Cycling UK Forum

Anyone had this experience?

I had three bikes mounted on roof mounted bike rack. Unfortunately one (after being secured for 50 miles) sheared free - gouges visible in bike frame showing it was fixed securely.

This was on the motorway and unfortunately bike hit car behind causing some damage to the body work - driver thankfully was OK. Bike is pretty much a write off as well.

Insurance company now saying that because my car wasn't damaged, they won't cover any of the costs (other car repair or replacement bike) and also, my bike was not part of the car and as such should have been insured seperately for damage it could cause to others and also itself.

Has anyone had a similar experience? How did your insurers deal with it?

Usually this is part of the car insurance as it's a 3rd party liability. Certainly when towing a boat trailer it's the motor insurance that covers the road risks, not the boat's.

I can fully understand that your car insurance is not liable for the repair to the bike, this is quite normal, policies generally cover the vehicle and fitted accesories.
I can not believe that they are not obliged to cover your liability for damage to a third party caused by a load falling off and hitting a third party. This seems to be a major part of the third party insurance's reason for being.
I dont even thing it is likely (or legal) for them to have a clause in the small print exempting them from liability for lost loads.

I AM NO EXPERT but in my experience of insurance companies, some like to try and pull a fast one.
I dont know if the CTC legal line would help as your cycle was not being used as a cycle, it was merely a load on your car roof.

You had better have a good study of your insurance policy and see if you can make any sense of it and find any get out clause. However there are laws covering the minimum level of cover that is provided to third parties by insurance and I dont believe that such an event as a lost load is not covered. Even if you were negligent in securing it (which you werent)

Just a question, how fast were you going?

I see many people with trailers and racks driving way too fast. I would imagine the manufacturer would state the max speed to be driving.

its standard fare for them to try to deny it and hope you'll go away. Persist, as motor insurance ususally covers for personal injuries, contents and luggage as well as for the car. However, there may be a limit if you were carrying a 5 grand carbon bike. Im also assuming that you had a comprehensive policy

I have no idea of the legal position, but I think it is generally the case that insurance companies have always been slow to accept liability for anything that is not cut and dried. The situation is now made so much worse by the way they try to minimise costs. One way that has been done is by getting rid of many of the layesr of supervision / management that used to settle these things. The junior person you speak to in the call centre makes a decision and that's it.

I think a complaint is the only way to get them to review it short of taking action through a solicitor. Ultimately you can go to the toothless watchdog.

I had a look at my insurance policy and it says to cover 3 party

If I have an accident in my car.
And any trailer or vehicle being towed by my vehicle.

Now as those words stand it looks like they are not liable for things that fall OFF your car.

However, they are bound by the Road Traffic Laws which cover compulsory vehicle insurance. I hope there is no such loophole allowed there.

Note you can have two different types of dispute with the insurance company.

1) where you disagree over the amount to be paid.
2) where they refuse to cover your claim.

As they have gone for the latter, if it went to the courts and they won, then I imagine the road traffic laws would need to be rewritten.

starlaw bike wrote:Anyone had this experience?

I had three bikes mounted on roof mounted bike rack. Unfortunately one (after being secured for 50 miles) sheared free - gouges visible in bike frame showing it was fixed securely.

This was on the motorway and unfortunately bike hit car behind causing some damage to the body work - driver thankfully was OK. Bike is pretty much a write off as well.

Insurance company now saying that because my car wasn't damaged, they won't cover any of the costs (other car repair or replacement bike) and also, my bike was not part of the car and as such should have been insured seperately for damage it could cause to others and also itself.

Has anyone had a similar experience? How did your insurers deal with it?

Irrespective of the gouge marks on your bike (they do not prove anything) your bike was an insecure load. Had the police been involved you might also have picked up points.

A pal of mike was sucessfully prosecuted for something similar - he challenged the fixed penalty notice and points and was liable for the damage caused to a van.

The accident/damages was not caused by the car but its load and at face value you appear to be liable for everything. I'd be very wary of accepting solace and the prospect of road traffic laws being rewritten to accomodate your successful appeal against having to pay damages to the other driver.

The only way that you will get a clear picture is to engage the services of a solicitor. It appears that your motor insurance compamny don't acknowledge the validity of the claim so you might find that your household insurance might inclide legal cover.

Failing that, you could make a tentative enquiies through the CTC legal department or through a local solicitors.

I agree with what Vernon says,except it is law that we have vehicle insurance to pay out to third parties who suffer from our mistakes.

It is their job to pay OUR liabilities.

The insurance company is obliged to pay up even if you have committed a blatantly criminal act like going up a one way street the wrong way.
However they may choose to pay out and ask you for the money back.
This way third parties are protected against losses which you can not afford to pay.

What has happened so far?

You gave your insurance details to the other party
They have made a claim and your insurance company refused to pay them?
The third party should then take YOU to small claims court, have they started that process yet?

meic wrote: What has happened so far?

You gave your insurance details to the other party
They have made a claim and your insurance company refused to pay them?
The third party should then take YOU to small claims court, have they started that process yet?

I would have thought more likely

You gave your insurance details to the other party
They made a claim on their insurance which was paid
The 3rd party insurance company tried to recover the money from your insurance and was refused
The 3rd party insurance company tries to recover the money from you
The 3rd party was told he had lost his no claims
Someone takes you to the SCC.

Check the small-print of the policy.

Clearly the accident was caused by an insecure load, so it will come down to what the small-print says about such incidents.

Your insurance company may or may not have to pay out under the RTA third-party liability requirements, but if the policy doesn't cover the incident, they will then recover the money from you.

Ben

vernon wrote:Failing that, you could make a tentative enquiies through the CTC legal department or through a local solicitors.

Leafing through the CTC's most recent issue of Cycle, this very issue is covered by one of the partners of the CTC's solicitors. The response to a query about the legal situation regarding a bike falling off a carrier and falling into the road was:

'If a bike were to accidentally break away from a carrier and fall into the road causing an accident then the motorist would, on the face of it, be negligent. It is the responsibility of the driver to ensure that the load is properly secured to the vehicle.. During the course of a long journey bicycles on even good quality bicycle racks can work themselves loose. It is important that motorists check their loads at regular intervals'

I just happen to have unearthed my motor cycle policy to renew my road fund licenseand fopund these comments

'We will not pay any claim arising from the following:

damage to or loss of the towed trailer
damage to or loss of any property being carried in or on the towed trailer'

If this extrapolates to roof racks, bike racks and the like on cars then it seems to be very unlikely that a payout will be forthcoming.

They only had a clause against damage TO the trailer not BY the trailer.
If my car insurance had said that I would have thought it implied that loss due to damage by the trailer is covered.
Again it is pretty clear that the OP is responsible and liable, which is why his insurance company should pay up to the third party.

FWIW I saw this thread and mentioned it to a solicitor friend of mine, his answer was:

"On the face of it, and obviously without knowing all of the facts, it would appear that the cause of the incident was an insecure load. Therefore the driver of the vehicle carrying the bike would be held to be negligent and on that basis alone the insurer has no obligation to provide cover"

Pete

As meic has repeatedly pointed out, a motor policy must provide at least third party cover. Since most third party claims involve negligence, the insurer cannot opt out of their responsibilities towards the third party, just because the insured driver was negligent. In some circumstances they may pay the third party then seek to recover from the insured.

However, the insured driver is required to be careful and in certain circumstances they may refuse to meet a claim. (Leave your keys in the car and they probably won't pay out if it's stolen. This is not a third party claim.)