Helmet compulsion as a deterrent

[a.twiddler]

As I understand it, if a trike conversion was based on a car, eg Reliant three wheeler, it requires seat belts but not a helmet despite having no bodywork, but if the trike conversion was based on a motorcycle, then helmets are required.

Fitting a sidecar to a motorcycle still requires the rider and pillion passenger to wear helmets but there's no requirement for the sidecar passenger to have a helmet or seat belt. A sidecar outfit has its own charms, and probably is not a magnet for joyriders.

As for quad bikes, I don't know. Presumably there's some off road classification which benefits operators of largely off road vehicles such as farmers. For on road use don't they fall into some four wheeled vehicle taxation bracket? They seem to be neither fish nor fowl, with less convenience than either a car or motorbike. They are very rare where I live. Using a particular, localised set of circumstances which causes illegal use of them to be popular is hardly a basis for proposing a nationwide change to helmet law which will affect the tiny amount of legal quad bikers on the roads but will make no difference to the current illegal users.

It's about as logical as making all those untaxed, unlicenced, uninsured motorists that are about the place wear their seat belts. That'll deter 'em!

[Pinhead]

Actually it is being discussed that with the prevalence of new E bikes and the (******* scooter riders) the law will change to make helmets on all bikes compulsory in the UK

[Nearholmer]

The only quad bikes I see are used by farmers and estate workers, plus we get an annual visitation by travellers, whose teenage kids proceed to terrify the district by tearing round on them.

The estate workers ride the with three or four people aboard, on country roads, and the quads seem to be unregistered, so I think illegal in that mode of use. That lobby would provide a powerful blast against helmet law, or indeed any policing of compliance I suspect, because they use the quads to manage shoots and hunt meets, both of which are attended by the pretty influential “county set”.

The use of quads by traveller children does get policed, in an endless cat and mouse game, because it so ruddy dangerous, especially at school closing times when lots of small kids are walking home, and lots of parents with tots are about. Last year there were dark mutterings by some local dads about setting wire traps, which thankfully wasn’t resorted to.

[cycle tramp]

Actually it is being discussed that with the prevalence of new E bikes and the (******* scooter riders) the law will change to make helmets on all bikes compulsory in the UK

You're going to have to state your source of information at this point because from what the rest of us have read from government sources the current position is that the helmet law will put people off from cycling which will have a negative effect on the net health of the population with the concluding statement that as a result more people will die as a result of not getting enough exercise than the possibility of those who will be saved through helmet use.

[Jdsk]

Actually it is being discussed that with the prevalence of new E bikes and the (******* scooter riders) the law will change to make helmets on all bikes compulsory in the UK

You're going to have to state your source of information at this point because from what the rest of us have read from government sources the current position is that the helmet law will put people off from cycling which will have a negative effect on the net health of the population with the concluding statement that as a result more people will die as a result of not getting enough exercise than the possibility of those who will be saved through helmet use.

Yes, who is discussing it, please?

Jonathan

[reohn2]

As I understand it, if a trike conversion was based on a car, eg Reliant three wheeler, it requires seat belts but not a helmet despite having no bodywork, but if the trike conversion was based on a motorcycle, then helmets are required.......

If that's the law no one's either abiding by it or enforcing it!

[Pinhead]

Actually it is being discussed that with the prevalence of new E bikes and the (******* scooter riders) the law will change to make helmets on all bikes compulsory in the UK

You're going to have to state your source of information at this point because from what the rest of us have read from government sources the current position is that the helmet law will put people off from cycling which will have a negative effect on the net health of the population with the concluding statement that as a result more people will die as a result of not getting enough exercise than the possibility of those who will be saved through helmet use.

Yes, who is discussing it, please?

Jonathan

MP

[Jdsk]

You're going to have to state your source of information at this point because from what the rest of us have read from government sources the current position is that the helmet law will put people off from cycling which will have a negative effect on the net health of the population with the concluding statement that as a result more people will die as a result of not getting enough exercise than the possibility of those who will be saved through helmet use.

Yes, who is discussing it, please?

MP

Is that a reference to the MP in the Original Post or something else?

Thanks

Jonathan

[Pinhead]

I was discussing it with the Police and MP as press

Do I Need to Wear a Helmet on an Electric Bike?
If you were wondering if wearing a helmet is a legal requirement while riding an electric bike, then the simple answer is: no.

Just the same with a regular non-motorised bike, UK law does not enforce cyclists to wear helmets while riding a bike. However in some countries, such as Australia, it is a legal requirement to wear a helmet while riding a bike.

This is why the discussions are being held

However, if your e-bike has a throttle, being that you actually have a motorbike legally, you will need to wear an appropriate helmet that is in fitting with the current laws.

But overall, although it’s not enforced by law, it is always a good idea to wear a helmet while riding a bike.

This and other posts

https://discerningcyclist.com/electric-bike-laws-uk/

[Pinhead]

I was discussing it with the Police and MP as press

Do I Need to Wear a Helmet on an Electric Bike?
If you were wondering if wearing a helmet is a legal requirement while riding an electric bike, then the simple answer is: no.

Just the same with a regular non-motorised bike, UK law does not enforce cyclists to wear helmets while riding a bike. However in some countries, such as Australia, it is a legal requirement to wear a helmet while riding a bike.

This is why the discussions are being held

However, if your e-bike has a throttle, being that you actually have a motorbike legally, you will need to wear an appropriate helmet that is in fitting with the current laws.

But overall, although it’s not enforced by law, it is always a good idea to wear a helmet while riding a bike.

This and other posts, and no I will not be drawn into a protracted debate, sorry and thank you

https://discerningcyclist.com/electric-bike-laws-uk/


PRESS copy.jpg

[Pinhead]

I was discussing it with the Police and MP as press

Do I Need to Wear a Helmet on an Electric Bike?
If you were wondering if wearing a helmet is a legal requirement while riding an electric bike, then the simple answer is: no.

Just the same with a regular non-motorised bike, UK law does not enforce cyclists to wear helmets while riding a bike. However in some countries, such as Australia, it is a legal requirement to wear a helmet while riding a bike.

This is why the discussions are being held

However, if your e-bike has a throttle, being that you actually have a motorbike legally, you will need to wear an appropriate helmet that is in fitting with the current laws.

But overall, although it’s not enforced by law, it is always a good idea to wear a helmet while riding a bike.

I assume all those opposers are happy for children to not wear them, 5, 10 years etc ? YES or NO

This and other posts, and no I will not be drawn into a protracted debate, sorry and thank you

https://discerningcyclist.com/electric-bike-laws-uk/

https://swov.nl/en/fact/bicycle-helmets ... -mandatory


PRESS

[Pinhead]

I remember in a pub years back with my sons I was verbally attacked by the smokers when I said "Soon it will be banned in pubs and cafes" "never", "Won't happen", "Pubs will close", YEAH ........................

Wait 'till enough youngsters like the two who died running from the police die, it will happen.

[cycle tramp]

As I understand it, if a trike conversion was based on a car, eg Reliant three wheeler, it requires seat belts but not a helmet despite having no bodywork, but if the trike conversion was based on a motorcycle, then helmets are required.

That's not the case - their is no requirement to wear a helmet if you ride a trike. It's due to the way the helmet laws were drafted. The legislators have their heads so far up their bums, that the idea of trikes never occurred to them.
When it was eventually discovered, they covered themselves by saying as trikes made up less than 1% of motorised traffic, it wasn't worth the energy to amend

[cycle tramp]

I remember in a pub years back with my sons I was verbally attacked by the smokers when I said "Soon it will be banned in pubs and cafes" "never", "Won't happen", "Pubs will close", YEAH ........................

Wait 'till enough youngsters like the two who died running from the police die, it will happen.

Firstly, I was saddened to hear about the death of the two you people. However given their injuries it remains unclear to me whether a cycle helmet would have prevented the bodily damage which caused their deaths.

Yes there is always a threat of compulsory helmet wearing for cyclists in the UK, but currently the department of transport is advising that the wearing of bike helmets for actual non powered push bikes is left to the discretion of the rider.
If it does reach the statue books then it's going to be impossible to enforce. Especially if the legalisators use terminology like 'public place'.
If it becomes criminal law, then those under 18 will not be affected anyway.

Even if it does become law, like Fred Hill, who refused to wear a helmet whilst on his motorcycle (after they became compulsory) there may be enough people not wearing a helmet for the Police to simply give up and 'not see us' in the same manner that they 'don't see me and I'm cycling along a pavement'

Whilst I take your view that you think it's a good idea for me to wear a helmet. Guess what? - I'm an adult and I'm comfortable making my own decisions based on the evidence I have. As I've yet to don a helmet whilst driving, I figure that cycling down to the shops and back doesn't require any additional head wear, either.

(...and really, you are talking to a guy, who when he was younger used to re-act viking battles with steel weapons, and who now works with horses - so my idea of risk may be slightly more advanced than your own).

[cycle tramp]

As an aside, and in regards to risk assessment I wouldn't display any identity card on a Web forum which was publicly accessible.

Identity theft is so much easier than people would credit it*
The image is enough for me to photo shop it, change your photo to mine, create a dummy registration number (a quick search of the internet reveals the NUJ only uses numbers, and.... no... i'm not going to say how many numbers are used) and put on a false back to it... bingo, I've got me a press card... under your name

*my partner works in the fraud department for a large company