Cyclists ignoring traffic lights

Commuting, Day rides, Audax, Incidents, etc.
drossall
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Re: Cyclists ignoring traffic lights

Postby drossall » 12 Aug 2018, 6:20pm

There are lots of answers to this. Some have been mentioned above. One is that some people at least have a greater tendency to notice cyclists breaking the law than they do motorists.

Another is that it's not clear that we're squeaky clean as motorists either. The law says stop on amber (if safe to do so). Too many motorists ignore that, and the last few cars go through on red. I remember the amber gambler campaigns, but one might almost say that the motoring community has effectively defeated those and changed the law from stopping on amber to red.

Then, cyclists are not different people from motorists. Many do both - how many adults do you know who only ride bikes and don't drive? Obviously there are significant numbers, but a minority. So, "Why are cyclists less responsible than motorists" sounds a bit like "Why are rugby players less responsible than men?" - it doesn't entirely make sense as a question, because it's based on the obviously-false assumption that the two groups are distinct.

There may of course be an argument that people believe that bikes are not "proper" vehicles. That could explain both how a minority of motorists behave around cyclists, and how some people behave differently when switching from car to bike. But I've no evidence of the extent to which either suggestion is true.

drossall
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Re: Cyclists ignoring traffic lights

Postby drossall » 12 Aug 2018, 6:22pm

Chaddy wrote:The person who private messaged me with the torrent of abusive language.

I would suggest forwarding that to one of the moderators.

reohn2
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Re: Cyclists ignoring traffic lights

Postby reohn2 » 12 Aug 2018, 6:24pm

Chaddy wrote:Does anybody know why cyclists are oblivious to red traffic lights. They just saunter through with a total disregard for public safety. As a motorist i thought the highway code was for all road users. I didn't realise cyclists were exemp.

Almost everytime I drive my car I witness other drivers RLJing.
Which is the most dangerous to other road users a bike RLJing or a car,Bearing in mind the cyclist will more than likely have checked for his/her own safety first,which IME car drivers don't ?
-----------------------------------------------------------
I cycle therefore I am.

brynpoeth
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Re: Cyclists ignoring traffic lights

Postby brynpoeth » 12 Aug 2018, 6:53pm

When driving I often stop at a green light, to keep a crossing or junction clear
Normal drivers do not like that :wink:
Cycling? Of course, but it is far better on a Gillott.. Alternative facts welcome

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Xilter
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Re: Cyclists ignoring traffic lights

Postby Xilter » 12 Aug 2018, 7:22pm

Chaddy wrote:The person who private messaged me with the torrent of abusive language. Firstly i am not op or female, i am male i don't understand what op means. You are obviously a person of below average intelligence. I as a motorist do not dawdle as you put it, i do the speed limit. I made my point on here because this is a cycling forum.


“OP” short for original poster. In this thread. You created the first post and so for this conversation you are the OP.

I have nothing further to add here I will now leave
My poor poor bottom

geocycle
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Re: Cyclists ignoring traffic lights

Postby geocycle » 12 Aug 2018, 7:33pm

Chaddy wrote:Does anybody know why cyclists are oblivious to red traffic lights. They just saunter through with a total disregard for public safety. As a motorist i thought the highway code was for all road users. I didn't realise cyclists were exemp.

Welcome to the forum. Attitudes to red lights seem to have declined by all road users, I actually see more by cars than bikes, usually after the lights have changed whereas cyclists often seem willing to cross early. What is your explanation?

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100%JR
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Re: Cyclists ignoring traffic lights

Postby 100%JR » 12 Aug 2018, 8:06pm

The OP is obviously Trolling :roll:
First post and it's finger pointing and/or accusing cyclist of doing something or other :roll:

Chaddy wrote:The person who private messaged me with the torrent of abusive language. Firstly i am not op or female, i am male i don't understand what op means. You are obviously a person of below average intelligence. I as a motorist do not dawdle as you put it, i do the speed limit. I made my point on here because this is a cycling forum.

Seems like he's just joined to have a bit of a rant :roll:

brynpoeth
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Re: Cyclists ignoring traffic lights

Postby brynpoeth » 12 Aug 2018, 8:10pm

ibbo68 wrote:The OP is obviously Trolling :roll:
First post and it's finger pointing and/or accusing cyclist of doing something or other :roll:

Chaddy wrote:The person who private messaged me with the torrent of abusive language. Firstly i am not op or female, i am male i don't understand what op means. You are obviously a person of below average intelligence. I as a motorist do not dawdle as you put it, i do the speed limit. I made my point on here because this is a cycling forum.

Seems like he's just joined to have a bit of a rant :roll:

I thought first posts were always checked by a moderator before appearing
Wonder if I could sneak under the radar onto the fora of BAD, british association of drivers :wink:
Cycling? Of course, but it is far better on a Gillott.. Alternative facts welcome

VanDriver
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Re: Cyclists ignoring traffic lights

Postby VanDriver » 12 Aug 2018, 8:37pm

Chaddy wrote:Does anybody know why cyclists are oblivious to red traffic lights. They just saunter through with a total disregard for public safety. As a motorist i thought the highway code was for all road users. I didn't realise cyclists were exemp.


Unless this is purely a moth-eaten, cliched wind-up, you really could learn a lot about (your) anti-cyclist prejudice by reading these forums.

eileithyia
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Re: Cyclists ignoring traffic lights

Postby eileithyia » 12 Aug 2018, 8:40pm

As others; No doubt a motorist come to complain. As other's have said there are plenty from both sides who run red lights. My OH was at some lights that were well and truly changing to green when a local bus from the crossing road zoomed through... must have been well and truly crossing on red.

When in Spain we found we were the only riders who stopped for red lights, while other cyclists just rode on through.
Cyclists running red lights are a threat to themselves and have usually checked it is safe to do so, motorists running red lights are a danger to others.
For the record my early morning commutes and some of my late night ones.. would mean I could be stood (in rain, snow, cold, hail) for several minutes until another vehicle came along to trigger the pressure pads, so I approached as I would any give way; with caution, check all directions and proceed if safe to do so.
I stand and rejoice everytime I see a woman ride by on a wheel the picture of free, untrammeled womanhood. HG Wells

crazydave789
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Re: Cyclists ignoring traffic lights

Postby crazydave789 » 12 Aug 2018, 9:08pm

I must admit that I cannot stand light runners of any variety. but as a commuter you know the patterns so set off a few second early while the car drivers are still on their facebooks

but we could do with a left turn rule like they have in other countries allowing people to go with traffic flows.

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The utility cyclist
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Re: Cyclists ignoring traffic lights

Postby The utility cyclist » 12 Aug 2018, 9:10pm

Chaddy wrote:Does anybody know why cyclists are oblivious to red traffic lights. They just saunter through with a total disregard for public safety. As a motorist i thought the highway code was for all road users. I didn't realise cyclists were exemp.

Traffic lights and the HC were brought about due to the lawlessness of motorists and the death and destruction they cause, this hasn't changed in over 100 years, rules regarding people who ride bikes are there so that motorists are inconvenienced less and to shift responsibility and obligations to drive safely away from killers ... sorry, motorists.
But please provide some statistics regarding the safety aspect to the public that people on bikes caused, say in deaths and serious injuries from red light jumpers.
last time I looked the number of members of the general public killed by those riding a bicycle through a set of traffic lights was precisely ZERO. in fact pedestrians were responsible for their deaths 50% more of the time in person on a bike pedestrian incidents and 'at fault' persons riding bikes in the last 6 years numbered FOUR, one of those was the biggest stitch up and the accused/sentenced had the rules/laws of the road applied to him differently to how motorists are treated in all instances.
Direct line did a survey some years ago and they found that motorists ran red lights (let's not even get to amber gamblers) to the tune of 12 million per month, frankly that's an ultra conservative number going by how many I see running red (not ambers), I reckon that's easily per week.
Ah yes, 15 million Fixed Penalty notices for speeding over 10 years and that's scratching the surface.

I didn't realise motorists were exempt :roll:

irc
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Re: Cyclists ignoring traffic lights

Postby irc » 12 Aug 2018, 9:16pm

Chaddy wrote:Does anybody know why cyclists are oblivious to red traffic lights. They just saunter through


So far nobody has given the correct answer which is that they do it because they can. With no number plates the chances of being prosecuted are tiny.

The same reason most drivers ignore speed limits other than when passing the bright yellow easy to see speed cameras. Because they usually get away with it. Does the Highway Code not apply to them?

As for public safety - since cyclists are traveling slowly with a good view of other traffic a cyclist going through a red light with care is no more dangerous than going through a give way junction without traffic lights. I'm not aware of a spate of accidents caused by cyclists RLJing. Perhaps the OP could point us towards them?

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Graham
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Re: Cyclists ignoring traffic lights

Postby Graham » 12 Aug 2018, 9:18pm

This was an opportunity for reasonable folk to try to change a point of view by careful argument.
Most contributors have done so. Thank you.

The OP requests that the account is deleted - an opportunity lost I fear.

thirdcrank
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Re: Cyclists ignoring traffic lights

Postby thirdcrank » 12 Aug 2018, 9:23pm

Graham wrote:This was an opportunity for reasonable folk to try to change a point of view by careful argument.
Most contributors have done so. Thank you.

The OP requests that the account is deleted - an opportunity lost I fear.


We seem to be getting an increase in people asking for their threads to be deleted, although this is the first where a controversial OP has been involved.

As you say, most contributions have been OK. Why not just delete the rest?

(No vested interest for me here: drossall beat me to it when I was going to suggest that a complaint to the moderators was the way to deal with unacceptable PM's)