Air Pollution - Will They Act Now?

[Psamathe]

EVs aren't the answer when many areas it's illegal to charge them at home. EVs are middle class/ income + only right now I reckon. If you've got a driveway great if not you can't legally pass a cable over the highway to charge your car. Even a footway at the side of the road can't be crossed by a cable. Many terraced streets in the north making EV ownership less than practical.
.....

I'd not appreciated that (I don't have an EV). It is nationwide that a charging cable cannot cross a pavement?

Ian

[kwackers]

EVs aren't the answer when many areas it's illegal to charge them at home. EVs are middle class/ income + only right now I reckon. If you've got a driveway great if not you can't legally pass a cable over the highway to charge your car. Even a footway at the side of the road can't be crossed by a cable. Many terraced streets in the north making EV ownership less than practical.
.....

I'd not appreciated that (I don't have an EV). It is nationwide that a charging cable cannot cross a pavement?

Ian

It's not true.

There is no "specific" legislation however if what you did constituted a hazard then that would be covered elsewhere.
The obvious thing is to use a "pedestrian cable cover" and bear in mind if someone does trip then you could be liable (3rd party insurance recommended...)

[Vorpal]

The problem is that people want too keep driving their cars into already congested towns and cities,forward thinkng governments stop or severely restrict such papractices.Uk governments don't for fear of losing votes.

Do people really want to keep driving into them, or is there a lack of practical alternatives?

Air pollution is a matter delegated to local government, which also gets income from operating municipal car parks which tend to be in the centres of those congested towns and cities. It's a lethal conflict of interest.

People want to drive for the sake of convenience, because it's what they are used to, *and* a lack of practical alternatives.

The more practical alternatives are made, and the less convenient driving is made, the more people will use alternatives.

[Tangled Metal]

EVs aren't the answer when many areas it's illegal to charge them at home. EVs are middle class/ income + only right now I reckon. If you've got a driveway great if not you can't legally pass a cable over the highway to charge your car. Even a footway at the side of the road can't be crossed by a cable. Many terraced streets in the north making EV ownership less than practical.
.....

I'd not appreciated that (I don't have an EV). It is nationwide that a charging cable cannot cross a pavement?

Ian

It's not true.

There is no "specific" legislation however if what you did constituted a hazard then that would be covered elsewhere.
The obvious thing is to use a "pedestrian cable cover" and bear in mind if someone does trip then you could be liable (3rd party insurance recommended...)

You're right. Must admit it was my view it was illegal based on information posted on here years ago. Serves me right taking posts on here as gospel! Check sources as they say.

It's not illegal but if negligence is proven then the owner / user is liable, through their insurer assuming they've got insurance.

Personally despite that legal issue not being present on street charging really isn't a practical solution. Feeding a cable from your house isn't a practical solution unless you have an external socket for it. Our new house has such a socket, another plus point.

[kwackers]

The simplistic "Electric Dream" is pointless, it would need massive demolition & r-building projects to be carried out. Most terraced housing and blocks of flats would have to go, all to provide the necessary charging facilities, is individual driver choice worth the total cost?

I get the impression that you'd rather there be less cars and folk used alternatives?
Well, I'm right there with you.

So here's the point, people use cars because they're convenient, because they can park them right outside their houses be it terraces or flats, hop in and go somewhere.
If vast swathes of the population are no longer able to use them then the demand for alternatives will rise and demand for cars will fall.
Win win right?

However unfortunately you're wrong.
Nobody complains they cant fill their car with petrol outside their house, they simply drive to where they can.
Why do supermarkets have petrol stations? Because people shop and fillup.
EV's are just more of the same, pull into the supermarket, plug in and go and shop. (Or one of many places with chargers).
Also EV's with excess of 200 miles range are fast becoming the norm, that's a once a week charge for most people so can easily be done elsewhere. In 5 years 300+ miles is likely to be the range of anything other than a runabout. (400+ cars are already appearing).

Ultimately we have to accept the ideal (less cars) isn't going to happen in the short term and look for a solution to the OP (local air pollution) and despite what people think EV's will be a huge improvement with that.

[Tangled Metal]

As to travelling far with ev I wonder how much more if a hassle it really is. Best advice is to take a break every 2 hours. Most EVs can do more than 2 hours. Ultra fast charging is coming in so a 20 minute break would likely give you another 2 hours. Imho that charging requirement aids safety by forcing you to stop more than most people in ICE cars do.

I listened to a radio 4 piece on EVs and a family used you drive the length of the country to holiday in orkney islands iirc. They s switched to an ev and the journey didn't take them that much longer than an ICE car used to. Once they got to their intended charging point to find out it wasn't installed yet so moved on to another. Meant their break wasn't where planned. Big deal!

[Tangled Metal]

At the university charging points are at the best parking locations. Drivers plug in and leave them all day blocking the charger. Benefits are close to work and free parking at the charger. Negatives are blocked charger so less takeup due to selfish early adopters.

[kwackers]

As to travelling far with ev I wonder how much more if a hassle it really is. Best advice is to take a break every 2 hours. Most EVs can do more than 2 hours. Ultra fast charging is coming in so a 20 minute break would likely give you another 2 hours. Imho that charging requirement aids safety by forcing you to stop more than most people in ICE cars do.

I listened to a radio 4 piece on EVs and a family used you drive the length of the country to holiday in orkney islands iirc. They s switched to an ev and the journey didn't take them that much longer than an ICE car used to. Once they got to their intended charging point to find out it wasn't installed yet so moved on to another. Meant their break wasn't where planned. Big deal!

For most people EV range is just a numbers game.
So many folk I know drive short journeys everywhere, 10 miles here, 12 there and yet think they need an EV with the same range as their IC car.
The sad thing is that means they could eventually buy a car with a huge battery and pay over the odds when a car with a smaller battery would have done them fine.

On the plus side cars are appearing with battery size choices so perhaps when actually confronted with the economics of their choice in a showroom they may suddenly acquire some common sense.

The long distance travel thing is a bit of a mixed bag, when it works it's pretty hassle free but occasionally "IC'ed" chargers, broken chargers or no free chargers can be a pita and also there's no competition for chargers at sites so some providers play fast and loose.

It could also get worse before it gets better.
Whilst chargers are going in at pretty fast rates they're easily outpaced by EV sales, the good thing is most EV's are charged at home so maybe it won't be too bad.

[paddler]

The problem is that people want too keep driving their cars into already congested towns and cities,forward thinkng governments stop or severely restrict such papractices.Uk governments don't for fear of losing votes.

Do people really want to keep driving into them, or is there a lack of practical alternatives?

Air pollution is a matter delegated to local government, which also gets income from operating municipal car parks which tend to be in the centres of those congested towns and cities. It's a lethal conflict of interest.

People want to drive for the sake of convenience, because it's what they are used to, *and* a lack of practical alternatives.

The more practical alternatives are made, and the less convenient driving is made, the more people will use alternatives.

Exactly this. That very convenience has a very high value on it as well, it will be hard to persuade people away from cars in my opinion.
The best suggestion I heard was the one about ubiquitous autonomous electric cars summoned by an app. I could imagine people going for that, as long as they were prompt and cheap.

[al_yrpal]

If you live in an area where you park your vehicle on the street its actually often impossible to run a cable to charge an EV.
What if the parking is one side only, do you run your cable across the road? How often can you actually park outside your property, almost never. Been there done that. Sometimes you have to park 100s of yards away. What then? And all thats without the trip hazard, I can see legislation emerging to ban that pretty swiftly.
Anyway, EVs wont make much impact on air pollution anytime soon. The solution to the problem that started this debate is going to be extremely difficult to solve.

Al

[Psamathe]

If you live in an area where you park your vehicle on the street its actually often impossible to run a cable to charge an EV.
What if the parking is one side only, do you run your cable across the road? How often can you actually park outside your property, almost never. Been there done that. Sometimes you have to park 100s of yards away. What then? And all thats without the trip hazard, I can see legislation emerging to ban that pretty swiftly.
Anyway, EVs wont make much impact on air pollution anytime soon. The solution to the problem that started this debate is going to be extremely difficult to solve.

Al

Each trip taken by bike rather than by car means less charging needed, etc. (no need to repeat all the benefits of cycling to those already well aware) - so improve and encourage cycling and it's a start.

Maybe start deals whereby your solar panels put 1kW into the grid you get to take out 1kW from a car charger for free (i.e. a one-for-one basis from any/all chargers anywhere in UK) - so no need to park in front of your house, no cables across the pavement, etc.).

Loads of solutions and many different solutions needed each contributing a bit (not everybody will cycle, not everybody can have solar panels, but everybody that does starts solving the problem).

Ian

[paddler]

We used to run temporary telephone cables across paths and roads, covered in a protective strip. But what sort of voltage is in a charging cable? Presumably low, otherwise I can imagine trouble ahead....

[al_yrpal]

I am doing my bit. All the Xmas lights outside our cottage are solar powered. Tuesday was fine they were still going strong at 6am. But yesterday was awful they went out at about 9pm. With bright sunshine today they should be fine.

Al

[kwackers]

We used to run temporary telephone cables across paths and roads, covered in a protective strip. But what sort of voltage is in a charging cable? Presumably low, otherwise I can imagine trouble ahead....

240v. The charging cable is nothing more than a mains lead, the actual charger is in the car.
They're armoured cables though so you'd need to be fairly determined to damage them.


Kerbside chargers aren't difficult to install, just needs political will (or in this governments case a "mate" with no experience who's willing to bid 10's of billions for a job that should only cost a tenth that).
The good thing about houses - even terraces is they line streets which have power lines running along them.
But as I've already pointed out, you can charge the car elsewhere just like you do when you fill up with petrol.

[paddler]

An EV would suit me fine, even better solar power as well. Just put off by the cost. I know you can get a Nissan Leaf second hand reasonably cheap, but that would mean taking a bit of a hit on the money I spent on my present car. Plus I want to put a 16ft canoe on the roof.
I've wondered about solar panels a lot, but my roofs face east and west (there is a house on a new estate nearby with panels facing west, those were installed at the time of the build, I wonder how good they are).