The "Royals" Thread

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reohn2
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Re: The "Royals" Thread

Post by reohn2 »

Mick F wrote: 18 Sep 2022, 3:15pm So, part of the French National Anthem discusses justice and no bras. :D

Screen Shot 2022-09-18 at 15.13.12.png
Can't be that bad then eh!

EDIT:- full French Nat Anthem in French and English(for us mono lingual types):- https://www.thoughtco.com/la-marseillai ... em-4080565
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"All we are not stares back at what we are"
W H Auden
thirdcrank
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Re: The "Royals" Thread

Post by thirdcrank »

reohn2 wrote: 18 Sep 2022, 2:57pm
thirdcrank wrote: 18 Sep 2022, 1:37pm ......That's no secret. The clever part would be to initiate change.
What do you propose?
Personally I can see no way other than revolution,preferably nonviolent,but most people are more concerned with telling everyone on social media(read sound asleep)what they had for breakfast or their latest hangover!
Which is just what those running the show,includingnthe monarchy want AFAICS.

PS, the present(manufactured)economic situation may just be the wake up call,it didn't rouse many as I recall,after the last 2008 crash,though since then the gap between rich and poor has grown as fast as the number of foodbanks!
I feel under no obligation to propose anything. That's for the republicans/ anti-monarchists. But I'll reiterate I think there's no time like the present. Indeed, the opportunities are slipping away quickly.
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PS I would add that I have already made suggestions. One fairly easy step at the personal level s for people to stop participating. So, decline gongs and the rest of the trappings such as membership of anything "royal."
Nearholmer
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Re: The "Royals" Thread

Post by Nearholmer »

can see no way other than revolution,preferably nonviolent
The “preferably non-violent” bit is, unfortunately, so unlikely as to be almost completely unimaginable IMO.

Added to which, I get no sense that there is anything like a critical mass of people in favour of a republic. I think most associate that idea with executive presidencies, which don't have a universally glowing record of promoting the good of their people, names like Trump, Putin etc pop into people’s minds, rather than the names of the non-executive presidents of stable democracies.

My feeling is that the best we can sensibly hope for, and what I think would attract popular support, is a seriously trimmed-down model of monarchical headship of state, the monarch’s constitutional role, duties, and powers clearly defined and tightly limited. While we’re at it, limiting the executive power of government, by making it more effectively accountable to the whole of Parliament, and changing the name and qualification for membership of the upper house would be a blooming good idea too.
reohn2
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Re: The "Royals" Thread

Post by reohn2 »

thirdcrank wrote: 18 Sep 2022, 3:36pm
reohn2 wrote: 18 Sep 2022, 2:57pm
thirdcrank wrote: 18 Sep 2022, 1:37pm ......That's no secret. The clever part would be to initiate change.
What do you propose?
Personally I can see no way other than revolution,preferably nonviolent,but most people are more concerned with telling everyone on social media(read sound asleep)what they had for breakfast or their latest hangover!
Which is just what those running the show,includingnthe monarchy want AFAICS.

PS, the present(manufactured)economic situation may just be the wake up call,it didn't rouse many as I recall,after the last 2008 crash,though since then the gap between rich and poor has grown as fast as the number of foodbanks!
I feel under no obligation to propose anything. That's for the republicans/ anti-monarchists. But I'll reiterate I think there's no time like the present. Indeed, the opportunities are slipping away quickly.
=============================================
PS I would add that I have already made suggestions. One fairly easy step at the personal level s for people to stop participating. So, decline gongs and the rest of the trappings such as membership of anything "royal."
I can only agree with you.
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"All we are not stares back at what we are"
W H Auden
Ben@Forest
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Re: The "Royals" Thread

Post by Ben@Forest »

Nearholmer wrote: 18 Sep 2022, 4:16pm Added to which, I get no sense that there is anything like a critical mass of people in favour of a republic. I think most associate that idea with executive presidencies, which don't have a universally glowing record of promoting the good of their people, names like Trump, Putin etc pop into people’s minds, rather than the names of the non-executive presidents of stable democracies.
Non-executive presidents of stable democracies are no guarantee of probity or wise judgement. In 2012 the German President, Christian Wulff had to resign following various political and financial scandals. The current President
Frank-Walter Steinmeiern, as an SPD politician, turned down a US offer to release an innocent Guantanamo inmate and was heavily involved in promoting being dependent on Russian gas. And Karl Carstens, president in the early 1980s, was a former Nazi.
pete75
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Re: The "Royals" Thread

Post by pete75 »

Ben@Forest wrote: 18 Sep 2022, 5:09pm

Non-executive presidents of stable democracies are no guarantee of probity or wise judgement. In 2012 the German President, Christian Wulff had to resign following various political and financial scandals. The current President
Frank-Walter Steinmeiern, as an SPD politician, turned down a US offer to release an innocent Guantanamo inmate and was heavily involved in promoting being dependent on Russian gas. And Karl Carstens, president in the early 1980s, was a former Nazi.
And of course future kings and queens never had any support for the Nazis.

Image

Image
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pwa
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Re: The "Royals" Thread

Post by pwa »

pete75 wrote: 18 Sep 2022, 5:17pm
Ben@Forest wrote: 18 Sep 2022, 5:09pm

Non-executive presidents of stable democracies are no guarantee of probity or wise judgement. In 2012 the German President, Christian Wulff had to resign following various political and financial scandals. The current President
Frank-Walter Steinmeiern, as an SPD politician, turned down a US offer to release an innocent Guantanamo inmate and was heavily involved in promoting being dependent on Russian gas. And Karl Carstens, president in the early 1980s, was a former Nazi.
And of course future kings and queens never had any support for the Nazis.

Image

Image
I think I probably did Nazi salutes as a child, back in the 1960s, and it meant nothing. Just kids mucking about. All I knew about Nazis then was that they were "the other side" in a War, the "baddies". We tended to call them "the Germans" in our games. So the Queen doing it as a child means nothing. Her mother doing it probably means nothing too, though with an adult you would need to know more to be sure. The Queen's uncle did have Nazi sympathies, and it would have been interesting to see how things would have played out if he had stuck with the job of being King. We dodged a bullet there.
Nearholmer
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Re: The "Royals" Thread

Post by Nearholmer »

The date is very significant too. Things looked very different in 1933 as compared with, say, 1943. In 1933 it was probably possible to see the Nazi salute and goose-stepping as more comical than sinister.

Anyway, the one to look at in that picture. and question the motives of, even at that date, is the teacher, rather than the pupils; he was unquestionably seduced by Nazism.
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Mick F
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Re: The "Royals" Thread

Post by Mick F »

State Funeral Day today.

I was rather sure of my facts, but looked it up anyway.
The last state funeral was for Churchill in 1965. Before that, it was KGVI in 1952.
Mick F. Cornwall
toontra
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Re: The "Royals" Thread

Post by toontra »

Mick F wrote: 19 Sep 2022, 8:45am State Funeral Day today.

I was rather sure of my facts, but looked it up anyway.
The last state funeral was for Churchill in 1965.
I remember watching that as a child on a very small b&w TV.
Nearholmer
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Re: The "Royals" Thread

Post by Nearholmer »

I heard bits of it on the radio, between my father’s grumbling and doing DIY noisily, he being no fan at all of Churchill, who he regarded in much the same way as many people regard our recently deposed PM.
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Sweep
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Re: The "Royals" Thread

Post by Sweep »

pwa wrote: 19 Sep 2022, 8:13am
pete75 wrote: 18 Sep 2022, 5:17pm
Ben@Forest wrote: 18 Sep 2022, 5:09pm

Non-executive presidents of stable democracies are no guarantee of probity or wise judgement. In 2012 the German President, Christian Wulff had to resign following various political and financial scandals. The current President
Frank-Walter Steinmeiern, as an SPD politician, turned down a US offer to release an innocent Guantanamo inmate and was heavily involved in promoting being dependent on Russian gas. And Karl Carstens, president in the early 1980s, was a former Nazi.
And of course future kings and queens never had any support for the Nazis.

Image

Image
I think I probably did Nazi salutes as a child, back in the 1960s, and it meant nothing. Just kids mucking about. All I knew about Nazis then was that they were "the other side" in a War, the "baddies". We tended to call them "the Germans" in our games. So the Queen doing it as a child means nothing. Her mother doing it probably means nothing too, though with an adult you would need to know more to be sure. The Queen's uncle did have Nazi sympathies, and it would have been interesting to see how things would have played out if he had stuck with the job of being King. We dodged a bullet there.
Quite - to suggest that the queen had any sort of nazi sympathies based on that pic is simply facile. Uncle of course had more than sympathies but was got rid of.
I can recommend the recent book "traitor king" by andrew lownie. Also makes clear that wifey was a pretty nasty piece of work, and essentially despised said uncle. Reports of his last days chill the blood.
Went to a lecture by author where his views were made even clearer than in the book.
He's rumoured to be at work on a book about meg (and harry)!
Can also recommend his book on mountbatten.
Sweep
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Sweep
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Re: The "Royals" Thread

Post by Sweep »

reohn2 wrote: 18 Sep 2022, 8:47am
Practice makes perfect,but the accent is part of the language.
What's the approved accent for speaking english?
Sweep
Psamathe
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Re: The "Royals" Thread

Post by Psamathe »

Mick F wrote: 19 Sep 2022, 8:45am State Funeral Day today.
....
Gosh. Never realised that. Where do you find out about these things?

Ian
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Sweep
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Re: The "Royals" Thread

Post by Sweep »

Tangled Metal wrote: 17 Sep 2022, 10:15pm Also, can religion not be considered authoritarian too?
Yep, got a bloody awful reputation and history, crime log.
And all 57 varieties of it were pretty much silent on the central issue during the plague.
Well apart from one fundamentalist chapel i cycled past in rural lancs which had leaflets outside saying that it may be god's vengeance on us for stepping out of line.
I still have the leaflet.
Sweep
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