Are there better solutions? (Moulton)

[fossala]

This is what I mean Mick. I honest feel that a Diverge does what a Moulton excelled at (comfort) and adds most of the speed of a road bike, if. If you wanted more speed you can get a Roubaix that weighs around 7kg!

[Bmblbzzz]

Solution to what?

The earliest Moultons, back in the 1960s, didn't have space frames but they did have small wheels. To me that's the key idea of all Moultons: small wheels and easy storage. The Diverge doesn't address those issues at all. It's a totally different sort of bike.

[gazza_d]

It's fun to crash through potholes and speed cushions on a Moulton but I reckon a lightly modified Brompton* will be quicker over most rides, simply because it climbs better. A Moulton may be stiff in its main frame but it's like a pogo stick uphill. You'd think they could figure out a lockout for the fork but no, you're riding it wrong!

*JK suspension block, bar ends and some decent pedals

assuming that the rider climbs like that. I don't. I've always cycletoured and used the gears to stay seated as I'm not racing up the hills and thrashing a fully loaded tourer isn't fun.

It is possible to put the power down through a Moulton's pedals without fighting the bike. It's just a different technique.

[rogerzilla]

AIUI thrre wasn't anything wrong with the F-frame design but Raleigh owned the rights to it, so the spaceframe was sufficiently different to be allowed.

I'm ignoring the unsuspended F-frame horrors Raleigh made here.

[iandusud]

It's fun to crash through potholes and speed cushions on a Moulton but I reckon a lightly modified Brompton* will be quicker over most rides, simply because it climbs better. A Moulton may be stiff in its main frame but it's like a pogo stick uphill. You'd think they could figure out a lockout for the fork but no, you're riding it wrong!

*JK suspension block, bar ends and some decent pedals

assuming that the rider climbs like that. I don't. I've always cycletoured and used the gears to stay seated as I'm not racing up the hills and thrashing a fully loaded tourer isn't fun.

It is possible to put the power down through a Moulton's pedals without fighting the bike. It's just a different technique.

You put it more succinctly than I did.

[rogerzilla]

Alex Moulton used to say the same sort of thing. But to get up steep hills in the saddle without ruining your knees, you need about an 18" gear as you'd find on a touring bike, which means a double or triple up front. Triples are going the same way as the dodo, but a compact 50/34 and an 11-32 cassette will just about do it. You will probably be cruising in 50 x 16 or 50 x 15, quite close to the other end of the gear range.

The new 1 x 11 setups don't really work on a Moulton. The long-arm rear mech is very close to the ground.

[fossala]

I may add, I did LEJOG in 7 days on my TSR. I’m not saying it’s a bad bike. I understand AM wanted a small step through frame that was unisex but that isn’t the main reason most people own one now, it’s for comfort with relative speed. For that there are better options.

[Norman]

It was the step through facility that made me chose a Moulton. As I get older it gets more difficult getting on and off my touring bike.
I looked at various options, a Brompton, a Tern and other folding bikes, none looked good enough to tour on (I know some people do!).
A made to measure step through frame could cost £2K or thereabouts, and that's just the frame. Argos said they have converted diamond frames to step though by removing the top tube and adding the lower tube, £600 complete. My touring bike frame is a 1962 Ephgrave and no way could I consider butchering that!
So finally I picked on the TSR A8 which hopefully will do all I need.

One question, is it worth joining the Moulton Owners Club?

[fossala]

Yes, I would join. I’m still a member!

Do the hub 8 speed come with Alfine now? If so great as they used to come with very inefficient SA ones.

[simonineaston]

One question, is it worth joining the Moulton Owners Club?

For me, yes - but more out of habit than value. It's only £15 a year, mind... The Moultoneer (paper) is always a good read if you're interested in the brand, but the members-only pages on the website (MoultonBuzz here) are less useful than the old, now defunct, Yahoo group, which in it's hayday was busy and full of fab. info from regular contributors who included such Moulton luminaries as Dan Farrell, Doug Milliken, etc. etc. - too many to name - who often answered questions posed on the group, within minutes... alas those days are gone, with the active more social side of online club membership, taking place on a non-subscription Facebook page here. That's just my pov, of course.
Where m'ship of the club does score, is giving you access the BoA meet, which if you like that sort of thing, is unique. The Hall is a classy venue and the meet attracts members from around the world - although its obviously not the same since AM passed away back in 2012 (?) it's still a super opportunity to go and stay in BoA - or indeed camp on the lawns of The Hall itself! and chat away merrily to like-minded Moultoneers.

[Norman]

Yes the eight speed on the TSR is Shimano Alfine. I picked that because I didn't like the idea of the gear mech right down close to the ground, not good on rough stuff. Avon Valley Cyclery do a mod, changing to the Alfine 11, but doubt it's within my budget.
The Traditional Cycle Shop are fitting a 22t sproket which should bring the bottom gear to about 25" I note the comments about not being able to get out the saddle when climbing, but I found that isn't easy since I changed to flat bars on my touring bike.

Thanks for the advice about the club, I will join when the bike arrives. BoA is near enough to just go for the day by car, with the bike of course.

[rogerzilla]

Keep an eye on chain tension if using a hub gear. There is a lot of chain on a Moulton TSR, and it doesn't take much wear before it gets a bit saggy and can fall off on bumpy roads, which is annoying and embarrassing.

The dropouts are also too short, meaning you may not be able to go up or down by one tooth to get the ideal gearing, unless you change the chainring and sprocket together. This is more of an issue with 3-speeds and singlespeeds. With 11 speeds you can usually find a suitable cruising gear, although perfectionists would want to engineer it so that the flat cruising gear (say 60") was direct drive.

[simonineaston]

fitting a 22t sproket which should bring the bottom gear to about 25"

I'm running a 42 / 20 combo, giving me 20" to 83" which is right up my street, figuratively and literally, my place being at the top of a steep hill !!
PS re direct drive, I recall that the Al-fee-nay doesn't have a direct (1:1) gear, so we are spared the irritation of the most frequenty used gear being slightly sticky... !

[Mick F]

Step though?

I still lift my leg over the saddle, but having tried stepping though to get on and off, it's a long way to step. The frame isn't that low and it's 4 or 5 inches wide. Often caught my foot, so it's easier to treat is a normal cross-bar bike IMO.

One issue I have, is that stopping with both feet down and using both hands, it needs some practice with your knees to grip the frame to stop it toppling. "Normal" bikes, the cross bar just sits between your upper thighs.

[iandusud]

Step though?

I still lift my leg over the saddle, but having tried stepping though to get on and off, it's a long way to step. The frame isn't that low and it's 4 or 5 inches wide. Often caught my foot, so it's easier to treat is a normal cross-bar bike IMO.

One issue I have, is that stopping with both feet down and using both hands, it needs some practice with your knees to grip the frame to stop it toppling. "Normal" bikes, the cross bar just sits between your upper thighs.

I can assure you that it's a lot easier to step over than the top tube on our tandem!