Are saddles too high on modern bikes?

[Cyclo2022]

Interesting!.....Thanks for the link!

I haven't had the opportunity to check the actual book, but "Samuel D" is a level headed sort of chap; in fact one of a number of people whose contributions on here I miss.
But this takes us right back to the start of the thread; Are saddle heights increasing?
Taking a quick look at my own bike, if I measure to the top of the saddle rather than to my bum bone dent, my saddle ends up roughly 15mm higher than if I follow Lemond's recommendation and measure to the bum bone dent, and you are adding another 10mm to that, so you end up about 25mm higher than Lemond.....an inch in old money, and thats a lot.
FWIW, most people talking about Lemond's method assume you measure to the saddle top; I really should find the book to check it out!

The thread i linked isn't terribly inspiring, but it shows this discussion has been rumbling on for a long time!

I think the idea is that you use the Lemond method as a starting point then adjust to find your own sweet spot. I experienced a touch of lower back pain just using the standard Lemond method so I raised the seat 10mm and got no back discomfort. I could maybe lower it 5mm but everything seems fine at the moment so I am going to leave it at that

[Nearholmer]

I’d never heard of the LeMond method for setting seat height before reading this thread, but I’ve long used a check-measurement based on my “trial and lots of errors” seat height, measuring from centre of BB to seat-top following the lie of the seat post.

So, I checked it against LeMond.

Well, LeMond tells me to move it down 10mm, which is interesting, because yesterday I moved it up 10mm because I was wearing different shoes from normal and it felt a gnat’s too low.

[Jdsk]

I think the idea is that you use the Lemond method as a starting point then adjust to find your own sweet spot.

And the same should be applied to all formulaic systems. Learn how to alter everything possible and then experiment.

Jonathan

[Norman H]

I think the idea is that you use the Lemond method as a starting point then adjust to find your own sweet spot.

And the same should be applied to all formulaic systems. Learn how to alter everything possible and then experiment.

Jonathan

I don't believe that any formulaic approach to bike fit will end up with the perfect position but it's likely to be fairly close and it will give you a reference point from which to commence your own fine tuning. Concentrate on a single adjustment at a time, make only small (< 5mm) changes and give yourself adequate time time to habituate to the new position. The advantage of a DIY approach is that you will learn a lot about how the various positional changes affect you and your pedalling, and gain a much better understanding of the dynamics involved. I'm an inveterate experimenter when it comes to bike fit and I'm still trying new things. Much of the inspiration for such tinkering comes from this forum.

[Jdsk]

I think the idea is that you use the Lemond method as a starting point then adjust to find your own sweet spot.

And the same should be applied to all formulaic systems. Learn how to alter everything possible and then experiment.

I don't believe that any formulaic approach to bike fit will end up with the perfect position but it's likely to be fairly close and it will give you a reference point from which to commence your own fine tuning. Concentrate on a single adjustment at a time, make only small (< 5mm) changes and give yourself adequate time time to habituate to the new position. The advantage of a DIY approach is that you will learn a lot about how the various positional changes affect you and your pedalling, and gain a much better understanding of the dynamics involved. I'm an inveterate experimenter when it comes to bike fit and I'm still trying new things. Much of the inspiration for such tinkering comes from this forum.

Yes. Many formulae give helpful starting positions, and I agree about how to experiment.

Jonathan

[Tangled Metal]

Personally I think people put bar and saddle heights at levels they are happy with. I don't think that's a new or old thing.

[Jdsk]

Personally I think people put bar and saddle heights at levels they are happy with. I don't think that's a new or old thing.

People aren't all the same.

I often help adult friends who have no idea about how to get the bike comfortable. One common issue is them putting the saddle low enough to get one or both feet on the ground without dismounting. My guess is that this comes from how we teach children.

And in this forum it's common to hear concerns that KOPS or some other formula doesn't work for individuals.

Jonathan

[Tangled Metal]

Not knowing how to get to the happy point or points isn't the same imho. If they knew how to change bike position they'd get to a point they're happy with that isn't a too high or too low saddle or bars.

I'm not sure if you missed my real point by the modified title. Namely when someone questions the modern it's often because they're of the opinion bike tech, fit, etc reached it's peak in the past. My thinking is because as a youngster in the late 70s / early 80s I used to go to see a regular milk race at Southport. They often went there and modern bikes in those days had saddles at least a high as nowadays. I had a sports bike about then and I put my saddle up high like they did. Certainly as high as road bike riders tend to now. There were people with lower saddles then and now but that was just personal choice.

[fastpedaller]

Maybe I should have made the title in the opening post "Are bike saddles too high now?" , which, having seen the subsequent posts has led me to question the title. I wasn't specifically directing my observation at 'modern bikes', more at any bike being ridden shall I say "in recent times" with the saddle set (IMHO) too high.
But of course it can be very much a personal thing..... My late Father-in-Law told me many years ago that I had my saddle too high. I ought to add I'd been a club cyclist for over 20 years at the time and raced up to 12 hours time trials. FIL had never been a regular cyclist and by his own admission never done any regular exercise (or indeed irregular!) He lived to 93 though
His observation of my saddle being too high was based on the fact I couldn't get my feet flat on the ground if I was sat on the saddle
I didn't bother discussing/explaining.
Interestingly some folk in the past have said my saddle looks too low (I don't ride 'pointy toe down', and one clubmate suggested my saddle was too high.......... Maybe that makes it about right? I just use the 'Italian method' of heal on pedal when in line with seat tube.

[Jdsk]

His observation of my saddle being too high was based on the fact I couldn't get my feet flat on the ground if I was sat on the saddle...

Yes, as above.

Jonathan

[Jdsk]

I just use the 'Italian method' of heal on pedal when in line with seat tube.

I'm familiar with "heel on pedal at furthest point of the cycle" but not that version. Thanks.

Jonathan

[Cyclo2022]

Another heel method that seems to be popular is straight leg with the pedal at the 6 o'clock position.
I would say choose any method then tweak it to where you feel comfortable

[fastpedaller]

I just use the 'Italian method' of heal on pedal when in line with seat tube.

I'm familiar with "heel on pedal at furthest point of the cycle" but not that version. Thanks.

Jonathan

Maybe I didn't explain too well - I think we are both on the 'same page' with this one as I'm (in my own way) meaning crank is in line with (ie same angle as) seat tube, which makes it at the furthest point from saddle which, of course, is not at the bottom of the pedal stroke.

[Ayseven]

I only know one thing: people doodling along on their bike hate unsolicited advice, no matter how close a friend or relative they may be. Let them be in pain. And then they quit, and you don't get to ride with them anymore. Such is life.

[gxaustin]

Adjusting saddle height is about the easiest bike fit change we can do so a bit of experimentation should suffice to get a good comfortable position.

Also makes it easy to give your bike the fashionable "high saddle low bars look".

How is that getting a comfortable position - or am I missing something? In my book fit is everything - not fashion. I'll leave that to you