Foam sleeping mats

[Psamathe]

:?: My neoair is now nearly 4 years old and has spent some months used in hot weather.

How long do they last and how does delamination show (gradual process eventually causing failure or rapid failure, what signs to note it starting and thus time to replace, etc.)

Ian

[PH]

How long do they last and how does delamination show (gradual process eventually causing failure or rapid failure, what signs to note it starting and thus time to replace, etc.)

Ian

It isn't inevitable, could last decades or months. Same with the time it takes from the first signs to the bin. The first one I had went overnight after about 90 nights use. I've had about 20 nights on my current one since the first seam started coming undone, it's still just about usable, though not as comfortable. Also depends where it goes, mine is like this (Not me photo) with the faults at the foot end, if it'd gone in the middle it'd be unusable


I haven't had a Neoair, this happens, but from anecdote less often, the shorter baffles probably helps.

[Sweep]

I realize that"camping" for you guys on the UK is often car and caravan camping for a lot of people, with your inclement climate being a big factor,

I think "inclement" resistant tents have been around for a fair while.
Ditto socks.

[nsew]

Yes, one cannot leave the old style thermorests in the sun or hot tent, nor the new lighter compact styles like the neoair. They will expand up like a sausage, not good.

On rest days w we open the valves, and generally look for a spot in shade anyway.

Just something one must be aware of and remember, that simple.
Again, if this is not your priority, use solid foam mats.
The size and weight factor of neoair type models are appealing, but there are tons of options out there for us now from numerous companies at varying prices.

I realize that"camping" for you guys on the UK is often car and caravan camping for a lot of people, with your inclement climate being a big factor, but here summer hot and hardly any rain camping means more people camp, and so our market has tons of campmat options, of all price ranges and comfort and construction types.

We are no longer able to get anything from abroad unless we send an empty truck over to get it. Part of the ‘sunny uplands’ we were promised. It’s the centre isle of the supermarket discounters for us now. The sort of stuff you need a garage to accumulate so as to kid yourself it was good value and that you still have it.

[PaulaT]

I've been using my old-style self-inflating Thermarest for a good 25 years and it's never let me down. Delamination seems to be an issue with the modern "lilo" style mats AFAICT.

[Cyclewala]

Thanks all for your input. All this talk of delamination and punctures has reinforced my belief that I am better off with a Thermarest foam mat, so have duly ordered one.

Whilst Thermarest offer a lifetime warranty and have a good reputation for honouring it, that's no consolation at 3am when the mat has lost its puff and you're kissing the floor.

If, I find that comfort is lacking after a few local overnighters I will upgrade to an inflatable.

[Psamathe]

Personally I wouldn't want the bulk of a foam mat. I can see the benefits. With my NeoLite I take a bit of care but not paranoid and they come with a puncture repair thing. Confess I've not heard of delamination before but now I know I'll give it a check before next tour but not something I'd fet over and not enough to persuade me to the bulk of a foam mat.

Ian

[nsew]

Good choice to start out with, it’s a rite of passage thing. Inflatable mats are for softies. First time I took off I didn’t carry a mat, using only an army bag with a waterproof underside for eighteen months. After that trip I carried only foam mats for many years (backpacking/general travel). Cycle toured France-Spain-Portugal-Spain-France-Ireland with a roll mat about 6 years ago. If you do move to an inflatable the Thermarest pad will remain a useful piece of kit.

[djb]

I realize that"camping" for you guys on the UK is often car and caravan camping for a lot of people, with your inclement climate being a big factor,

I think "inclement" resistant tents have been around for a fair while.
Ditto socks.

I recall wondering why the Hildeberg sp? type tents were so popular amongst Brit cyclo tourists, then realized that its because of the climate, whereas here we generally all use double wall mesh inner / outer waterproof fly outer that goes on after inner is set up.

Really all I meant is that we tend to get drier, hotter summer months than you guys, so camping is a much more common family activity, and generally associated with much less chance of rain given how our summers are compared to yours. I think its fair to say that most Brits dont camp, not in the UK anyway--or I should say, that a much smaller percentage of Brits camp compared to Canadians.
I certainly began to get this impression years ago looking up campsites in general, and compared to Canada, and especially France, there seems to be a lot lot less of them in the UK .

[KTHSullivan]

I've been using my old-style self-inflating Thermarest for a good 25 years and it's never let me down. Delamination seems to be an issue with the modern "lilo" style mats AFAICT.

+1
I have a 3/4 Thermorest that has endured all sorts of hardship over the last 25 years. SWMBO's all singing dancing air bed by the same manufacturer lasted 2 seasons.

[rotavator]

I recall wondering why the Hildeberg sp? type tents were so popular amongst Brit cyclo tourists, then realized that its because of the climate, whereas here we generally all use double wall mesh inner / outer waterproof fly outer that goes on after inner is set up.

Really all I meant is that we tend to get drier, hotter summer months than you guys, so camping is a much more common family activity, and generally associated with much less chance of rain given how our summers are compared to yours. I think its fair to say that most Brits dont camp, not in the UK anyway--or I should say, that a much smaller percentage of Brits camp compared to Canadians.
I certainly began to get this impression years ago looking up campsites in general, and compared to Canada, and especially France, there seems to be a lot lot less of them in the UK .

That's right. When camping in the UK you need to be prepared for rain and plenty of it even in high summer. Mesh inners make sense if you are camping somewhere hot and/or when rain is likely to be minor.


I don't have any statistics about the popularity of camping in different countries, however, what is for sure that last August when Covid restrictions were lifted, campsites near me were packed out, and when I went to the Scottish highlands in September, wild campers were "super abundant" in places like Rannoch Moor and Glen Orchy. So plenty of people have camping gear, vans or caravans, however, because of our unpredictable and commonly wet weather, in pre-Covid times, a lot of people preferred to fly south to countries with better more predictable weather for their main holiday.

[djb]

Thanks all for your input. All this talk of delamination and punctures has reinforced my belief that I am better off with a Thermarest foam mat, so have duly ordered one.

Whilst Thermarest offer a lifetime warranty and have a good reputation for honouring it, that's no consolation at 3am when the mat has lost its puff and you're kissing the floor.

If, I find that comfort is lacking after a few local overnighters I will upgrade to an inflatable.

Do take the "talk of delamination and punctures" with a big grain of salt. I think in my family using thermorests for 30 years plus, we've only had to patch one time.

if you camp regularly, you'll find what works for you and gives you a good nights sleep, thats all that matters.

[djb]

That's right. When camping in the UK you need to be prepared for rain and plenty of it even in high summer. Mesh inners make sense if you are camping somewhere hot and/or when rain is likely to be minor.

I don't have any statistics about the popularity of camping in different countries, however, what is for sure that last August when Covid restrictions were lifted, campsites near me were packed out, and when I went to the Scottish highlands in September, wild campers were "super abundant" in places like Rannoch Moor and Glen Orchy. So plenty of people have camping gear, vans or caravans, however, because of our unpredictable and commonly wet weather, in pre-Covid times, a lot of people preferred to fly south to countries with better more predictable weather for their main holiday.

Ive cycled in France a bunch of times, and its great how campgrounds are so abundant.
Last year, my plans to bike in the UK never even got to the serious planning stages due to covid, but my initial searching seemed to show that campgrounds were a lot more sparse and that I would have to put a lot more time into planning a route if I were to bike up to Scotland from Londonish area.

[PH]

Do take the "talk of delamination and punctures" with a big grain of salt.

I think all the talk of delamination has been about inflatable mats rather than the more traditional self inflating Thermarest style, a quick google will show there's no salt required. My third one has delaminated, that's not to say every one will, but it certainly isn't uncommon. it won't stop me getting another, though I'll look for the best, I sleep so much better on these that I consider it worth the expense and the inconvenience of a failure.
Such things can also occur on the self inflators, but the bonding is over a larger area and is manufactured with a different process, plus it's under less pressure, so it's far less common.

(Not my photo)

[djb]

I very strongly suspect that delamination happens when the mattresses have had overpressure from being left in the sun, or in a tent in the sun, that sort of thing. I think some people just don't think about it and leave them in heat situations, I certainly know from personal experience that a summers day sun will pressure up any inflate type mattress fairly quickly. I've seen the start of it on rest days as the sun moves around in the day. Often we will unstake our tent and move it back into the shade on a rest day as the sun moves around if we have limited shade.

this clearly is where a foam mat has the advantage, so if you sleep well enough on one, its certainly something not to worry about. Throw in the ease of using your mat anywhere on the ground, rocks, thorns etc for lounging.