Is this a subculture?

[Squiddy]

Random thought since I can't seem to go to sleep..

It's the lads, and also men who seem to have a sort of subcultural dress code/uniform, shared slang and music interests. the dress code is a cap, specifically a baseball one, that's often worn high on the head. the next is a chain necklace, which is always gold. sometimes this is complemented by gold rings or diamond stud earrings. then tracksuits, even worn when it's hot outside. and lastly, trainers of the "air" range. these things are worn in combination.

they appear to have their own slang such as "fam", "mandem", "swear down". they are always white, and like to carry around speakers where they play what sounds like drum n bass or some form of fast paced house music. they greet eachother with fist bumps and walk with a swagger. their friends are usually other people who dress and speak the same.

I live in Coventry, so maybe this is just something local to my area, since my mates say they've never seen anyone dressing like this in their area.

It's been around for around 20 years? perhaps more. I'm 28 and remember older kids dressing and talking like this. I thought this was just the normal way to dress and act around here but someone I was speaking to was confused and told me it isn't, so here's the question..

[Nearholmer]

Sounds like a derivative of Gangsta, which I thought had mostly disappeared, except maybe around the pimped cars thing and “road man” drug/gang stuff; basic gangsta certainly seems much less common than it used to be. It was common enough in the 90s for Ali G to become a phenomenon mocking its adherents.

[Squiddy]

Sounds like a derivative of Gangsta, which I thought had mostly disappeared, except maybe around the pimped cars thing and “road man” drug/gang stuff; basic gangsta certainly seems much less common than it used to be. It was common enough in the 90s for Ali G to become a phenomenon mocking its adherents.

It does seem a bit gangster-like at times, but I'd imagine that gangsters would be more into gangster rap music, rather than UK Garage, Drum n Bass and Jungle.

[Nearholmer]

I’m old, so all genres of urban youth music now sound the same to me (annoyingly loud)!

Why don’t you ask some of the gold-chain wearers? I’d be interested to know, because I occasionally see people on the train wearing what I think you are talking about, and it is definitely distinct from the things you see in London, and most other places TBH.

[Squiddy]

I’m old, so all genres of urban youth music now sound the same to me (annoyingly loud)!

Why don’t you ask some of the gold-chain wearers? I’d be interested to know, because I occasionally see people on the train wearing what I think you are talking about, and it is definitely distinct from the things you see in London, and most other places TBH.

Interesting since London is quite a ways away from Coventry. I was thinking about it but I'm shy and didn't wanna seem awkward. Do you know if they were speaking the same slang mentioned here?

[Nearholmer]

Have a read of this: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Multicult ... on_English

Certainly where I live, Milton Keynes, many youngsters use some or all of this, but it’s a complex game because they flip between what they know of this and quite “polite” RP at will, and a lot of use of MLE/MBE is at least half-joking, and it doesn’t go with a dress style, music style etc.

I think what you’ve spotted is the Coventry take on “roadman” style, and you see local takes on it in less-well-off white working class areas on the fringes of London too but, as your mates say, it’s not anything like universal, or even massively widespread to my observation.

Travel about a bit, see where you spot it.

[al_yrpal]

I sort of recognise this sub culture but find it rather unatractive. Lurking within it is obvious aggression. Its a young bloke thing. The bonk bonk bonk bonkbonk stuff coming from a thugmobile truck.

For me the Goth subculture is the most interesting and often attractive one. Via my OnceGoth daughter I have met a lot of Goths often at The Cure gigs. Robert Smith at late 60s still punches above his weight. Average stage time is well over 2 hours with his massive catalogue of songs. In Hyde Park on his 40th touring aniversary I met Goths from Japan, Russia, China The States and South America who had traveled to just be there. His carefully chosen support bands were very entertaining too.

Long live Goths.. wave gotik treffen....

Al

[Squiddy]

I sort of recognise this sub culture but find it rather unatractive. Lurking within it is obvious aggression. Its a young bloke thing. The bonk bonk bonk bonkbonk stuff coming from a thugmobile truck.

For me the Goth subculture is the most interesting and often attractive one. Via my OnceGoth daughter I have met a lot of Goths often at The Cure gigs. Robert Smith at late 60s still punches above his weight. Average stage time is well over 2 hours with his massive catalogue of songs. In Hyde Park on his 40th touring aniversary I met Goths from Japan, Russia, China The States and South America who had traveled to just be there. His carefully chosen support bands were very entertaining too.

Long live Goths.. wave gotik treffen....

Al

What do you call the subculture?

[al_yrpal]

A subculture is a smaller group within a main society. This group has its own unique style, values, and ways of life that set it apart from the normal culture

I dont know what to call the subculture in the OP. Goths are easily identifiable.

Al

[Nearholmer]

What do you call the subculture?

I’ve been dodging around that one, because what I would call it is something very controversial, which could quickly get me accused of snobbery: Modern Chav.

It is actually a term used in the fashion industry to describe a particular set of clothing choices, but here I think it’s something subtly different, because it’s about white working class youth, rather than middle class fashionistas borrowing from working class youth.

If we are both talking about the same thing (still some slight doubt over that), the “uniform” is similar to, but different from “roadman”. The London black working class youth style is much edgier , darker colours, use of camo, hoods up a lot of the time, sometimes face all/partly covered, an ability to disappear into the urban backdrop at will, whereas this is about pale, often pastel, colours, and overt display, more like gangsta twenty or thirty years ago.

[Cugel]

What do you call the subculture?

I’ve been dodging around that one, because what I would call it is something very controversial, which could quickly get me accused of snobbery: Modern Chav.

It is actually a term used in the fashion industry to describe a particular set of clothing choices, but here I think it’s something subtly different, because it’s about white working class youth, rather than middle class fashionistas borrowing from working class youth.

If we are both talking about the same thing (still some slight doubt over that), the “uniform” is similar to, but different from “roadman”. The London black working class youth style is much edgier , darker colours, use of camo, hoods up a lot of the time, an ability to disappear into the urban backdrop at will, whereas this is about pale, often pastel, colours, and overt display, more like gangsta twenty or thirty years ago.

When I were a lad, 163 years ago, hardly anyone could afford the various "sub-culture" badges of special clothes, hats, makeup, shoes et al. One had to differentiate the others of one's generation by their attitudes, professed likes/dislikes, behaviours and speech. We were all dressed in more or less the same "fashion" which consisted of mostly cheap stuff from the army/navy store or perhaps the odd bit of generic from, at "best", Marks & Sparks.

Mind, there were Teddy boys; and the precursor of rockers, who were just motorbike fans in various bits of motorcycling stuff (no mods yet).

What did the "sub-culture" consist of? Mostly stuff generated by commercial interests, with an often slavish copy of some USA thing seen in the filums. There were various yob varieties, though. And those with a particular obsession, like trainspotters or stamp collectors.

But then came the 1960s. By then, more money about meant one could adopt some fashionable dress style, buy records of a certain music type or otherwise adopt one of the pre-packaged styles that substituted for any authentic sort of sub-culture.

Were there then (are there now) any authentic sub-cultures that aren't basically invented and owned by various commercial interests - part of The Spectacle that's one armature of rabid consumption and faux individualism? Perhaps cycle touring is one authentic sub-culture! And racing (road, TT, cyclo-cross & so forth). Football was ..... once. Now it too is just a Big Product for "fans", the vast majority of whom seem not to play but only buy the various products involved, whilst going through the motions and gestures that "identify" them.

[Nearholmer]

One to read about in that vein is Punk, which at the time I thought was genuinely and completely spontaneous, but I’ve come to understand recently (latecomer to the knowledgeable persons’ ball, me) how utterly pivotal Vivienne Westwood and Malcolm McLaren were, so even that had a fair bit of very conscious “engineering” behind it.

What about bovver boy and skinhead subcultures in the 70s? I think they were genuinely spontaneous, although like anything else they got commercialised and Co-opted.

[Squiddy]

One to read about in that vein is Punk, which at the time I thought was genuinely and completely spontaneous, but I’ve come to understand recently (latecomer to the knowledgeable persons’ ball, me) how utterly pivotal Vivienne Westwood and Malcolm McLaren were, so even that had a fair bit of very conscious “engineering” behind it.

What about bovver boy and skinhead subcultures in the 70s? I think they were genuinely spontaneous, although like anything else they got commercialised and Co-opted.

Would you consider the subculture I describe as a modern day skinhead, or something more distinct?

[Nearholmer]

Well, there are some similarities (both had had part of their origins in black culture, but were then adopted as a “badges” by white, working class kids), but also huge differences, so “yes, no, and maybe”.

What I don’t think is that it would be possible to trace a direct line from one to the other, so in that sense “no”, whatever this modern thing is, it isn’t directly descended from skinhead culture …… some of the kids who are into it might be descended from skinheads though, as in their grandads might have had shaven bonces, and been wearing 10-hole DMs in the 70s.