Heat in the home

[mjr]

We often visit show homes and around here they are all the same, tiny, very little outside space, but, they sell big time and according to the salespeople mostly to local people.

Well, if someone wants or needs to live in that area and all the houses are like that, as you claim, what else would they buy?

Cant comment on insulation standards but they are specified nationally and as they all have gas boilers no-one is going to be cold.

Until the gas runs out and exposes the undersized radiators. And it'll be more expensive than necessary until then. And pollute the air in the home with benzene and other harmful combustion products. It should be seen as a disgrace that so many homes unfit for the future are still being approved for building in this country. The market is failing and the regulator should intervene to correct it.

[al_yrpal]

Almost all the new houses here are the same. Larger proportion of detatched. £400,,000 down there is still more than 400 existing houses and flats for sale locally. The builder rjb described who has been equipping new build and refurbished properties with Daikin heat pumps is pretty chipper about it . Nothing to be seen online about expensive electric bills or cold to be seen. I guess such comments would be counter productive for owners who might want to sell?

Al

[mjr]

Helen Czerski: "It is completely ludicrous that anyone is still talking about hydrogen for home heating - it’s far less efficient, less safe, more expensive and less flexible than heat pumps. This report is the last nail in a coffin that is already more nail than coffin.

https://www.theguardian.com/environment ... heating-uk " - FediScience.org – https://fediscience.org/@helenczerski/1 ... 7337303001

[853]

The builder rjb described who has been equipping new build and refurbished properties with Daikin heat pumps is pretty chipper about it . Nothing to be seen online about expensive electric bills or cold to be seen. I guess such comments would be counter productive for owners who might want to sell?

As I have mentioned before, the building regulations were updated in 2022 with a 50 percent increase in wall and floor insulation. New houses built with heat pumps to this specification won't have expensive electric bills or be cold. They will save money because they won't need gas and can avoid a standing charge for it.

The obvious thing to do when building new housing estates is to not provide (by law) a gas supply.

[mjr]

The builder rjb described who has been equipping new build and refurbished properties with Daikin heat pumps is pretty chipper about it . Nothing to be seen online about expensive electric bills or cold to be seen. I guess such comments would be counter productive for owners who might want to sell?

Why would that be your guess if you weren't repeating the Big Oil propaganda in the Mail and friends? It seems much more likely that heat pump owners dissatisfied enough to complain in public are rare in reality: "Heat pumps get thumbs up from British owners across all property types in first major survey" | Nesta – https://www.nesta.org.uk/press-release/ ... or-survey/

[al_yrpal]

Not me repeating propaganda, just referring to what someone I trust said about what locals have been saying about massive electricity bills and inadequate heating. There are many stories about heat pumps, unfortunately too many are complaining of problems. It cant all be propaganda. Over the next few years things will no doubt become clearer and installers wont be making so many mistakes.

Al

[axel_knutt]

Low and middle earners are much better off here. Especially if you have kids. But you are right - if you're in the upper echelons, you get taxed fairly hard.

Wilkinson & Pickett would have it that levels of inequality are much lower in Sweden, along with the level of most of the social ills, is that your experience?.

I have mentioned before, the building regulations were updated in 2022 with a 50 percent increase in wall and floor insulation.

It's not very long ago I saw the BBC reporting that current building regulations still aren't good enough to meet Net Zero, so even new houses are going to have to be retro-fitted with more insulation.

[Jon in Sweden]

Wilkinson & Pickett would have it that levels of inequality are much lower in Sweden, along with the level of most of the social ills, is that your experience?.

I would say so. We don't live in an especially wealthy part of the country though, so maybe it's less apparent here. My friends here seem to have a range of jobs and seem to have more money to spend on their hobbies (bikes! ). But then, without childcare costs and super cheap housing, you would have more money in your pocket, even if the taxes are a little higher.

[853]

I have mentioned before, the building regulations were updated in 2022 with a 50 percent increase in wall and floor insulation.

It's not very long ago I saw the BBC reporting that current building regulations still aren't good enough to meet Net Zero, so even new houses are going to have to be retro-fitted with more insulation.

If the BBC programme was made more than 16 months ago I'd say it was correct. If less than that I'd say it was incorrect.

[Debs]

Sorry couldn't resist it:

[axel_knutt]

I have mentioned before, the building regulations were updated in 2022 with a 50 percent increase in wall and floor insulation.

It's not very long ago I saw the BBC reporting that current building regulations still aren't good enough to meet Net Zero, so even new houses are going to have to be retro-fitted with more insulation.

If the BBC programme was made more than 16 months ago I'd say it was correct. If less than that I'd say it was incorrect.

It doesn't seem like that long ago, but I'm not sure. There was a committee issued a report on climate change in general not that long ago which concluded that all the measures, both planned and existing, weren't anywhere near what's needed to reach net zero. I don't know why nobody wheeled it out when Sunak was justifying backpedalling on the grounds that we're already way ahead of our target.

[mjr]

Not me repeating propaganda, just referring to what someone I trust said about what locals have been saying about massive electricity bills and inadequate heating.

Well, that's handily unverifiable.

There are many stories about heat pumps, unfortunately too many are complaining of problems. It cant all be propaganda.

Great, it's panto season: Oh, yes it can!

A few may be true stories, but spread disproportionately by oil money.

Heat pumps, BEVs and so on are almost an existential threat to many Big Oil companies. They will almost bankrupt themselves fighting this, by fair means or foul.

Over the next few years things will no doubt become clearer and installers wont be making so many mistakes.

Heat pumps have been here over 75 years. How many more years do we wait before accepting the regulators need fixing to stamp out bad installers?

[Jdsk]

"The government is increasing its air source heat pump grants for homeowners in England and Wales by 50% to £7,500 from Monday amid criticism about slow adoption of the low-carbon technology.
"The £2,500 in extra support – on top of £5,000 offered – aims to take the cost of installing an air source heat pump below that of the average gas boiler.
"Support for installing ground source heat pumps – which are not suitable for most homes in the UK as they require access to a large outdoor space – will increase from £6,000 to £7,500."
https://www.theguardian.com/business/20 ... -and-wales

Jonathan

[Paulatic]

That should probably read as 'the government give further incentives to increase the cost of ASHP installation' The MCS installer guys must be rubbing their hands in glee. A couple of cottages in the village have recently had systems fitted including solar panels. Paid for by a Scottish government scheme for those receiving a benefit. The job must be so lucrative they sent a plumber from Perth (160 ml round trip) one night to turn on a stop tap the installer ( also a 100ml tripper) had forgotten about.
I fitted my ASHP 13 yrs ago at a cost of £1300. No MCS, no government involvement just paid a F Gas engineer to fit a unit. That price then had to be similar to getting a gas or oil boiler. Ongoing costs since fitting has been nothing more than a bottle of speciality cleaning fluid and a couple of hours of my time once a year.
Yes my system is a simple air to air which the government give no incentive to install. Imagine if they offered a50% grant on a £3000 A2A system how many people might then be willing to give it a try.

[Biospace]

So who hasn't yet 'fired up' the heating, other than for a test run?

We popped it on for a couple of hours a few afternoons ago for the first time this autumn, knowing we'd be out in the evening so no heat from cooking. The floor was still warm the following evening, which was rather pleasant. It seems this house struggles to be a comfortable temperature (over 17C on the ground floor, around 20C in the kitchen heated by cooking and refridgeration) once daytime temperatures max out at around 8C with nightime dipping to a little above freezing, when there's no sun.