Cyclist-hater refuses to move and says its illegal to cycle on this path??? (PICS INSIDE)

General cycling advice ( NOT technical ! )
thirdcrank
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Re: Cyclist-hater refuses to move and says its illegal to cycle on this path??? (PICS INSIDE)

Post by thirdcrank »

One problem is that everybody "knows" that cycling on a footpath is illegal, even when it isn't so I'd agree 100% that it's futile trying to enlighten people.

Many of the queries we get are from people who have been given a fixed penalty notice (FPN) AKA a ticket. Bearing in mind that your muttwalkers (not a legal term) may also be looking to take this further and may have complained to eg a local councillor, it's possible that if you use this route regularly, a future encounter may be with a PCSO.

Going only by your images, I'd echo what others have said about the status of this layout being unclear. As there are cones etc., still there, it looks as though this highway "improvement" (highwaymanspeak for "mess") may be unfinished and the final touches will be the road markings and signs (with or without CYCLISTS DISMOUNT etc) So, if this forms part of a regular route for you, check with the local traffic authority for what's what.
pete75
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Re: Cyclist-hater refuses to move and says its illegal to cycle on this path??? (PICS INSIDE)

Post by pete75 »

Seems to me the OP is miffed these people didn't immediately jump out his way when he rang his bell. A bit like motorists who hoot at cyclists expecting them to clear the road for them. There's a road user vulnerability hierarchy in the new Highway Code. To my mind this means a cyclist should expect to give way to folk on foot using a shared use path.
No evidence the person involve was a "cycle-hater" and the OP obviously managed to go around them.
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gaz
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Re: Cyclist-hater refuses to move and says its illegal to cycle on this path??? (PICS INSIDE)

Post by gaz »

It's on the council produced "Warwick & Leamington Cycling Guide" map as a cycle route.
Map.png
Continue to share with care.
Last edited by gaz on 16 Jan 2022, 1:56pm, edited 1 time in total.
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thirdcrank
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Re: Cyclist-hater refuses to move and says its illegal to cycle on this path??? (PICS INSIDE)

Post by thirdcrank »

I thought I saw a post here from gaz in his usual informative style. I cannot imagine gaz has upset the mods so am I dreaming?

PS He seems to have had a rethink.
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gaz
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Re: Cyclist-hater refuses to move and says its illegal to cycle on this path??? (PICS INSIDE)

Post by gaz »

It was indeed a rethink.

Having found, streetviewed, formed an opinion and posted; I then researched a little further, deleted and revised :oops: .
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thirdcrank
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Re: Cyclist-hater refuses to move and says its illegal to cycle on this path??? (PICS INSIDE)

Post by thirdcrank »

To the OP

The benefit of gaz's linked map is that it's official. (Some of these local cycle maps are privately produced and can include useful routes whose status may be unclear.) Also, his link to the whole map has some contact details for the appropriate parts of the authority. Somebody there ought to be able to explain everything, including when the signs - if any - will be installed.

And I'd agree, there's nothing much to be gained from confrontation.
PT1029
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Re: Cyclist-hater refuses to move and says its illegal to cycle on this path??? (PICS INSIDE)

Post by PT1029 »

The fact the pedestrian "knows" it is a £1000 to cycle on the footway suggests they have an "issue" with cycling/cyclists. Such people are really worth arguing with, as we all know, they know they are right.....

Looking at the link for the Warwick cycle map,
green = "traffic free path"
blue = "national cycle route"
yellow = "advisory cycle route"

The bit circled by the OP is green, so a "traffic free path" (no mention of cycling...). However, other green paths on the map look like off road (on footway) cycle tracks/routes. So basically it is as clear as mud. The map needs up dating to be clearer. That said, no where on this map does it say that the route is question allows cycling.

On Open Street map https://www.opencyclemap.org/ the path in question is marked as a dashed brown line, which the key https://www.opencyclemap.org/docs/ says "Footpath no cycling".

Although the route is convenient, it looks like cycling is not legitimate. If it a public right of way, that is the end of it. If it is a Council (or other) owned trading estate, then it will be what the land owner has decided.
If owned by the council, it does not mean it is a free for all public access (like a street), the council own swimming pools, schools etc, but 24hr public access is not necessarily the case.
thirdcrank
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Re: Cyclist-hater refuses to move and says its illegal to cycle on this path??? (PICS INSIDE)

Post by thirdcrank »

So basically it is as clear as mud.
Exactly. As it's the official cycling map, I'll jump to the conclusion that they mean "motor traffic-free" but pedal cycles are traffic.
pga
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Re: Cyclist-hater refuses to move and says its illegal to cycle on this path??? (PICS INSIDE)

Post by pga »

The answer would be for the local authority to make the route a shared cycle/footway and sign both ends accordingly. It looks wide enough to be shared use and it is an important link. These links are often crucial in avoiding busy roads.

Cyclists receive far too much abuse from other road users, whether motorists or pedestrians. It would be great if national and local government, car insurance companies, driving schools, police and the like mounted strong public awareness campaigns to go along with the introduction of the new Highway Code which promises more protection for cyclists and other vulnerable road users.
PT1029
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Re: Cyclist-hater refuses to move and says its illegal to cycle on this path??? (PICS INSIDE)

Post by PT1029 »

Looking at google street view,
the east side of Juno Drive is green on the linked cycle map. On google street view there are signs/white lines denoting it is segregated cycle/pedestrian use.
The cut through to Hermes Close is also green on the linked cycle map. On google street view it is a footpath only. No signs/white lines/tactile slabs to denote cycling. At one end there is a chicane anti cycling barrier (probably illegal under disability access regs re wheel chairs/disability buggies etc...).

So still no cycling on the cut through. With the road works, when finished that may change of course.

I would contact the Active Travel officer/councillor/local councillor saying the map is a nonsence, and it needs to mark/distinguish between:-
Footway/footpath (walking ONLY)
Shared use pedestrian/cycle use.
Segregated pedestrian/cycle use.
Currently the above 3 categories are shown the same on the map.

Open street maps may be a good resourse for this, as might google street view (but photos might be some years old...). A local cycling group might help with an audit of the green routes to record which category the route actually belongs to. Currently the map green coloured routes are not fit for purpose as a map.
My interpretation of the map key is cycle routes are blue, in which case there is only a short section of cycle route in the whole town (plus a few on road bits (red - on road cycle lanes).

It would be worth checking the map's green routes against what is allowed in practice to be able to give other examples of where cycling is and is not allowed on green routes to help back up your case. Getting a local councillor onside will help a lot.
thirdcrank
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Re: Cyclist-hater refuses to move and says its illegal to cycle on this path??? (PICS INSIDE)

Post by thirdcrank »

It may be that some local cycling campaign group is already involved.
Tompsk
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Re: Cyclist-hater refuses to move and says its illegal to cycle on this path??? (PICS INSIDE)

Post by Tompsk »

PT1029 wrote: 16 Jan 2022, 2:56pm The fact the pedestrian "knows" it is a £1000 to cycle on the footway suggests they have an "issue" with cycling/cyclists. Such people are really worth arguing with, as we all know, they know they are right.....
My emphasis, did you mean 'rarely', I'm not sure you are recommending the 'full half hour' argument or to leave well alone as it isn't worth wasting ones breath...

PS. The path seems the usual mess of poorly informing users to avoid confusions like the op has experienced.
Tangled Metal
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Re: Cyclist-hater refuses to move and says its illegal to cycle on this path??? (PICS INSIDE)

Post by Tangled Metal »

Traffic free routes is a very unclear phrase. However the signage in that linked to council document is interesting. Unless there's a blue cycle sign with a bike and pedestrian on it I think you treat it as a pedestrian route only until signage or council confirmation otherwise.

That's not to say you don't ride it. If nobody around it is up to you whether you ignore the potential lack of right to be there. However if there's pedestrians I suggest better to walk your bike as it's a short section. IMHO better not to risk confrontation and damage to reputation of local cycling it might have for such a short section to walk.
eileithyia
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Re: Cyclist-hater refuses to move and says its illegal to cycle on this path??? (PICS INSIDE)

Post by eileithyia »

Bonefishblues wrote: 16 Jan 2022, 12:44pm Don't overthink it, move on with your life. You met someone with an issue, it happens. You've never had an issue before, and it's unlikely you will again. I don't think that who was right or wrong in that circumstance would have made an iota of difference to the encounter.
Agreed.
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PT1029
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Re: Cyclist-hater refuses to move and says its illegal to cycle on this path??? (PICS INSIDE)

Post by PT1029 »

PT1029 wrote: ↑16 Jan 2022, 2:56pm
The fact the pedestrian "knows" it is a £1000 to cycle on the footway suggests they have an "issue" with cycling/cyclists. Such people are really worth arguing with, as we all know, they know they are right.....
Thanks for the observation Tompsk. Correct, I meant "rarely", not "really"!
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