Cyclist In Collision Low Sunlight A Factor.

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NATURAL ANKLING
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Cyclist In Collision Low Sunlight A Factor.

Post by NATURAL ANKLING »

Hi,
The heading of my post were the words used by "Breeze" Radio south devon and Plymouth.
Also mentioned hip injury.

https://www.devonlive.com/news/devon-ne ... er-2259271
Opening line -

"A 71-year-old cyclist has been left with a suspected broken pelvis after being hit by a driver who was dazzled by the low winter sun."

Low sunlight has been used in court to get off drivers who have killed cyclist in the past.

Tomorrow it will be slippery conditions, day after bad visibility etc etc...................
NA Thinks Just End 2 End Return + Bivvy - Some day Soon I hope
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pwa
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Re: Cyclist In Collision Low Sunlight A Factor.

Post by pwa »

NATURAL ANKLING wrote:Hi,
The heading of my post were the words used by "Breeze" Radio south devon and Plymouth.
Also mentioned hip injury.

https://www.devonlive.com/news/devon-ne ... er-2259271
Opening line -

"A 71-year-old cyclist has been left with a suspected broken pelvis after being hit by a driver who was dazzled by the low winter sun."

Low sunlight has been used in court to get off drivers who have killed cyclist in the past.

Tomorrow it will be slippery conditions, day after bad visibility etc etc...................

Just out of interest, how much leeway would you give a driver who encounters black ice? Assuming they were driving fairly cautiously. I've seen vehicles slide an awfully long way having met ice at modest speed.
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bigjim
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Re: Cyclist In Collision Low Sunlight A Factor.

Post by bigjim »

The low sunlight puts me off riding at this time of year. I like a good English grey cloudy day for winter rides. I have to admit being dazzled myself at times on the bike, especially where there are low hanging trees and the road goes from extremely dark to super bright in seconds. Still no excuse for drivers who should slow right down and stop if they cannot see.
pwa
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Re: Cyclist In Collision Low Sunlight A Factor.

Post by pwa »

45 minutes for an ambulance to arrive, during which time a 71 year old man is lying on the freezing cold road with the agony of a suspected broken pelvis. 45 minutes! My Dad fell about a year ago and waited for over 3 hours with what turned out to be a broken femur.
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mjr
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Re: Cyclist In Collision Low Sunlight A Factor.

Post by mjr »

NATURAL ANKLING wrote:Hi,
The heading of my post were the words used by "Breeze" Radio south devon and Plymouth.
Also mentioned hip injury.

https://www.devonlive.com/news/devon-ne ... er-2259271
Opening line -

"A 71-year-old cyclist has been left with a suspected broken pelvis after being hit by a driver who was dazzled by the low winter sun."

Low sunlight has been used in court to get off drivers who have killed cyclist in the past.

Tomorrow it will be slippery conditions, day after bad visibility etc etc...................

Oh but they mustn't ever blame the driver because that would prejudice any court case and risk them being found in contempt of court(!) :roll:

News Reporting By Motorists, For Motorists who are listening to the bleeding radio instead of the road around them.
MJR, mostly pedalling 3-speed roadsters. KL+West Norfolk BUG incl social easy rides http://www.klwnbug.co.uk
All the above is CC-By-SA and no other implied copyright license to Cycle magazine.
pwa
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Re: Cyclist In Collision Low Sunlight A Factor.

Post by pwa »

mjr wrote:
NATURAL ANKLING wrote:Hi,
The heading of my post were the words used by "Breeze" Radio south devon and Plymouth.
Also mentioned hip injury.

https://www.devonlive.com/news/devon-ne ... er-2259271
Opening line -

"A 71-year-old cyclist has been left with a suspected broken pelvis after being hit by a driver who was dazzled by the low winter sun."

Low sunlight has been used in court to get off drivers who have killed cyclist in the past.

Tomorrow it will be slippery conditions, day after bad visibility etc etc...................

Oh but they mustn't ever blame the driver because that would prejudice any court case and risk them being found in contempt of court(!) :roll:

News Reporting By Motorists, For Motorists who are listening to the bleeding radio instead of the road around them.

Did you read it? Firstly, it said the car hit the cyclist. No sitting on the fence about that. And it reported the police urging drivers to slow right down when they can't see well enough. That could be construed as implied blaming of the driver.
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mjr
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Re: Cyclist In Collision Low Sunlight A Factor.

Post by mjr »

pwa wrote:
mjr wrote:News Reporting By Motorists, For Motorists who are listening to the bleeding radio instead of the road around them.

Did you read it? Firstly, it said the car hit the cyclist. No sitting on the fence about that. And it reported the police urging drivers to slow right down when they can't see well enough. That could be construed as implied blaming of the driver.

Yes. Did you read all of it? One step forwards ("being hit by a driver" in one place), three back - it's back to the bad old "hit by a car" (driver absentia) in the rest of the report and then the massively backwards "A spokesman for Kingsbridge Police said: "It is believed that the bright dazzling sunshine was a contributory factor in this incident."" Not the driver failing to react appropriately to it - just the sun! I can see how you could construe it as implied blaming of the driver but that seems a rather tortuous twisting of what was actually reported.
MJR, mostly pedalling 3-speed roadsters. KL+West Norfolk BUG incl social easy rides http://www.klwnbug.co.uk
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pwa
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Re: Cyclist In Collision Low Sunlight A Factor.

Post by pwa »

Bearing in mind that this is before any possible prosecution, the police were urging drivers to clean their windscreens and reduce speed appropriately if they encounter sun in the eyes, both of which could be seen as implied blame for the driver.

If the police had advised cyclists to wear hi-viz, would you not have seen that implied blame for the cyclist?
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mjr
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Re: Cyclist In Collision Low Sunlight A Factor.

Post by mjr »

pwa wrote:Bearing in mind that this is before any possible prosecution, the police were urging drivers to clean their windscreens and reduce speed appropriately if they encounter sun in the eyes, both of which could be seen as implied blame for the driver.

If the police had advised cyclists to wear hi-viz, would you not have seen that implied blame for the cyclist?

Probably, plus also a strong sign that the police aren't up to date with the research that hi-viz use doesn't reduce cycling casualty rates. Contrary to that, I'm pretty sure it's a legal requirement under the Construction and Use Regs to be able to see out of the car, so it's rather disgraceful that motorists have to be reminded.
MJR, mostly pedalling 3-speed roadsters. KL+West Norfolk BUG incl social easy rides http://www.klwnbug.co.uk
All the above is CC-By-SA and no other implied copyright license to Cycle magazine.
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NATURAL ANKLING
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Re: Cyclist In Collision Low Sunlight A Factor.

Post by NATURAL ANKLING »

Hi,
Yes I did read it, not sure what you are saying.

The radio Breeze" said "cyclist in a collision" They added "low sunlight appears (word to that effect) to have been a contributory" factor (words to that effect.

And later they still said "Cyclist in a collision............with a car..............and still said words to the effect of low sunlight being a contributory factor(words to that effect)
Devon live link says cyclist hit by car.

Its the cyclist in a collision I take umbra to!
Took them a while to mention the car.
NA Thinks Just End 2 End Return + Bivvy - Some day Soon I hope
You'll Still Find Me At The Top Of A Hill
Please forgive the poor Grammar I blame it on my mobile and phat thinkers.
ambodach
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Re: Cyclist In Collision Low Sunlight A Factor.

Post by ambodach »

With low sun my only routes for heading out cycling head roughly SE straight into the blinding sun. If I have difficulty seeing I have no confidence in dozy drivers so go for a walk instead.
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bigjim
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Re: Cyclist In Collision Low Sunlight A Factor.

Post by bigjim »

ambodach wrote:With low sun my only routes for heading out cycling head roughly SE straight into the blinding sun. If I have difficulty seeing I have no confidence in dozy drivers so go for a walk instead.

Same here. Though I've managed to do a bit of jogging the past few months.
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Re: Cyclist In Collision Low Sunlight A Factor.

Post by Samuel D »

Many drivers don’t even know how to operate the controls to demist their windscreen and other windows, nor the critical importance of doing that. I still see people peering out of steamy greenhouses or wiping the inside of the windscreen with their hand or a chamois while swerving down the road. What hope have these people of seeing out when low sunlight strikes the windscreen? Even assuming they’re not looking at their phone or fiddling with their car’s Bluetooth-connected, assisted-distraction, smart touchscreen – because modern car dashboards are so fiddly they’d need a flight engineer to man them in any safety-conscious industry.

The bald truth is that vast numbers of drivers – about three-quarters by my reckoning – are incompetent to a degree that civilised society would not accept as a new proposition in 2018.

Politically, nobody cares, not least because there is no palatable solution.
pwa
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Re: Cyclist In Collision Low Sunlight A Factor.

Post by pwa »

Samuel D wrote:Many drivers don’t even know how to operate the controls to demist their windscreen and other windows, nor the critical importance of doing that. I still see people peering out of steamy greenhouses or wiping the inside of the windscreen with their hand or a chamois while swerving down the road. What hope have these people of seeing out when low sunlight strikes the windscreen? Even assuming they’re not looking at their phone or fiddling with their car’s Bluetooth-connected, assisted-distraction, smart touchscreen – because modern car dashboards are so fiddly they’d need a flight engineer to man them in any safety-conscious industry.

The bald truth is that vast numbers of drivers – about three-quarters by my reckoning – are incompetent to a degree that civilised society would not accept as a new proposition in 2018.

Politically, nobody cares, not least because there is no palatable solution.

As demonstrated by this weekend's events in Paris?

Low sunlight can be made worse by crud on the inside of the windscreen. Anyone got any really effective way of cleaning the inside? I've spent ages trying to get ours clean in the past and not been 100% satisfied with the results.
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Re: Cyclist In Collision Low Sunlight A Factor.

Post by ChrisButch »

Worth noting that this happened to coincide with a road safety action week by the Devon and Cornwall police, which has included the WMP close pass initiative, among other things. The police officer quoted would have been conscious of this, so was using an actual incident to illustrate a general point.

As for dealing as a driver with low sun, I'm sure most of us have been in situations where a sudden bend or a gap in trees has suddenly and unexpectedly exposed the sun: and no amount of general awareness and caution about the issue will be worth anything unless you're able to react quickly. My solution to this is always to have by my left hand a loose-fitting sun-visor cap with a particularly deep peak, which I can put on in a single movement. On days when it looks as if sudden exposure is likely, I put the visor on loosely when setting out, again pulling it down with a single movement if necessary.
The peak can deal with the most dangerous instances of almost total temporary blindness.

There are also dark-tinted visors which clip on to the normal car sun visor, with a sliding almost opaque patch which can be moved to cover the sun itself. They can be folded down with one hand. I've found these very useful if you're driving into the sun for a long time in the same direction (particularly on motorways), but they're not as instantly deployable as the visor cap.
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