Can the Met be trusted?

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pete75
Posts: 16370
Joined: 24 Jul 2007, 2:37pm

Re: Can the Met be trusted?

Post by pete75 »

thirdcrank wrote: 21 Jan 2023, 2:03pm You are entitled to hold whatever views you please as far as I'm concerned so IMO there's no suggestion from me that you have to defend them. OTOH, that did seem a fairly explicit personal explanation of your frequently expressed antipathy towards the police and not one you were manoeuvred into. I wouldn't want to argue about the meaning or etymology of "busted".

I can understand that somebody who felt they had been badly treated by the police would feel resentful.
Not resentful, well not now though I was at the time. Back then we were brought up to trust the Police and think they were there to help us. The way they picked on us young motorcyclists made me realise that wasn't always the case.
'Give me my bike, a bit of sunshine - and a stop-off for a lunchtime pint - and I'm a happy man.' - Reg Baker
djnotts
Posts: 3036
Joined: 26 May 2008, 12:51pm
Location: Nottingham

Re: Can the Met be trusted?

Post by djnotts »

Old bikers do indeed carry memories - I once got pulled over 3 times in one mile, long hair and a m'cycle....get him!
And when I was living at home one summer I got stopped walking home every Saturday night for 2 months by same copper and pushed up against same wall and given a mild slap - "only hippy in the area" treatment.
In Leeds if got dragged into Central police station pretty much guaranteed to fall down the steps to the cells.
I can only imagine how much worse it must be now if one is young and not white.
All coppers are.....
thirdcrank
Posts: 36776
Joined: 9 Jan 2007, 2:44pm

Re: Can the Met be trusted?

Post by thirdcrank »

@pete75

My only reason for posting was to add a bit to the parts of this exchange I've highlighted.
pete75 wrote: 21 Jan 2023, 12:50pm
ossie wrote: 21 Jan 2023, 12:25am
pete75 wrote: 20 Jan 2023, 11:18pm
Methinks you protest too much. Not a police officer by any chance are you? Certainly women I've mentioned this to say they'd be very wary of stopping. for a single male police officer in uniform or not. The police are losing the trust of the public and if you're a police officer who thinks they aren't you're a fool.
Of course you must be in conversation with lots of women over the subject which quite frankly is bizarre.

As far as I'm aware there has never been a case of a female accosted by a unformed officer on a lonely road or anywhere in recent times. Notwithstanding there are 50,000 female officers you are clearly struggling with your police prejudice. If you're putting this in the mind of your female friends then it's you who are the fool. They should be more aware of their Taxi or Uber driver or the stranger at the bar who might interfere with their drink than a uniformed police officer with a GPS tracked radio/ vehicle and has already consented to giving their DNA to the police data base.

For context I have two grown up daughters and a son who grew up in a town with the biggest UK night time economy, enjoyed it to the hilt and have a vast network of female friends. One works in London. They probably understand things better than you ever will and no they don't have an issue with the Police unlike you.

One can only presume you got busted for something and just can't let it go :wink:


Busted for something , no never. It's you who's a fool if you don't think the police are losing the trust of the public, and until officers realise this they'll never recover that trust.

What I also dislike about the police is they don't investigate most crimes. If your car is broken into or your house burgled the only reason to contact the police is to get a crime number for the insurance. Just what are we paying them for?
ossie
Posts: 1793
Joined: 15 Apr 2011, 7:52pm

Re: Can the Met be trusted?

Post by ossie »

thirdcrank wrote: 21 Jan 2023, 1:44pm @pete75

I assumed this quite recent post was a bit of an explanation of your views.
pete75 wrote: 4 Sep 2022, 10:00pm
cycle tramp wrote: 4 Sep 2022, 8:54pm
Let's flip the tables a moment, and wind the clock back some thirty years... you see me and my mates carrying crash helmets, there's five of us, and we're walking towards you on your side of the pavement and we're alittle loud, jeans are a little oil stained and ripped, some of us are hairy (although back then, I had taken to shaving my head) and because we've taken our leathers off you can see some tattoos on our arms... what are your thoughts as we approach you?
Over 40 years ago for me. Young bikers really picked on by the local police. Didn't the idiots realise that would taint their reputation for life amongst a generation of young men - or maybe it just give us a realistic view of police officers.
Oh dear there's a clue right there of Petes in built prejudice as we suspected. He was 'picked on' - bless. It's a shame really as I've dealt with the rehabilitation of offenders at one point, many of whom were convicted of extremely serious offences. Few felt they were picked on, most accepted the consequences of their behaviour and have moved on. Of course there are a small quite nasty minority who will never move on but they tend to be part of a hard core criminal fraternity. Then there are those who are simply anti police, that usually ties in with their political allegiance which tends to be either hard left or hard right. I suspect there's an element of politics at play here as well.
ossie
Posts: 1793
Joined: 15 Apr 2011, 7:52pm

Re: Can the Met be trusted?

Post by ossie »

pete75 wrote: 21 Jan 2023, 12:50pm
What I also dislike about the police is they don't investigate most crimes. If your car is broken into or your house burgled the only reason to contact the police is to get a crime number for the insurance. Just what are we paying them for?
If your house is burgled you will get a visit from a Police Officer and a follow up from a forensics crime team. That has never changed. I agree with your concerns about vehicle crime, however that isn't down to individual police officers.

Every year the government tell Police Forces what their priorities are. Each force then formulates a Policing Plan with the Govt priorities and their own priorities. If you're upset with the Police now don't look at your own force 'priorities' .

The Government decided a decade ago that acquisitive crime wasn't a priority so you will rarely get a visit from a Police officer. Acquisitive crime is vehicle crime, the burglary of sheds or garages (unless the garage is integral to the house), cycle crime etc. The reason they did this was because they cut police numbers to the bone during the austerity years and officers simply couldn't attend every report as there wasn't enough. As Police numbers increase some of this may be reversed as its cyclical. Labour might increase numbers further and change these priorities to ensure they win the election after they next get in.

So your wrath other than getting picked on as kid really should be aimed at the Government or your local crime commissioner or Chief Constable. They decide what gets investigated not the guys and gals in uniform.
djnotts
Posts: 3036
Joined: 26 May 2008, 12:51pm
Location: Nottingham

Re: Can the Met be trusted?

Post by djnotts »

"....most accepted the consequences of their behaviour ...."

Delete behaviour, insert colour. Or age. Or appearance. How magnanimous of them.
pete75
Posts: 16370
Joined: 24 Jul 2007, 2:37pm

Re: Can the Met be trusted?

Post by pete75 »

ossie wrote: 21 Jan 2023, 9:20pm
pete75 wrote: 21 Jan 2023, 12:50pm
What I also dislike about the police is they don't investigate most crimes. If your car is broken into or your house burgled the only reason to contact the police is to get a crime number for the insurance. Just what are we paying them for?
If your house is burgled you will get a visit from a Police Officer and a follow up from a forensics crime team. That has never changed. I agree with your concerns about vehicle crime, however that isn't down to individual police officers.

Every year the government tell Police Forces what their priorities are. Each force then formulates a Policing Plan with the Govt priorities and their own priorities. If you're upset with the Police now don't look at your own force 'priorities' .

The Government decided a decade ago that acquisitive crime wasn't a priority so you will rarely get a visit from a Police officer. Acquisitive crime is vehicle crime, the burglary of sheds or garages (unless the garage is integral to the house), cycle crime etc. The reason they did this was because they cut police numbers to the bone during the austerity years and officers simply couldn't attend every report as there wasn't enough. As Police numbers increase some of this may be reversed as its cyclical. Labour might increase numbers further and change these priorities to ensure they win the election after they next get in.

So your wrath other than getting picked on as kid really should be aimed at the Government or your local crime commissioner or Chief Constable. They decide what gets investigated not the guys and gals in uniform.
The prioities of teh police should be preventing crime. Why do they think they can pick and choose which crimes should and shouldn't be investigated? If particular types of crime are ignored then they will just go on increasing. Your post has "worsened" my opinion of our police force.
'Give me my bike, a bit of sunshine - and a stop-off for a lunchtime pint - and I'm a happy man.' - Reg Baker
pete75
Posts: 16370
Joined: 24 Jul 2007, 2:37pm

Re: Can the Met be trusted?

Post by pete75 »

ossie wrote: 21 Jan 2023, 8:51pm
thirdcrank wrote: 21 Jan 2023, 1:44pm @pete75

I assumed this quite recent post was a bit of an explanation of your views.
pete75 wrote: 4 Sep 2022, 10:00pm

Over 40 years ago for me. Young bikers really picked on by the local police. Didn't the idiots realise that would taint their reputation for life amongst a generation of young men - or maybe it just give us a realistic view of police officers.
Oh dear there's a clue right there of Petes in built prejudice as we suspected. He was 'picked on' - bless. It's a shame really as I've dealt with the rehabilitation of offenders at one point, many of whom were convicted of extremely serious offences. Few felt they were picked on, most accepted the consequences of their behaviour and have moved on. Of course there are a small quite nasty minority who will never move on but they tend to be part of a hard core criminal fraternity. Then there are those who are simply anti police, that usually ties in with their political allegiance which tends to be either hard left or hard right. I suspect there's an element of politics at play here as well.
As I said above "If somebody really is breaking the law and are arrested and charged , why should they hold that against the police? They're doing something wrong, are caught and punished - its what's meant to happen and the police involved are merely doing their duty. Continually harassing people who are doing nothing wrong is an entirely different matter."

I think you'll find it's not just the people you describe who have little trust in the police , if this is anything to go by.

https://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/2022/0 ... -crumbled/
https://metro.co.uk/2022/03/29/i-would- ... -14567530/
https://www.ft.com/content/7248ac3d-c2e ... 3365feae97

Oh and here's one of those hard left police critics.
https://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/2023/0 ... o-excuses/
'Give me my bike, a bit of sunshine - and a stop-off for a lunchtime pint - and I'm a happy man.' - Reg Baker
ossie
Posts: 1793
Joined: 15 Apr 2011, 7:52pm

Re: Can the Met be trusted?

Post by ossie »

pete75 wrote: 23 Jan 2023, 11:21am
The prioities of teh police should be preventing crime. Why do they think they can pick and choose which crimes should and shouldn't be investigated? If particular types of crime are ignored then they will just go on increasing. Your post has "worsened" my opinion of our police force.
Government priorities aside (which forces are marked upon) I forgot to mention local police priorities are based on community consultative meetings so its not a case of the police picking and choosing. I've been out some time but this used to be in no particular order : cyclists on pavements, anti social behaviour and dogs crapping on pavements.
pete75
Posts: 16370
Joined: 24 Jul 2007, 2:37pm

Re: Can the Met be trusted?

Post by pete75 »

ossie wrote: 23 Jan 2023, 10:52pm
pete75 wrote: 23 Jan 2023, 11:21am
The prioities of teh police should be preventing crime. Why do they think they can pick and choose which crimes should and shouldn't be investigated? If particular types of crime are ignored then they will just go on increasing. Your post has "worsened" my opinion of our police force.
Government priorities aside (which forces are marked upon) I forgot to mention local police priorities are based on community consultative meetings so its not a case of the police picking and choosing. I've been out some time but this used to be in no particular order : cyclists on pavements, anti social behaviour and dogs crapping on pavements.
All pretty minor stuff compared to a tradesman's garage being broken into and his tools stolen, robbing him of his livelihood until he can replace them, which may take a while when a few thousand is needed and it's an insurance claim, similar if his van is nicked.

Dogs crapping on pavements is enforced by the council these days, anti social behaviour isn't illegal else it'd be called illegal behaviour and riding bikes on the pavement may or may not be legal. Most complaints about cyclists on pavements in our local town are because many people don't seem to know the meaning of those round blue signs with a bicycle and two pedestrians in white, unless they're driving, in which case they chide cyclists for not riding on them.

Another anti-police story from that well known bastion of the far left, The Daily Telegraph.
“There has been a degree of tolerance for abuse by serving officers, so this will undoubtedly lead to the uncovering of more – and not only in the Met,” says former inspector of HM police Zoe Billingham, who published a report into abuses of police power in 2019, called Shining a Light on Betrayal. What surprised her most, she says, was “the extent to which female officers are singled out for abuse by their male counterparts. I heard some really harrowing stories. So if you’re a woman police officer and you know that you have colleagues who are rogue, [you’ll want to be reassured] they are being reviewed.”

Or as Jess puts it: “If we catch every single person within the police that’s doing this, those numbers will be very scary.”


https://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/2023/0 ... ice-force/
'Give me my bike, a bit of sunshine - and a stop-off for a lunchtime pint - and I'm a happy man.' - Reg Baker
Stevek76
Posts: 2085
Joined: 28 Jul 2015, 11:23am

Re: Can the Met be trusted?

Post by Stevek76 »

https://yougov.co.uk/topics/politics/su ... 23/99e68/3

From one of their daily questions yesterday so treat with slightly more caution than a regular opinion poll, however seems fairly damning nonetheless.
The contents of this post, unless otherwise stated, are opinions of the author and may actually be complete codswallop
reohn2
Posts: 45158
Joined: 26 Jun 2009, 8:21pm

Re: Can the Met be trusted?

Post by reohn2 »

Looks as if the new Met top dog is grasping the nettle:- https://news.sky.com/story/met-police-s ... s-12795025
-----------------------------------------------------------
"All we are not stares back at what we are"
W H Auden
reohn2
Posts: 45158
Joined: 26 Jun 2009, 8:21pm

Re: Can the Met be trusted?

Post by reohn2 »

Worth a watch,people of colour and the MET:- https://youtu.be/KyiP-D3CYzM they've a lot of work to do to restore anyone's confidence in the police.....
-----------------------------------------------------------
"All we are not stares back at what we are"
W H Auden
pete75
Posts: 16370
Joined: 24 Jul 2007, 2:37pm

Re: Can the Met be trusted?

Post by pete75 »

reohn2 wrote: 26 Feb 2023, 12:37pm Worth a watch,people of colour and the MET:- https://youtu.be/KyiP-D3CYzM they've a lot of work to do to restore anyone's confidence in the police.....
Don't affect my confidence. Am confident a lot of officers hold racist views that affect the way they carry out their duties.
'Give me my bike, a bit of sunshine - and a stop-off for a lunchtime pint - and I'm a happy man.' - Reg Baker
ossie
Posts: 1793
Joined: 15 Apr 2011, 7:52pm

Re: Can the Met be trusted?

Post by ossie »

pete75 wrote: 2 Mar 2023, 8:18pm
Don't affect my confidence. Am confident a lot of officers hold racist views that affect the way they carry out their duties.
One could take certain posters more seriously if the race card wasn't used like confetti to try and prove a point on a regular basis. Notwithstanding your long term hatred of the cops since you were pulled over on a motorcycle for being a public nuisance 60 years ago. :lol:
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