Collision with pedestrian

drossall · Post by **drossall** » 27 Apr 2008, 8:53pm

That's true, but I think it is unreasonable to expect that every cyclist can avoid every pedestrian who steps into the road. We don't ask that of motorists.

There's a difference between taking extra care and one party single-handedly avoiding the best efforts of the other to have an accident.

gilesjuk · Post by **gilesjuk** » 27 Apr 2008, 9:09pm

I think it's easily possible, firstly many cars cruise around built up areas at 30-40MPH. A bike is about half the speed at most.

A bike can swerve much easier as well.

As soon as you see pedestrians then be ready to swerve, slow down a little.

drossall · Post by **drossall** » 27 Apr 2008, 9:40pm

When I was a schoolboy, I was riding home. A younger kid came out of a drive and ran along the pavement. I half knew what was going to happen.

He duly swerved out into the road and, in spite of being half prepared, I still knocked him down. He lay in the road and shouted "You idiot!"

I could have stopped dead. I could stop dead every time a pedestrian moves near me. I can certainly try to anticipate others' mistakes - all road users should do that.

But I can't completely prevent accidents.

thirdcrank · Post by **thirdcrank** » 27 Apr 2008, 9:53pm

I only remember hitting one pedestrian who stepped off the footway in front of me in the middle of Bradford. She was OK - she glanced off my left arm which was stretched forwards covering the brake lever. Her umbrella nearly took my eye out. I could not have anticipated her action and she still had not looked in my direction when we collided.

It is unfortunate that the virtual silence of a pedal cycle has made its approach dangerous because so many pedestrians use their ears, rather than their eyes before stepping into the carriageway. That's part of the reason for the demand for bells.

I've had a few near misses, partly prevented by a last second shout. Even that can be resented. I'm completely pro-pedestrian, but looking where you are going, especially before stepping into traffic is pretty basic.

Biscuit · Post by **Biscuit** » 27 Apr 2008, 10:33pm

Hmmmmm, looking before stepping into traffic is pretty basic. Yes, but then so many 'peds' do it (that is step without looking) and will continue to do so :roll:

.... thats lazy, careless, busy, preoccupied humans for you :shock:

With that concept firmly in mind therefore it is possible to avoid/expect most cycle 'ped' interactions. Whether you want to ride so to do is another story.

The ideal is - every one looks out for me and I look out for them. The reality is - I do more than my fair share of looking out for others because that IS what my reality dictates :roll:

It p**s me off no end that I have to ride/drive/motorcycle with a view to other peoples lack of consideration for me but thats the way it goes - the main prob' is too many humans. I should know I am one.

Dont sue, get over it. Harsh tho' that may sound. You might end up with a parent counter sueing re the highway code as posted elsewhere. Its not fair, I agree....... Maybe the 'schooly' has learned the best lesson life can teach her - she may even pass it on to her kids (if she decides to lumber herself with the energy sapping money draing little blighters

)- indirectly you may have saved some lives.

Hope you heal/have healed quickly.

parkedtiger · Post by **parkedtiger** » 28 Apr 2008, 12:55pm

I sympathise - aged ten I crashed into another child when he ran into the road from between two parked cars. I wasn't going all that fast but landed badly and dislocated my left elbow by smashing up the joint on both sides. Spent a week in hospital getting it pinned back together and about a year getting it back to full strength, (although the arm has never gone completely straight since). The stinger was that the crash was on the first day of the long school summer holiday !. Anyway - 25 years later and two things have stuck with me. When I'm riding in urban areas, I look as much to what's going on to my left on the pavement as to my right on the road - at the height of the tourist season, people tend to step off the pavement whilst staring into the shop windows, not at the road. If I'm off-road, the first thing I do when I start to slam is let go of the handlebars; nine times out of ten I land on my feet / backside and the bike tumbles away down the hillside. But then accidents are accidents aren't they - you can't avoid them all - just try to reduce the odds a little. Hope the shoulder's not too bad.

AlanD · Post by **AlanD** » 28 Apr 2008, 1:36pm

I have only had one scare of this type. When turning right at a busy traffic light controlled crossroads, a 'smallish teenager' stepped off the kerb without looking right in front of me and against a red pedestrian light. It's a good thing I had not built up enough speed. Anyway, I went over the bars and knocked sideways against him as I pancaked on the road. As I sat there in the road massaging my wounds, the little S** skulked off, looking back to see me glaring back at him. He would have had a lesson never to forget if he had cushioned my fall!

What really bugs me is, and I'll put it in Jasper Carrott's famous words, "I had to swerve all over the road before I hit him." Pedestrian crossing road sees me approach, there is plenty of time to continue. I see pedestrian and have plenty of time to plot their course and plan my course with plenty of margin. Then the pedestrian stops, double backs, stops again, changes their mind. It makes me want to shout out, "Will you make up your bloody mind!" Only yesterday, I nearly collided with an adult male pedestrian who stepped off the kerb without looking, I was taking the bend at the time and attempting a sudden stop would have thrown me, so as I shot through I shouted out, "Coming through!" That must have startled him; hope he engages his brain in future.

meic · Post by **meic** » 28 Apr 2008, 4:26pm

One of the nice things about cycling is that the other party comes of pretty well from the collision, it would be a different story if you hit them with your car or motorbike.

dkmwt · Post by **dkmwt** » 28 Apr 2008, 4:43pm

I wouldn't like to think what my front chainset would do to somebodies legs if I did hit them. Or a car door for that matter.

andymiller · Post by **andymiller** » 28 Apr 2008, 4:50pm

Gisen wrote:Situations like this are why I have an air zound horn on my bike. Well, that and cars cutting me up.
The "no win no fee" claims things should be able to tell you if you have a case pretty well.

I don't know what happened in this specific case, but cyclists like any other road user have a responsibility to control their speed and to be able to stop in an emergency. The fact that someone is on the cycle lane or wearing a high-viz jacket is neither here nor there.

An air zounds horn is not a substitute for learning to anticipate and use your brakes, if you see a pedestrian approaching the edge of the pavement then you should be anticipating that they might step out without looking, slow down and be prepared to stop.

Throw the air zounds horn in bin and learn to be a better rider.

meic · Post by **meic** » 28 Apr 2008, 5:06pm

I dont agree with that, a horn is part of your provisions (NOT armoury) for dealing with the situation. It is not horn OR moderation, it is horn AND moderation.
Personally I whisper something sarcastic in their ear as I go past.

Biscuit · Post by **Biscuit** » 28 Apr 2008, 5:07pm

Cant agree to throw the horn in the bin but can agree to learn to be a better rider (any one amongst us care to consider being able to cast the stone). I know I cant, I live in a 'glass house'.

The point of the Airzound is as follows;

I could slow down and try to avoid any conflict with any one doing the most unpredictable things. Or on the other hand I could enjoy my trike razzing down the hill, vision up checking the road ahead give a 'feature six' (check out advance motoring techniques - old style not new) or an 'audible warning of approach i.e. blast my horn and attract the ped's attention and carry on swiftly thro' (ensuring that all the energy gained in the climb is dispensed down the hill).

Try an IAM course, it will do wonders for your cycling................... Even then accept that some stuff will happen no matter how much you plan.

Gisen · Post by **Gisen** » 28 Apr 2008, 5:49pm

As others have said, a horn or bell or loud shout is not a substitute for braking, it is another useful tool for road safety. Of course I anticipate pedestrians wandering onto the cycle path/ road - I can brake and press the horn at the same time.

andymiller · Post by **andymiller** » 28 Apr 2008, 6:15pm

In over ten years of riding in central London I've never felt the need for any more than a mild 'careful mate'.

In my observation there are many cyclists who seem to be under the misconception (probably picked up from car drivers) that sounding your horn/Air Zound/whistle is an acceptable way of saying 'get out of my way I'm coming through'. It isn't.

Gisen wrote:As others have said, a horn or bell or loud shout is not a substitute for braking, it is another useful tool for road safety. Of course I anticipate pedestrians wandering onto the cycle path/ road - I can brake and press the horn at the same time.

Really? How many hands do you have? Throw it away, regain you other brake.

drossall · Post by **drossall** » 28 Apr 2008, 7:27pm

I've got to say I find andymiller a bit judgmental. Remembering the basic physics that you don't hit the ground any harder if you are going fast compared to slowly, we don't actually have any evidence that the OP was riding in any way recklessly.

I accept everything said about duty of care to others, but the idea that anyone can avoid any and every accident, even if someone steps right under his/her wheels, is entirely new in road law. All we can do is to minimise the likelihood and severity of such incidents.