P-38 build

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[XAP]Bob
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Joined: 26 Sep 2008, 4:12pm

Re: P-38 build

Post by [XAP]Bob »

Grab a photo of the toes only position - that's not a good start if you're not comfortable already
A shortcut has to be a challenge, otherwise it would just be the way. No situation is so dire that panic cannot make it worse.
There are two kinds of people in this world: those can extrapolate from incomplete data.
UpWrong
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Joined: 31 May 2009, 12:16pm
Location: Portsmouth, Hampshire

Re: P-38 build

Post by UpWrong »

Blondie wrote: 12 Aug 2021, 9:57pm What tyre do you have on the front? I run a Pasela 37mm
I have fitted a 40mm Racer for now. I may swap it for a 38mm folding Maxxis DTH. The rear has a 37mm Vitoria Hyper Voyage. I may swap it for a folding 32mm Panaracer Pasela PT. That would lower the seat a little.
UpWrong
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Joined: 31 May 2009, 12:16pm
Location: Portsmouth, Hampshire

Re: P-38 build

Post by UpWrong »

seldomseen wrote: 12 Aug 2021, 10:40pm Never checked out Humpert handlebars before, but they do loads of different styles - all sadly not long enough for what i need, and really cheap too. Thanks to Brexit no one in europe will ship to the uk, so had to get some from Taiwan!
I think you can find the biggest range of Humpert bars with good prices at https://practicalcycles.com/

They have an eBay shop for on-line sales. He takes it down when he's on holiday, which he was when I looked last week. Humpert do some bars with long grips but those ones are steel, so quite heavy.
Blondie
Posts: 239
Joined: 23 May 2021, 5:11pm

Re: P-38 build

Post by Blondie »

UpWrong wrote: 13 Aug 2021, 8:43am
Blondie wrote: 12 Aug 2021, 9:57pm What tyre do you have on the front? I run a Pasela 37mm
I have fitted a 40mm Racer for now. I may swap it for a 38mm folding Maxxis DTH. The rear has a 37mm Vitoria Hyper Voyage. I may swap it for a folding 32mm Panaracer Pasela PT. That would lower the seat a little.
If you fit the Maxxis DTH. I’ll be interested in how you get on with them.
UpWrong
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Joined: 31 May 2009, 12:16pm
Location: Portsmouth, Hampshire

Re: P-38 build

Post by UpWrong »

Blondie wrote: 13 Aug 2021, 8:49am
UpWrong wrote: 13 Aug 2021, 8:43am
Blondie wrote: 12 Aug 2021, 9:57pm What tyre do you have on the front? I run a Pasela 37mm
I have fitted a 40mm Racer for now. I may swap it for a 38mm folding Maxxis DTH. The rear has a 37mm Vitoria Hyper Voyage. I may swap it for a folding 32mm Panaracer Pasela PT. That would lower the seat a little.
If you fit the Maxxis DTH. I’ll be interested in how you get on with them.
That's what I have on my Nazca Paseo and my AZUB trike. My favourite tyre in that width. Good comfort and puncture resistance and grip. On the trike, 3% faster than Racers over a week's commuting on each, although I did run them at higher pressures so maybe not a totally fair comparison.
UpWrong
Posts: 2409
Joined: 31 May 2009, 12:16pm
Location: Portsmouth, Hampshire

Re: P-38 build

Post by UpWrong »

[XAP]Bob wrote: 12 Aug 2021, 11:34pm Grab a photo of the toes only position - that's not a good start if you're not comfortable already
That was my reaction. I don't mind sitting up when I stop if that helps. Putting the seat a little more upright will lower the front edge of it a little, and I'm not adverse to change the rear tyre from 37mm to 32mm if needed. My Paseo and Origam have hard shell seats which make it easy to get your legs down.
Blondie
Posts: 239
Joined: 23 May 2021, 5:11pm

Re: P-38 build

Post by Blondie »

UpWrong wrote: 13 Aug 2021, 9:03am
[XAP]Bob wrote: 12 Aug 2021, 11:34pm Grab a photo of the toes only position - that's not a good start if you're not comfortable already
That was my reaction. I don't mind sitting up when I stop if that helps. Putting the seat a little more upright will lower the front edge of it a little, and I'm not adverse to change the rear tyre from 37mm to 32mm if needed. My Paseo and Origam have hard shell seats which make it easy to get your legs down.
Is that toes only with your legs out to side of seat?
seldomseen
Posts: 21
Joined: 22 Jul 2014, 10:20am

Re: P-38 build

Post by seldomseen »

UpWrong wrote: 13 Aug 2021, 8:47am
seldomseen wrote: 12 Aug 2021, 10:40pm Never checked out Humpert handlebars before, but they do loads of different styles - all sadly not long enough for what i need, and really cheap too. Thanks to Brexit no one in europe will ship to the uk, so had to get some from Taiwan!
I think you can find the biggest range of Humpert bars with good prices at https://practicalcycles.com/

They have an eBay shop for on-line sales. He takes it down when he's on holiday, which he was when I looked last week. Humpert do some bars with long grips but those ones are steel, so quite heavy.
He has some good stuff on his ebay shop. I also found them for similar prices at SJS Cycles. The Beach Cruisers seem to be about the biggest, but still not what i need. Cheers.
UpWrong
Posts: 2409
Joined: 31 May 2009, 12:16pm
Location: Portsmouth, Hampshire

Re: P-38 build

Post by UpWrong »

Blondie wrote: 13 Aug 2021, 9:09am
UpWrong wrote: 13 Aug 2021, 9:03am
[XAP]Bob wrote: 12 Aug 2021, 11:34pm Grab a photo of the toes only position - that's not a good start if you're not comfortable already
That was my reaction. I don't mind sitting up when I stop if that helps. Putting the seat a little more upright will lower the front edge of it a little, and I'm not adverse to change the rear tyre from 37mm to 32mm if needed. My Paseo and Origam have hard shell seats which make it easy to get your legs down.
Is that toes only with your legs out to side of seat?
No, that's with both legs forward. I can't reliably choose to stop leaning to one side. What I expect is to sit up when stopping, putting both legs down, then maybe moving one leg to one side whilst using the other to push off and get going again. Once I have the brakes on and cabled, and make some more cockpit space, I'll try again. I recall how awkward I found the Paseo and the Origami at first. Familarity takes time.
Blondie
Posts: 239
Joined: 23 May 2021, 5:11pm

Re: P-38 build

Post by Blondie »

UpWrong wrote: 31 Jul 2021, 4:22pm The headset adjuster is described in the Phantom manual. It's a neat solution and depends on an adjuster ring pressing down on a combined dustcap/compression ring to preload the bearings. The problem was there appeared to be a mismatch between the dustcap/compression ring and the top cartridge bearing so that it didn't function properly either as a compression ring or as a dustcap.

I had a compression ring in my spares box which matched the bearing. So far so good. I didn't however have a dustcap which pressed down on the bearing and covered the top bearing cap. So I've retained the dustcap/compression ring as a dustcap which pushes down nicely on the compression ring I installed but there's a gap between it and the top bearing cup so rainwater is going to get in. I'll try to upload some photos.
IMG_20210731_161002_HDR-1024x1024.jpg
IMG_20210731_161019_HDR-1024x1024.jpg
IMG_20210731_161037_HDR-1024x1024.jpg
Just looking at this and seems they’ve given it a different headset type to mine. Mine is semi integrated. Yours looks old school external cup.
Blondie
Posts: 239
Joined: 23 May 2021, 5:11pm

Re: P-38 build

Post by Blondie »

UpWrong wrote: 13 Aug 2021, 11:09am
Blondie wrote: 13 Aug 2021, 9:09am
UpWrong wrote: 13 Aug 2021, 9:03am
That was my reaction. I don't mind sitting up when I stop if that helps. Putting the seat a little more upright will lower the front edge of it a little, and I'm not adverse to change the rear tyre from 37mm to 32mm if needed. My Paseo and Origam have hard shell seats which make it easy to get your legs down.
Is that toes only with your legs out to side of seat?
No, that's with both legs forward. I can't reliably choose to stop leaning to one side. What I expect is to sit up when stopping, putting both legs down, then maybe moving one leg to one side whilst using the other to push off and get going again. Once I have the brakes on and cabled, and make some more cockpit space, I'll try again. I recall how awkward I found the Paseo and the Origami at first. Familarity takes time.
I’ll generally put left foot down only if stopped for say traffic lights. If stopped for a snack or longer I’ll put both feet down. When I put both down I’ll slide legs slightly wide and sit up a bit more. With one leg down; both legs are forward.

Getting on with one brake on does help if not on a perfectly flat road. To stop you rolling back.
UpWrong
Posts: 2409
Joined: 31 May 2009, 12:16pm
Location: Portsmouth, Hampshire

Re: P-38 build

Post by UpWrong »

I tried reversing the goose neck riser. It gave more space for getting on which I managed on my own. I couldn't get off though! And the bars are too high. I would need to cut and re-slot the riser, which is feasible. I certainly need to get the brakes cabled up:
IMG_20210813_222133-1024x1024.jpg
P.S. I swapped the bars back to the other ones with more rise to get the bars closer with the reversed riser.
UpWrong
Posts: 2409
Joined: 31 May 2009, 12:16pm
Location: Portsmouth, Hampshire

Re: P-38 build

Post by UpWrong »

Looking at the last photo, it seems to me that some Giro bars might work. They are designed for a forward pointing goose neck stem and sweep back and down with no rise. I have such bars on the Origami so can swap over to give them a try. (I have the original tiller bars for the Origami which I can re-fit. I have been considering selling the Origami.)

The P-38 appears to have quite a lot of fork flop when I roll it around on the kitchen floor. I haven't taken any measurements but it looks like the carbon fork has little offset, so I suspect there's quite a lot of trail. This would reduce were I to fit a 349 rim wheel on the front whilst retaining the 700c rear wheel. The P-38 was originally designed for a 700c rear and a Moutlon (369mm) front I believe. The smaller front wheel would certainly make the ground more reeachable. I am on record as saying never again with 349 size wheels after owning a Brompton and a Catrike Speed with them! :oops:
UpWrong
Posts: 2409
Joined: 31 May 2009, 12:16pm
Location: Portsmouth, Hampshire

Re: P-38 build

Post by UpWrong »

I fitted the Giro bars with the riser pointing forwards and I was able to mount and dismount the bike successfully. I will need to take 3-3.5" off the riser so that my view isn't blocked. I tilted the seat forward a bit and was able to reach the ground with the toes of both feet. I am encouraged that it will be manageable.

That's the good news. The not so good news is that I am having terrible problems mounting the front disk calliper. I couldn't get a greased M6 bolt into either post mount hole. I did wonder if it was a M5 thread so tried an M5 bolt in the upper hole. This screwed in but was loose. I tried the M6 bolt and it wouldn't go into the top hole though it would go in the bottom hole. I decided to tap the upper hole with an M6 tap which I did with great care. Some black bits came out, presumably carbon fibre bits and resin. Maybe that was what was blocking it. After this the bolt appeared to screw in fine. However when I came to tighten it it wouldn't take the torque. 4Nm was ok, tried 6Nm and it wouldn't tighten. Taking the bolt out, some thread came out with it. Oh no! I've put in a longer bolt and have managed to tighten it to 6Nm but it's going to be a worry. I've tried aligning the calliper but it's rubbing so I shall I have to align the calliper again.

So I've made a decision to fit a 70mm drum braked wheel on the front.
Jdsk
Posts: 24636
Joined: 5 Mar 2019, 5:42pm

Re: P-38 build

Post by Jdsk »

UpWrong wrote: 15 Aug 2021, 6:08pm4Nm was ok, tried 6Nm and it wouldn't tighten. Taking the bolt out, some thread came out with it. Oh no! I've put in a longer bolt and have managed to tighten it to 6Nm but it's going to be a worry.
What's the material? And are you already familiar with threaded inserts?

Jonathan
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