War on Our Doorstep: How do we respond?

[pete75]

Russia is a signatory to the Geneva Convention, as such it is supposed to teach its soldiers what its provisions are - i.e. what they may or may not do in combat, how to treat civilians etc.

I read recently Russia doesn't bother teaching the GC to its soldiers. I don't know whether it's true - but the actions of their troops (and worryingly their commanders) suggest it is true.

Isn't our government in the process of passing a bill to prevent the prosecution of British troops for war crimes committed overseas?

[Psamathe]

Russia is a signatory to the Geneva Convention, as such it is supposed to teach its soldiers what its provisions are - i.e. what they may or may not do in combat, how to treat civilians etc.

I read recently Russia doesn't bother teaching the GC to its soldiers. I don't know whether it's true - but the actions of their troops (and worryingly their commanders) suggest it is true.

Isn't our government in the process of passing a bill to prevent the prosecution of British troops for war crimes committed overseas?

I'm no lawyer nor know much about war crime prosecutions but can the UK actually do that without withdrawing from the ICC? I (maybe incorrectly) assumed that if a war crime it alleged to have been committed and the nation in question fails to investigate/prosecute then the ICC investigates and prosecutes. It would seem complete madness for a signatory to decide to remain a signatory whilst granting its forces exemption (other than in domestic civil war).

I've not seen the UK proposals but I would wonder if this is just the current incumbents trying to look tough and coming up with yet another illegal, impractical, inhumane, etc. proposal to be "red meat" to a small sector of their supporters?

Ian

[reohn2]

Peter Zeihan on the state of Russia:- https://youtu.be/qKDX3E7SvWw

[Stevek76]

The overseas operations bill was passed about a year ago.

It put a 5 year limit on on prosecutions for offenses during course of duty unless attorney general overrule.

A lords amendment to exclude war crimes, torture etc from this was successful.

[UpWrong]

Peter Zeihan on the state of Russia:- https://youtu.be/qKDX3E7SvWw

The guy's an idiot, although the point about Russia having an imminent demographic crisis appears to be valid. Have you listened to the BBC Podcast series, "Putin"? All 10 episodes? https://www.bbc.co.uk/programmes/m0015nfc

I highly recommend it. Putin is a ruthless, vengeful imperialist who wanted to go down in history as another "Peter the Great". I'd forgotten how many national disasters he has presided over and managed to get away with. Unfortunately he has brainwashed a large part of the Russian population for now, and created a police state with himself as dictator.

[reohn2]

Peter Zeihan on the state of Russia:- https://youtu.be/qKDX3E7SvWw

The guy's an idiot,

How so?
I'd never heard of him before.

Have you listened to the BBC Podcast series, "Putin"? All 10 episodes? https://www.bbc.co.uk/programmes/m0015nfc

I highly recommend it. Putin is a ruthless, vengeful imperialist who wanted to go down in history as another "Peter the Great". I'd forgotten how many national disasters he has presided over and managed to get away with. Unfortunately he has brainwashed a large part of the Russian population for now, and created a police state with himself as dictator.

Thanks for the link I'll check it out.
I'm aware of Putin's madness and some of his disasters he's foisted on the Russian people,but no doubt there are many more,unfortunately.

[Jdsk]

Sweden and Finland have responded by applying to join NATO:
https://www.theguardian.com/world/2022/ ... plications

Jonathan

[Psamathe]

Sweden and Finland have responded by applying to join NATO:
https://www.theguardian.com/world/2022/ ... plications

Jonathan

Another example of Putin's "strategy" backfiring. Just like Germany massively increasing its military budgets.

Ian

[toontra]

Could we be witnessing one of the worst military strategic miscalculations of modern times? A post Ukraine Europe looks likely to be almost unrecognisable, with Russia being diminished in almost every conceivable way.

[ossie]

Sweden and Finland have responded by applying to join NATO:
https://www.theguardian.com/world/2022/ ... plications

Jonathan

Another example of Putin's "strategy" backfiring. Just like Germany massively increasing its military budgets.

Ian

I have a great deal of respect for the Germans. However they appear to be getting plenty of flak over non supply of heavy weapons to Ukraine. I think the Sweden / Finland application to join NATO is absolutely superb. I'm going to be brutally honest here but I don't think for a minute Putin would even have considered invading Finland, NATO or not, likewise Sweden. However he'll see now this as a major aggression so I guess we'll see more posturing, chest beating, threats etc. It's a comedy of errors from Putin, if it just wasn't so bloody tragic.

[Psamathe]

Sweden and Finland have responded by applying to join NATO:
https://www.theguardian.com/world/2022/ ... plications

Jonathan

Another example of Putin's "strategy" backfiring. Just like Germany massively increasing its military budgets.

Ian

I have a great deal of respect for the Germans. However they appear to be getting plenty of flak over non supply of heavy weapons to Ukraine. I think the Sweden / Finland application to join NATO is absolutely superb. I'm going to be brutally honest here but I don't think for a minute Putin would even have considered invading Finland, NATO or not, likewise Sweden. However he'll see now this as a major aggression so I guess we'll see more posturing, chest beating, threats etc. It's a comedy of errors from Putin, if it just wasn't so bloody tragic.

I now wondering if Putin may have originally planned to take Ukraine in a few days then move on to some other ex USSR countries. But likely he lost so many troops, so much equipment, etc. he'll probably need a long delay for anywhere else to re-train his troops and re-arm and that will cost and his declining income and costs will make that harder.

Additionally, in the longer term I wonder how long Russia can tolerate not having an economic relationship with the West. At what point do Russian citizens start to miss the luxury items or their banks and economy collapse without trade with the West. OK, they'll manage to trade a bit with China but I can't see China letting that grow to any sort of dependency that can't end tomorrow. Maybe a bit with India & Pakistan. But West will be stopping purchase of gas & oil as fast as possible and then we all just say "we don't want to trade with you any more at least not until you get out of Ukraine and disarm significantly ... and reparations".

"No trade with the West " will never be absolute e.g. some wheat maybe but nowhere near enough to support their economy and they could say e.g. no wheat but how desperate will they get for any trade?

Ian

[Wenagade]

Perhaps if ' we ' didn't try to park missiles on their doorstep this mess wouldn't of happened.

Very S.A.D.

[pwa]

Perhaps if ' we ' didn't try to park missiles on their doorstep this mess wouldn't of happened.

Very S.A.D.

Russia regularly sails missile-carrying naval vessels close to the UK, so the suggestion that having NATO in Poland is provocative is a bit wide of the mark. And how would you feel if you were Polish and NATO was withdrawing from Poland? NATO is insurance against Putin.

[Jdsk]

Additionally, in the longer term I wonder how long Russia can tolerate not having an economic relationship with the West. At what point do Russian citizens start to miss the luxury items or their banks and economy collapse without trade with the West. OK, they'll manage to trade a bit with China but I can't see China letting that grow to any sort of dependency that can't end tomorrow. Maybe a bit with India & Pakistan. But West will be stopping purchase of gas & oil as fast as possible and then we all just say "we don't want to trade with you any more at least not until you get out of Ukraine and disarm significantly ... and reparations".

"No trade with the West " will never be absolute e.g. some wheat maybe but nowhere near enough to support their economy and they could say e.g. no wheat but how desperate will they get for any trade?

There's a leader in this week's Economist discussing the use of import tariffs on oil and gas from Russia:
https://www.economist.com/europe/2022/0 ... imir-putin
May be paywalled.

Jonathan

[Wenagade]

Im just glad the world has insurance from the presentation of democracy & despite withdrawing from stan i hope the taliban can still provide poppy stuff for pain killers significantly for to fat people without bikes & sugar addiction for brainwashing the people that fat is bad.

Its quite simple we in the the west are saviours & Russia & China are the ones to fear & we should spend our money on hellfire missiles & not bikes for encouraging people not to rob bikes.

Although China & Russia have to catch up to invade the number of countries that we have under dubios content.

At least the Russian people will suffer resulting & the Americans can provide fraked oil over the cleaner extracted gas from the east.

&:Ukraine stuck in the middle of all this game playing over what should be common sense & decency threw leadership not OCD controll.

Then US can spend the profits dealing with fat people & purchasing more missiles for foreign policy think-tanks.

99 pages that im not going to read because their based on the news which proclaims freedom of speech a bastion & now RT has been taken down & we can just listen 24/7 to one side immersed until people on forums rekon NATO provides insurance ! from consciousness brain storming creation warped reality exceptance so far removed from the truth that those who speak it are then persucuted by those who deplore persucution.

Same applies to vaccine autonomy of body so wake
up or carryon doing their jobs for them for free via driving false narrative's from said media manipulation & mind programming.

Least nicol oh renah tesla looks to make twitter welcome for all views bar som, because that's freedom of speech not it beings usurped by fancy language as if it's importance is not really being degraded by woke subterfuge.

Europe needs to decide its own energy & defence policy.

God knows ...

https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/World_to_come