

E-bikes absolutely do not need a front mech. Get a 1x 10 / 11 / 12 (in fact even a 1x 8 or 9 is fine, the only downside is you start running into bigger gaps between the gear ratios). The motor does the rest.

What with battery, mid-motor, wide tyres etc, there's no space for a front mech and losing it frees up all sorts of design options.

Thanks for that. And for everyone's useful advice.

It feels to me as if this is different with conversion rather than buying a new eBike. I'm now looking at a rear wheel conversion kit for a 3x9 tourer. That means that I won't have to change any other parts of the drive train.

Jonathan

[rareposter]

It feels to me as if this is different with conversion rather than buying a new eBike. I'm now looking at a rear wheel conversion kit for a 3x9 tourer. That means that I won't have to change any other parts of the drive train.

Yep - a mid-motor bike, especially one bought specifically as an e-bike (ie, not a conversion), handles very differently to a rear hub drive. When you've got a whole load of inbuilt electronics and sensors doing a lot of the work around matching your torque, cadence, gear selection etc with what the motor will assist, believe it or not, fewer gears are actually preferable.

But with conversions and the drive being at the back and not directly referencing your torque or cadence, it's a bit more of a reactive system.

On the other hand, drivetrains last a bit longer with a rear hub motor!

[Jezrant]

What e-bike(s) are you yourself riding and at what speeds/gear ratios?

Bosch SX mid motor e-gravel bike with a 1 x12 which keeps the ratios close. What you want though is sequential shifting. One gear harder, one gear easier. Clicking up and down through both chainrings and cassette is way too much variation in cadence. One gear either way.

The motor works across a reasonable cadence range (although it's very much optimised for spinning, it really doesn't like using low revs) but in use, you're only ever needing slight changes at a time - nothing that would ever justify dropping from big ring to middle for example, which is why a 1x is so good for e-bikes.

My average speed is basically the top of the motor assist, 24-25kph. Going faster is certainly possible, can easily get 50+ kph downhill but I adjust my riding style on that bike to sit at the top of the assist. Pushing it much harder on the flat is pointless unless it's a good tailwind!

My e-cargo bike has a 1x 10 and it really doesn't need any more. Again, different riding style.

Hope this doesn’t sound contentious, but if you’re riding that fast on average, why are you riding an e-bike and don’t both the extra weight and the 25kph cut-off bother you?

[rareposter]

Hope this doesn’t sound contentious, but if you’re riding that fast on average, why are you riding an e-bike and don’t both the extra weight and the 25kph cut-off bother you?

Because it's a commute.

I'm carrying work stuff, it's a fair distance with a substantial amount of climbing and I want a means of doing it in a fixed time that's largely disconnected from how tired I am, how much I'm carrying and any headwind.

Also, I don't want to get to the weekend and be too knackered to ride. The e-bike fulfils all of those requirements.

My point was that I ride an e-bike differently to a normal bike. I'm not chasing a PB or an average speed, I'm using the bike to its maximum potential. Trying to go faster would be pointless, it'd remove the entire point of using it.

[Jezrant]

Thanks, makes perfect sense. Is that a Grizl?