Scotland comes to the rescue?

[JimL]

Nicola should take a pill and calm down.

It didn't end well for the Jocks the last time a Scottish Parliament tried to undermine the will of the English Parliament, they sent Oliver north to sort us out.

[Mick F]

There are Scottish People.
You can argue that they are a nation.
Check on the definition of "nation".
People living in Scotland aren't all Scottish, but they are all UK citizens.

I know no-one has used the PM word. This is because Scotland is part of UK and UK has a PM.
If (and possibly when) Scotland gains independence, Sturgeon will be come a PM.

Cornish O1 EU money no doubt gets spent somewhere or another. Goodness knows where.
I'm saying .......... and I have said on here before ........... the man on the street sees none of it.
Roads in Cornwall are generally terrible. Devon just over the river, and the roads are ok.
Devon has more employment, more facilities, they have a motorway! , better rail links too. I'd rather be part of Devon than the EU ........ and that's saying something. :shock

[Paulatic]

Objective One for Cornwall can go and get stuffed as far as most folk are concerned down here. We see none of it.

What?
Not even Gunnislake station

And if we only want to look locally, let us not forget that without our membership of the EU there would be no University of Cornwall, no Peninsula Medical or Dental School, no Convergence funding for Cornwall and the Isles of Scilly, no Saltash Tunnel, no railway station in Gunnislake, no funding for the Alexander Centre project to enable women to return to work, no Objective 5 funding for deprived rural areas of West Devon, no Konver funding for business and science parks in Plymouth — I could go on . . .

Edit to add: Can I throw this one too, probably close to home.

Mr Chichester said it was appropriate that the meeting was being held in the Tamar Valley Centre in Gunnislake, a beautiful building which was built with the assistance of funding from the EU.

[Psamathe]

Yes, I utterly agree.
NS is the first minister of the government of Scotland.
Note the words "first minister" and not "prime minister".

I'm saying that despite what she is reported as saying, she is NOT the first minister of a nation.

Her nationality is British. The Scottish people are British.
This situation will remain until and unless Scotland get independence.
...

Difficult one because what the leader of a country varies, not every country uses "Prime Minister" (I don't think the US has a Prime Minister, nor Germany, etc) - the name assigned means little.

I understood Scotland was a country so I think it gets morally and maybe legally debatable when one country is at significant odds with another country. And I think that in this referendum the numbers demonstrate that the wish on the country England is very much at odds with the country of Scotland. So should one country in effect force another do act contrary to its electorates wishes ?

It is a difficult question, but my understanding of the situation as of now is that I would agree that it is reasonable for Scotland to act to defend and maintain its membership of the EU.

I think a lot of the problems now being raised are caused by complete lack of thought by Cameron when starting this referendum. He saw it as something he had to go through to quash the threat of UKIP and to quieten his "difficult" backbenchers i.e. as a Conservative Party internal management thing. He never really considered the potential consequences of what he was starting - which means it is actually a good thing he has gone as we need better talent running the country. The bad news is that we may end-up with Mr Blobby running the country which would be even worse (swap one incapable Bullingdon for another incapable Bullingdon).

Ian

[Paulatic]

There are Scottish People.
You can argue that they are a nation.
Check on the definition of "nation".
People living in Scotland aren't all Scottish, but they are all UK citizens.

I know no-one has used the PM word. This is because Scotland is part of UK and UK has a PM.
If (and possibly when) Scotland gains independence, Sturgeon will be come a PM.

Cornish O1 EU money no doubt gets spent somewhere or another. Goodness knows where.
I'm saying .......... and I have said on here before ........... the man on the street sees none of it.
Roads in Cornwall are generally terrible. Devon just over the river, and the roads are ok.
Devon has more employment, more facilities, they have a motorway! , better rail links too. I'd rather be part of Devon than the EU ........ and that's saying something. :shock

Is the EU responsible for the roads in Cornwall?

[Trail Beater]

Nice link!
Trouble is, the word is "believe".
Therefore not factual.
It'll have to be argued by other folk more edumacated than me.
Also, as I said, NS is not the first minister of a nation despite what she believes.

Both our daughters are Scottish nationals because we lived up there for quite some years, but we wouldn't go back there for all the tea in China.

Would you go back for all the Whisky in Scotland?

[Snow]

I lost £5 betting on Scottish independence last time, I shall never forgive my country for that Though I do welcome another vote, as one of the major reasons behind a lot of the fear was leaving the EU and now we're being dragged out by the very people who once sold it to us as our only hope

[Trail Beater]

If Scotland is not a nation,how come we have 6 Nations Rugby
In saying that,according to the national anthem,we have to "rise and be a nation again"

[rualexander]

If Scotland is not a nation,how come we have 6 Nations Rugby
In saying that,according to the national anthem,we have to "rise and be a nation again"

No, it says "rise and be the nation again", as in the nation "that stood against him"

[Audax67]

Would you go back for all the Whiskey in Scotland?

He'd be daft to do that, there is no whiskey in Scotland.

[syklist]

I'm not saying that there isn't a Scottish Nation, but NS isn't the first minister of a nation.

I see parallels with the split up of Yugoslavia. None of the "Nations" were nations to start with.

Scotland : The Slovenia of the United Kingdom. Relatively homogeneous, own media to spread the message. Relatively simple for them to declare independence from the UK and relatively easy to close borders and neuter any ill thought out show of force from the UK.

Northern Ireland : The Croatia of the UK. An unfortunate mix of internal divisions with a English loyalist ethnic group that will make things a bit messy. Geographically speaking not so bad.

The North and the Midlands : The Bosnia. A big problem, big splits in the society with divided loyalties no common identity between the groups. Enclaves of Bremain in seas of Brexit. No easy way to devolve let alone stand as their own nation.

Wales : The Montenegro of the UK. Closest to Southern England with little sense of their own identity apart from pockets of Welsh nationalism in the North. Will stick with Southern England in a rump union until it becomes obvious that there is no benefit to them.

Southern England : The Serbia of the UK. Traditionally the seat of power and the region that holds the purse strings. An unfortunate history of letting the other regions down in terms of distribution of joint tax income. Most interested in support from their own very loyal population and their orthodox capitalist power brokers. This region sees itself as the biggest victim in the Union despite it having most of the political power.

Edit removed minority after Loyalist and replaced it with ethnic group.

[Tangled Metal]

There was a Scottish expert on such matters from the uni of Glasgow over the weekend. He said the first minister can refuse to give the Scottish parliament's consent but Westminster could still force the issue. I'm guessing it's related to the primacy of the parliaments, the main parliament of the union still remains in London.

NS is the first.minister of a devolved nation within the union. The rights and powers of that position and the powers of the Scottish parliament is defined and defined very recently in terms of history. There'll be no n ambiguity about this. No means to challenge the Brexit over the whole union other than a successful Scottish independence referendum. Interestingly that would take Scotland out of the EU as well. Rock and a hard place springs to mind.

I'm enjoying the posturing of NS though. It's more about political power in her constituency than EU or anything else. She's consolidating power within Scotland. It will stand her in good stead for the next SP elections, local elections, etc. She's a political mover that even puts Salmond's talents to shame.

We're all on our way out of EU.

Turkeys voting for Christmas? Free movement of labour, the same per capita fee, etc. All things we'll sign up to in order to gain access to the EU single market. At least we'll get some powers back. Employment legislation, regulations that protect the consumer, financial regulation, etc. Boris will be getting the hose pipe out to water those down I reckon.

Oh how I like being a dispassionate observer. Although I'm not! I'm one of the 16 million who are pi$$ed off! Boris, you'll be leader til the next election. Well perhaps if Labour manage to ditch Corbyn that is. Oh God! It's so bad I'm turning to religion!

[Tangled Metal]

Northern Ireland has an English loyalist majority not minority. That's probably why they're not part of an all Ireland right now. I'm sure there'll be a lot in northern Ireland offended by being called the loyalty minority!

[pwa]

Northern Ireland has an English loyalist majority not minority. That's probably why they're not part of an all Ireland right now. I'm sure there'll be a lot in northern Ireland offended by being called the loyalty minority!

Except that they are of Scottish origin, not English.

[syklist]

Northern Ireland has an English loyalist majority not minority. That's probably why they're not part of an all Ireland right now. I'm sure there'll be a lot in northern Ireland offended by being called the loyalty minority!

Except that they are of Scottish origin, not English.

I thought that the population growth rates were such that the Republicans had now passed the Loyalists.

According to Wikipedia figures from the census 2011 Catholic = 40,8% Protestant (three denomiations) 35.8% Other Christian 5.8%

So the Loyalist could be described as a minority *assuming* that political loyalties follow religeous beliefs.