Does Tubeless tyres have a place on road bikes?

[tim-b]

Hi
A compelling argument above where thorns and punctures are a fact of life, however this depends on your locale

Take 65g of lightweight inner tube (e.g. Schwalbe 25-622) out and replace with 2 fluid oz (~59g) of sealant, not so compelling
Wrap two layers of rim tape around the rim and up the inside to form a seal with the tyres, maybe weighs a little more than a conventional rim tape??
Buy tubeless-specific tyres and special valves (you can wash the fluid out and use a conventional inner tube if you have a blow-out that the sealant won't cure)
Stans Road Tubeless instructions

On a lightweight bike I remain open to persuasion, I can't see the weight / rotating mass argument based on my research. Stans quote, "Going tubeless allows tires to roll 12% faster", which may be a function of air pressure / volume but I don't have any more info than that

On more robust bikes there is a place for them, but I like my current tyres and tubes set up and it's served me well over many years so I won't be bothering just yet

Regards
tim-b

[andrewjoseph]

Hiya All,


I see a Trek Road bike with "tubeless ready" Wheels

Do Tubeless tyres have a place on road bikes? Or are they a new fashion fad, like Disc Brakes?

Hope you can advise


Regards
Martin

they have place on my bike, front and rear!

[andrewjoseph]

I'll be swapping some time this winter I reckon.
What attracts me is the apparent puncture resistance and the fact that if they do they don't explode of the rims. Had 2 do that over the years and the thought is enough to make a nervous Nelly like me ease up on fast descents. Still tempted to go back to tubs for that reason.
To be honest I wouldn't carry a spare tube much of the time. I have never seen a slashed road tyre and can't remember seeing a slashed MTB tyre. Happy to take that risk except on long solo days.
Can't see me lowering the pressure enough to drop into compression puncture zones. That means pressure low enough to notice the ride difference.

i put a new tubeless tyre on my mtb last year (replaced a worn down tubeless) and i slashed the sidewall at the end of the very first ride. of the two tubeless mtb tyres i've had to replace, they were due to 2cm + sidewall gashes.

[andrewjoseph]

A; not really.

Many of the reasons why they might make sense on some other bikes don't really apply in the same way to road bikes.

The tyre manufacturers have tried to push them as having lower rolling resistance etc but even if their tests are kosher, it is hardly a compelling argument thus far.

A significant issue is that most MTB tubeless setups do leak air somewhat, and need topping up quite regularly. I would imagine that this would turn into a 'pump every time you ride' PITA with skinny road tyres because the pressure is higher and the volume far smaller.

cheers

my 28mm schwalbe one tyres need less topping up than my 25mm conti gp4000s did. maybe once every 14 days or so, versus once a week. my 2.3 inch mtb tyres need topping up avery two months or so.

[beardy]

The review which I looked at says the Schwalbe One tubeless are £57 each .

How much are they available for at the cheapest outlets?

[RideToWorky]

A; not really.

Many of the reasons why they might make sense on some other bikes don't really apply in the same way to road bikes.

The tyre manufacturers have tried to push them as having lower rolling resistance etc but even if their tests are kosher, it is hardly a compelling argument thus far.

A significant issue is that most MTB tubeless setups do leak air somewhat, and need topping up quite regularly. I would imagine that this would turn into a 'pump every time you ride' PITA with skinny road tyres because the pressure is higher and the volume far smaller.

cheers

my 28mm schwalbe one tyres need less topping up than my 25mm conti gp4000s did. maybe once every 14 days or so, versus once a week. my 2.3 inch mtb tyres need topping up avery two months or so.

Hi Andrew,

Once a week/Fortnight? Thats not soo bad!

How much mileage were you doing each week though? long runs or commuting trips? etc

[hjd10]

Hi
A compelling argument above where thorns and punctures are a fact of life, however this depends on your locale

Take 65g of lightweight inner tube (e.g. Schwalbe 25-622) out and replace with 2 fluid oz (~59g) of sealant, not so compelling
Wrap two layers of rim tape around the rim and up the inside to form a seal with the tyres, maybe weighs a little more than a conventional rim tape??
Buy tubeless-specific tyres and special valves (you can wash the fluid out and use a conventional inner tube if you have a blow-out that the sealant won't cure)
Stans Road Tubeless instructions

On a lightweight bike I remain open to persuasion, I can't see the weight / rotating mass argument based on my research. Stans quote, "Going tubeless allows tires to roll 12% faster", which may be a function of air pressure / volume but I don't have any more info than that

On more robust bikes there is a place for them, but I like my current tyres and tubes set up and it's served me well over many years so I won't be bothering just yet

Regards
tim-b

I'm not so sure I'll change my road bike to tubeless just yet. Like you say it depends on what you want to use it for, low pressure riding with no pinch flats is not an issue you normally experience on the road. A few grams here and there is not a major issue to me being just over a 100KG.

[AlanW]

A timely subject as I have just reverted back to tubes after running tubeless tyres on the road bike during the last five months (6000 miles)

But prior to that, I went tubeless on the MTB probably five years ago and after the initial faff of getting the dam things to seal, I haven't looked back. I have ridden many hundreds of off road miles and never once I have been forced to stop due to a puncture. So based on that I would certainly recommend tubeless for MTBs.

Back in the summer I went over to tubeless on the road bike, utilizing the Schwable One tyres. Due to the much narrow tyres on the road bike, it is much harder to do the initial set up. Tube in, seat both sides of the tyre, deflate, remove tube, reinflate.. etc etc

The ride is a bit harsher than with tubes, but no real issues. But the pressure can be reduced to around 70/80 psi which helps smooth out the ride.

For the first 5000 miles, no problems or issues at all and if I did puncture I wasn't aware of it? Now the but.....I suffered a cut to the rear tyre about 2mm in length. The sealant just about managed to seal it, but only after I had stopped because it had failed to seal it first time. Once stopped I had to rotate the wheel so that the cut was at the bottom and blow the tyre up and wait for the sealant to seal, which it did. But as I rode home it kept opening up the cut and deflating a little bit at a time. Never the less, it got me home so I guess that was a result.
Because of the width of the cut, I really wanted to add a patch to the inside of the tyre, as well as adding a spot of Superglue. Once the tyre was removed I was shocked to see that most of the sealant had solidified and was stuck around the circumference of the inside of the tyre, a bead 20mm wide and at least 2/3 mm thick.
So my first task was to remove this gunk before I could continue, not a hard job to be fair, but still 1/2 hr lost.
With the gunk removed and a patch fitted back to the process of getting the tyre to seal and adding more liquid Latex.
To be fair, Stand No Tubes do recommend that the level of sealant is checked every 2 to 6 months depending on the a number of conditions, heat, mileage etc

It was at this point that I considered going back to tubes, because it really was time consuming exercise just to add a patch to the tyre. But being stubborn, I carried on.
All was fine until I suffered a major cut again to the rear tyre, this time 20mm in length. Of course no amount of sealant was ever going to seal that!!
Here beginning my problem with tubeless.
They say that if you have a cut in a tyre that the sealant cannot seal, then fear not, all is not lost, you can "just" put a tube in?

Ha.....much easier said than done, trust me!

The first thing you have to contend with is the 2oz of liquid Latex that gets everywhere. Then while your hands are covered in the stuff you have to remove the tubeless valve from the rim before you can fit a tube. And in the case of a large cut, you then you have to try and stick something over the cut on the inside of the tyre to stop the tube from poking out, impossible with the liquid Latex.
Then the hardest part, assuming that you have managed to a) remove the tubeless valve b) sealed the cut up internally, is to get the tube in and the tyre back on.

In fact, any thoughts of a conducting a road side repair wasn't possible and the wife had to come and get me. With regret, this was the straw that broke the camels back and after many happy miles on tubeless, they simply had to go.

Now back to tubes, and the irony is that I suffered a badly cut front tyre last weekend. But I stopped, removed the tube, removed the tyre and stuck a patch on the inside, added a new tube and off again in about 15 minutes.

Shame, and as much as I am a great fan of tubeless, my last memory of them is a bitter one

[Brucey]

I've known folk give up on tubeless with MTBs too, for similar reasons.

In a racing situation, a flat in a tubed tyre means you lose five minutes maybe, but with tubeless it is nearer ten to fit a tube and if you can't get the valve out, the race is finished.

cheers

[RideToWorky]

Hiya AlanW,

Thanks so much for sharing about your experiences with Tubeless on Road bikes!

Ouch... Looks like you will have helped people reading the account, of going through the same grief!


Regards
Martin

[AlanW]

Hiya AlanW,

Thanks so much for sharing about your experiences with Tubeless on Road bikes!

Ouch... Looks like you will have helped people reading the account, of going through the same grief!


Regards
Martin

My pleasure Martin. The rather bizarre thing is that l still embrace the tubeless principle and if it worked without the requirement of the liquid Latex, so the same as cars and motorbikes, then it could be another avenue to explore.
That said without the Latex sealant a) you would really struggle to get the tyres to seal. b) Slightly defeats the purpose of going down the tubeless route in the first place!

[mattsccm]

As he said. Lower pressures can mean snakebites but they also spoil the rude a bit. I mean sub 70 ish more my use.
Of course you can bet the day I go tubeless I'll have the first ripped tyre in 35 years of serious road riding.
Those Schwalbe Ones , the latest pro version are cheaper from Germany.

[AlanW]

This is what 2oz of "liquid Latex" looks like after a few thousand miles......not so liquid anymore is it?

[freiston]

When I was younger (late 70s early 80s) a few folk that I knew who were into racing and time trialling used tubs for the weight difference and higher tyre pressures. I had just moved to Mavic module E rims with Michelin Elan tyres and they felt fast on my touring bike (and iirc, I only ever had one blow-out - in the middle of town!). I'm not a race-head or techno-head but with today's lightweight and high-performing clincher rims and tyres, for anything other than velodrome racing, I can't see the need for tubs being greater than the hassle.

[tim-b]

Hi freiston
I'd guess that we're of similar vintage and I too remember the first Elan tyres, but as a teenager of limited means my tubs had to stay for a few years longer
Tubs were / are tubular tyres with an inner tube sewn inside; tubeless is a different setup, like a conventional tyre but without the inner tube and a similar idea to most car tyres. As a 50+ gent (sometimes) of limited means my tyres with tubes will have to stay for a few years longer
Regards
tim-b