eBikes - is there a way back?

[Cowsham]

All good info at least thanks Colin and Cugel

If you're planning a tour or five from a Lancaster base, there are many, many routes that parallel but avoid the main traffic arteries. One may go from Lancaster to Ambleside or Grasmere with but a few hundred yards on any main road (typically across long dog-leg junctions from one back road to another). Ditto eastwards to The Dales, southward through The Forest of Bowland to The Pennines and even eastwards out to the Blackpool/Lytham St Annes coast.

'Twas long my pedal-stomping ground, with every wee lane and convoluted route explored dozens if not hundreds of times. One must, though, have a low gear or three. Well, not for the eastward drifts about The Fylde, where places called Summick-or-Other Hill are only 2 metres above sea level so going over a canal or motorway bridge is a welcome relief.

On the cards for at latest for 2027. Don't know if I'll have enough hols left got to factor in a trip to the island too.

[djnotts]

I've been pondering going electric for a few years, but cost and complexity and hassle/danger of charging deterred.

For now I've settled on lighter. Full carbon full bouncer running XT and carbon hardtail on XTR. Might add a carbon roadie. Not as fast as E, but so much cheaper and a noticeable improvement. Cost? 750 so far, add a quality race rep another 500 max and still cheaper than 1 ridiculously heavy E bike.

[Cowsham]

One big advantage ( at least for me ) of a lighter non ebike is when touring off road adventures the bike is easier to lift over stiles / fences etc but I love my ebike for really hot days where I want to be on a bike but not endure the sweating that comes with it.

[rareposter]

I've been pondering going electric for a few years, but cost and complexity and hassle/danger of charging deterred.

Cost - I'll give you that but a lot of the bike industry (and life in general) now costs £££. As a general rule you do get what you pay for though. Up past about £3000 for regular bikes, £4000 or so for e-bikes, is really the land of diminishing returns.

Complexity - this is a regular one on this forum, often accompanied by wailing and bleating that "bikes should be simple" although no-one has ever explained why this should hold true with bikes more than any other mechanical object. Bottom line is that they are very simple to USE. That's different to being simple to WORK ON but then the vast majority of people on bicycles don't even know what brand it is, never mind how to fix anything on it no matter how simple you make it.

Hassle / danger of charging - it's no worse than anything else you charge. Life is full of cordless / wireless gadgets now but if you're capable of charging the vacuum cleaner, toothbrush, phone, and laptop then you can charge an e-bike with the same amount of thought (ie, not a lot). And danger is negligible on a legitimate e-bike. The issues always arise from cheap third-party batteries cobbled together onto old MTBs and charged using a mismatched charger. Any normal reputable-brand e-bike is no worse than charging the vacuum cleaner, toothbrush, phone or laptop. Plug in, leave it and the connected app on your phone plus the internal battery management will sort it all out.

Weight - you can buy "lite" e-bikes now with more compact motors, smaller batteries etc or e-bikes with removable batteries - take it out and it's not much different to a normal bike, you just put a blanking plate over where the battery goes. A lot of Fazua-powered bikes have this option.
https://www.cyclingnews.com/features/be ... ric-bikes/
They're improving all the time too as battery and motor tech progresses.

[Cugel]

I've been pondering going electric for a few years, but cost and complexity and hassle/danger of charging deterred.

Weight - you can buy "lite" e-bikes now with more compact motors, smaller batteries etc or e-bikes with removable batteries - take it out and it's not much different to a normal bike, you just put a blanking plate over where the battery goes. A lot of Fazua-powered bikes have this option.
https://www.cyclingnews.com/features/be ... ric-bikes/
They're improving all the time too as battery and motor tech progresses.

When riding an e-bike, even a 28kg hefter, one won't notice the weight until the hill arrives, which is likely to be the only time one needs to switch on the motor, which "disappears" the bike weight as well as your body weight just-like-that. The weight of the e-bike is only relevant when handing it off-the-bike ..... getting it up stairs or on to a car bike carrier, say. Otherwise, riding it feels no different from riding an unmotored bike.

Well, not quite, Those with a mid-motor ride rather better around bends and down hills because of their lowered centre f gravity. Nice, that is!

Fazua bikes are also generally quite light. The three in wor hoose weight 13.5 kg, 15 kg and 16.5kg. As RP mentions, take out the motor/battery module and put an empty blank in there (or even fill it with cake) and ~3kg per bike is knocked off those weights. They all then weight less than a typical touring bike - quite a lot less, really.

[djnotts]

^ Yes, but.....380 quid for a full carbon, full susser at 25lbs, less for a lighter hardtail.
And still got my custom part Ti Brompton.
33 miles today on my '97 Kona Kilauea rigid - could have been faster, but no more effort!
How much would two super-light Es cost?
Charging? Yes, charge small appliances but never on overnight and not hidden in garage with a car full of petrol.
Pedal as long as I can.....

[djnotts]

Charging remains the greatest negative for me. E.g. from BBC News:

"In 2024, the Office for Product Safety and Standards received 170 reports of e-bike fires, with 45% confirmed to be from converted e-bikes.

The actual number is expected to be much higher as not all fire and rescue services notify OPSS of blazes involving consumer products."

What proportion/number from stock rather than conversions I wonder......

[Jdsk]

Charging remains the greatest negative for me. E.g. from BBC News:

"In 2024, the Office for Product Safety and Standards received 170 reports of e-bike fires, with 45% confirmed to be from converted e-bikes.

The actual number is expected to be much higher as not all fire and rescue services notify OPSS of blazes involving consumer products."

What proportion/number from stock rather than conversions I wonder......

My emboldening.

For some time I and others suspected that these fires were very uncommon in reputable systems used as in the instructions. The evidence that this is the case is getting more and solid. It's in the forum archives.

Jonathan

PS: It's good practice to provide a link or similar when quoting rather than just some cherry-picked extract. And even better practice to include the original source.

BBC News: "Heartbreak after modified e-bike fire destroys home";
https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/articles/cj3yk5xvjgmo

OPSS: "Fires in e-bikes and e-scooters – 2024":
https://www.gov.uk/government/publicati ... oters-2024

[Bmblbzzz]

If 45% were from converted e-bikes, then 55% must have been from stock e-bikes. No? What am I missing here?

[Bmblbzzz]

When I was a kid and first had gears I rationalised that the bigger the gear the better, and I've come across lots of others doing that since, so it's not exactly a New Thing requiring a power meter

A newby (including actual kids or the ones who fail to grow up) might begin with the notion that a bicycle should be ridden like a car is driv (by most) - i.e. get into top gear as soon as possible then press very hard on the accelerator to prove to the others drivlers that one is "a good driver". However, anyone cycling for more than a week or four soon realises that its necessary to eke out one's pedalling energy with a cunning plan, if one is to retain the ability to produce enough power for the time taken to go from the particular A to the particular B of a ride.

No, hardcore mashers will keep mashing, only changing down when all else fails.
How do I know? I was one of them for years. It was a misplaced mark of pride to make it up a hill without having to resort to lower gears.

Katie Archibald takes us through the "reasoning" here... https://www.cyclingweekly.com/news/comm ... alk-399493

Pete.

It's not mashing when it's fixed! And it's not twiddling either. Funny.

[djnotts]

^"It's good practice to provide a link or similar when quoting rather than just some cherry-picked extract. And even better practice to include the original source."

I stated the source of that which I quoted. This is an insignificant chat place, I'm not proposing nor drafting legislation or regulations. I can't be bothered with the pedantic debating rules that a few feel sufficiently superior to dictate.
I shan't trouble you again.

[Jdsk]

Nearly everybody provides a link or URL so that an interested reader can read the whole article. If you don't provide this then they have to search using the text extract and the source and then check to find the correct article. And then the next reader has to do the same. And so on.

What's the disadvantage in including the URL while it's there in front of you?

Thanks

Jonathan

[mattheus]

If 45% were from converted e-bikes, then 55% must have been from stock e-bikes. No? What am I missing here?

You're missing the detail of the data, and how it was captured.
This is mainly djnotts' fault, unfortunately!