Danny Baker

[pete75]

I suspect he made a foolish "football fan joke" that he knew would appeal to "the lads", in an unguarded moment. I suspect that the nature of "the joke" indicates at least an endemic racism present in many of us British. I suspect that he knew his "joke" would cause a media frenzy and thus publicity (all of which is good to such slebs) but that he underestimated the degree of frenzy it would cause.

One major cultural aspect of football support in Britain (and elsewhere) is it's use as a vehicle for nationalism, tribalism and racism. This aspect is domnant - far more dominant than any anti-racist element, as anyone can hear in the football chants. There aren't any football chants heard that are anti-racist, are there? Correct me if I'm wrong.

This sort of casual racism is on the rise once more in Britiain, emboldened by the B-farce, the advent of people like Trump and Farage and the catalyst of various social media channels, from twitter and facebook to 4chan.

****
I may be wrong. There will be several journalists a-digging-oh right now into the life and times of Danny Baker. I really hope I am wrong but ........

Cugel

You are wrong. Baker is on record as a Labour party activist and a supporter of Jeremy Corbyn.

And the Labour Party, along with Jezza, is inherently free of all prejudice, racism and other naughty attitudes towards the various whipping toys....?

Cugel

They are less likely to be so. What I was referring to though is your implication that an investigative journalist might find links between Baker and the nationalist ie far right movement amongst football supporters epitomised by the Robinsonistic Democratic Football Lads Alliance. I must admit I'd barely heard of Danny Baker until this incident but reading articles by and hearing comments from people who do know him well I now believe his motives to be what he said they were ie poking fun at posh folks. I realise an upper crust chap such as yourself may regard this as very wrong.

It was a silly mistake on his part and the ways he's attempted to apologise haven't helped.

[pete75]

It seems a queer way to spend one's Saturday, with 70 000 other fans, sitting high up and far from the action, often there is no action (goalless draw)....

I did attend a couple of football matches many years ago, want to go to one again soon (a quiet one) so I know what I am talking about

In all professional European leagues the average of no score draws is 8%. You're right, you need to find out what you're talking about!

Right again, often there are two or even three events in 90 minutes

You really don't know about football if you think the only events are goals. By your reckoning there's only ever one event(k.o.) in a boxing match and not even that when they it goes to a points decision.





<edited by Mick F>

[mjr]

Er ... so you're saying that a bit of mild satire about the royals is "trolling"? Golly, you _are_ easily offended.

I am not a monarchist. And that wasn't satire and I don't remember Danny Baker claiming it was.

Eh?? What do you think "satire" is?? Here is the very first google hit, no editing on my part:

satire
/ˈsatʌɪə/
noun
the use of humour, irony, exaggeration, or ridicule to expose and criticize people's stupidity or vices, particularly in the context of contemporary politics and other topical issues.

How does that not match his explanation of the tweet??

Hang on, I'll copy the text from his twitter feed for you (as I rather enjoy reading his stuff anyway ):

In attempting to lampoon privilege & the news cycle I went to a file of goofy pictures & saw the chimp dressed as a Lord and thought, "That's the one!" Had I kept searching I might have chosen General Tom Thumb or even a a baby in a crown. But I didn't. God knows I wish had.

He says he was attempting. I hope most people would regard this as failed to do so!

[mattheus]

I am not a monarchist. And that wasn't satire and I don't remember Danny Baker claiming it was.

Eh?? What do you think "satire" is?? Here is the very first google hit, no editing on my part:

satire
/ˈsatʌɪə/
noun
the use of humour, irony, exaggeration, or ridicule to expose and criticize people's stupidity or vices, particularly in the context of contemporary politics and other topical issues.

How does that not match his explanation of the tweet??

Hang on, I'll copy the text from his twitter feed for you (as I rather enjoy reading his stuff anyway ):

In attempting to lampoon privilege & the news cycle I went to a file of goofy pictures & saw the chimp dressed as a Lord and thought, "That's the one!" Had I kept searching I might have chosen General Tom Thumb or even a a baby in a crown. But I didn't. God knows I wish had.

He says he was attempting. I hope most people would regard this as failed to do so!

How feeble!

You said it was trolling - it clearly wasn't. You are wrong - just repeating that you don't find Danny funny doesn't change that.

[mattheus]

In all professional European leagues the average of no score draws is 8%. You're right, you need to find out what you're talking about!

Right again, often there are two or even three events in 90 minutes

You really don't know about football if you think the only events are goals. By your reckoning there's only ever one event(k.o.) in a boxing match and not even that when they it goes to a points decision.

This thread has been quite amazing in drawing out people prepared to parade their ignorance - on so many subjects - whilst attempting to justify joining an internet lynch mob.

Baaaaaah!

[Lance Dopestrong]

You're not Danny Baker, are you?

[Cyril Haearn]

No, you are I think
Actually I know a lot about football, the media are full of it,unavoidable, I love the statistics in the Grauniad, one game ended 2:2, one player scored all goals, two for his team and two for the enemy
Got a good book, 'Football's Strangest Games'
The only things that count are goals, if one is distracted for a moment one might miss the only 'action' in 90 minutes when a game ended 0:1, right?
..
Not played much football mind, at my minor public school we had rugby

[mjr]

You said it was trolling - it clearly wasn't. You are wrong - just repeating that you don't find Danny funny doesn't change that.

Do you think satire is never trolling?

And you ignore the follow up "diseased mind" attack.

I've said nothing about whether I find him funny. Only that this did not satirise anything because the racism theme overwhelmed all other meanings. I find it difficult to understand how a Millwall fan didn't see a problem with calling a part-african-american a monkey.

[pwa]

You said it was trolling - it clearly wasn't. You are wrong - just repeating that you don't find Danny funny doesn't change that.

Do you think satire is never trolling?

And you ignore the follow up "diseased mind" attack.

I've said nothing about whether I find him funny. Only that this did not satirise anything because the racism theme overwhelmed all other meanings. I find it difficult to understand how a Millwall fan didn't see a problem with calling a part-african-american a monkey.

There is a bit of a paradox here, though, if we take it that he meant it to be seen as monkey = black person. He is a fairly clever, articulate person. If he had expected the image to be seen that way, he would also have expected to lose his job over it. So if it was meant that way he deliberately sabotaged his job. That is possible. Stranger things have happened. But it doesn't strike me as being likely.

[mattheus]

You said it was trolling - it clearly wasn't. You are wrong - just repeating that you don't find Danny funny doesn't change that.

Do you think satire is never trolling?

And you ignore the follow up "diseased mind" attack.
...

blah
blah

I don't really have the inclination to shoot-down every silly made-up accusation you throw-up <yawn>

the important thing here is the racism accusation. It's pretty clear to me that it doesn't hold water - a huge number of posters have said the same.

Have you heard the rumour about him torturing puppies yet? You should look into that, I'm sure you'll enjoy stirring up that one.
He once held a door open for Clarkson at Broadcasting House - YES REALLY! I couldn't believe it either - I was LIVID!!!
And he once put his recycling in the black bin - sack him AND hang him!

[Lance Dopestrong]

And Baker has backtracked from high grovelling, albeit slightly qualified, apologies. Apparently yesterday in hiss stage show he was having a right pop at his accusers. Whether anyone thinks her did wrong or not, we must surely agree that it was his fingers on the keyboard and no one is responsible for posting the picture other than him? You wouldn't think so, the way he was apparently blaming everyone except himself.

Apologies are great, if you mean them. Even if you don't, at least try and sound like you do...and then try and go 5 minutes without undermining your own apology on you live stage show 2 days later.

I did genuinely think it was an honest mistake, an error, oversight, innocent piece of gullibility even, but the movement of the needle on Baker's own Apology-O-Meter is so furious as he modifies his apologies to suit his audience, is such that I now no longer believe a work he says.

[mjr]

the important thing here is the racism accusation. It's pretty clear to me that it doesn't hold water - a huge number of posters have said the same.

Is it? Was he sacked for that or the non-apologies? Including saying he prefers red saucy sausages to brown? The BBC has not released a statement on its reasons and it'll be unusual if they do.

[mattheus]

Apologies are great, if you mean them. Even if you don't, at least try and sound like you do.

Good to know your moral stance.

[Cugel]

And Baker has backtracked from high grovelling, albeit slightly qualified, apologies. Apparently yesterday in hiss stage show he was having a right pop at his accusers. Whether anyone thinks her did wrong or not, we must surely agree that it was his fingers on the keyboard and no one is responsible for posting the picture other than him? You wouldn't think so, the way he was apparently blaming everyone except himself.

Apologies are great, if you mean them. Even if you don't, at least try and sound like you do...and then try and go 5 minutes without undermining your own apology on you live stage show 2 days later.

I did genuinely think it was an honest mistake, an error, oversight, innocent piece of gullibility even, but the movement of the needle on Baker's own Apology-O-Meter is so furious as he modifies his apologies to suit his audience, is such that I now no longer believe a work he says.

The whole thing was swiftly moved from "Baker makes a nasty racist twit-tweet" to "It's been the worst day of my (Baker's) life". Poor thing, eh?

Still, Matty will give him a hug and a recommendation. The publicity will also, no doubt, ensure he continues as a sleb of the chattering classes "just loving his humour". Yuk.

Cugel

[pwa]

And Baker has backtracked from high grovelling, albeit slightly qualified, apologies. Apparently yesterday in hiss stage show he was having a right pop at his accusers. Whether anyone thinks her did wrong or not, we must surely agree that it was his fingers on the keyboard and no one is responsible for posting the picture other than him? You wouldn't think so, the way he was apparently blaming everyone except himself.

Apologies are great, if you mean them. Even if you don't, at least try and sound like you do...and then try and go 5 minutes without undermining your own apology on you live stage show 2 days later.

I did genuinely think it was an honest mistake, an error, oversight, innocent piece of gullibility even, but the movement of the needle on Baker's own Apology-O-Meter is so furious as he modifies his apologies to suit his audience, is such that I now no longer believe a work he says.

The whole thing was swiftly moved from "Baker makes a nasty racist twit-tweet" to "It's been the worst day of my (Baker's) life". Poor thing, eh?

Still, Matty will give him a hug and a recommendation. The publicity will also, no doubt, ensure he continues as a sleb of the chattering classes "just loving his humour". Yuk.

Cugel

You seem so sure, Cugel, and I think being so sure is dangerous. You don't entertain a bit of doubt about your judgement. You have the man hung already.