D-Roads in France - yay or nay?

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jacobean
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D-Roads in France - yay or nay?

Post by jacobean »

D-roads in France represent the archetype of rural France.

Sunflowers, wheat or indeed artichokes provide an idyllic landscape which to cycle through.

However, here is the thing. Planning a trip on D-roads can be tough because sometimes the D-roads can strength sapping. A lot of D-roads have loads of little hills which ironically seem to be more tiring than big-let's-get-it-over-and-done-with big hills. Some are more sinuous. What looks like an easy 50Km cycle can actually take a whole day. Whereas on a RN (route national) road you'll cover twice the distance.

So, on D-roads your cycle will be more peaceful, you actually might not make it to your planned destination. Route national roads on the other hand, can have really annoying levels of traffic but at least your day's cycle becomes a lot more predictable. There's a good chance make to make it to your planned destination at a reasonable time.

What's your take on this? Should D-roads be avoided for the sake of predictability?
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andrew_s
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Re: D-Roads in France - yay or nay?

Post by andrew_s »

If you avoid D roads, there won't be much left to ride on, particularly as a fair number of former N-roads have been reclassified as D-roads (often with a 900 series number).
The difference is whether central goverment pays for them (N-roads), or whether regional (Departement) government pays (D-roads).

Do you stick to trunk roads in the UK?
Last edited by andrew_s on 10 May 2022, 5:50pm, edited 1 time in total.
Mike Sales
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Re: D-Roads in France - yay or nay?

Post by Mike Sales »

jacobean wrote: 10 May 2022, 5:31pm

What's your take on this? Should D-roads be avoided for the sake of predictability?
You clearly value predictability more than I.
I like to leave room for serendipity, and for discovering la France Profonde.
One thing I prefer about France is that you can actually get somewhere on the Routes Departemental.
Last edited by Mike Sales on 10 May 2022, 5:50pm, edited 1 time in total.
It's the same the whole world over
It's the poor what gets the blame
It's the rich what gets the pleasure
Isn't it a blooming shame?
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simonineaston
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Re: D-Roads in France - yay or nay?

Post by simonineaston »

In my play-book, in use for trips to Brittany / Normandy, the Department roads are often too major. I like to bumble along the Commune roads. But both tend to be at the mercy of the local landscape, really.
S
(on the look out for Armageddon, on board a Brompton nano & ever-changing Moultons)
jacobean
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Re: D-Roads in France - yay or nay?

Post by jacobean »

>>Do you stick to trunk roads in the UK?

Depends on the traffic. Depends on the risk factor!

>>>I like to leave room for serendipity, and for discovering la France Profonde.

Even if it's 9pm at night, the sun is setting and the nearest herbergements are 23kms away?
simonhill
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Re: D-Roads in France - yay or nay?

Post by simonhill »

I mix and match. Happy to follow little roads, but sometimes it's good to hit a 'highway' and get pedalling.

OPs description of the D roads is a bit harsh, but does remind me of some of the bike routes, long distance routes, EVs, etc I've had the misfortune to briefly follow.

Finally, I am always amused at the benign sounding "undulating", basically it means you are climbing for half the day.
Mike Sales
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Re: D-Roads in France - yay or nay?

Post by Mike Sales »

jacobean wrote: 10 May 2022, 5:53pm
Even if it's 9pm at night, the sun is setting and the nearest herbergements are 23kms away?
Yes.
It's the same the whole world over
It's the poor what gets the blame
It's the rich what gets the pleasure
Isn't it a blooming shame?
Psamathe
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Re: D-Roads in France - yay or nay?

Post by Psamathe »

In use cycle.travel to create a route each day. That system prefers quieter roads and in practice does use a lot of D routes. Once it has created the route I display the altitude profile and if the overall ascent is "bad" (in my terms) or if any horrible sections then I'll add "Via Points" and drag the route around a bit. Zoom in on a nasty looking hilly section and see if there is a way to adjust the route to avoid it.

I don't distinguish "D" or "non-D", just let cycle.travel use it's data to select quieter routes.

From when I lived in France, my experience was that some D routes are nice and flat but can be busy, others not so. Same in UK - near me there are two single track roads that for some reason are horrible "rat runs" (one so bad walking along is in shorts is a nightmare - stinging nettles in the bank verges you keep having to stand in ...)

Ian
jacobean
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Re: D-Roads in France - yay or nay?

Post by jacobean »

>>> Even if it's 9pm at night, the sun is setting and the nearest herbergements are 23kms away?

>>Yes.

So have you ever had to dormir alfresco?
Mike Sales
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Re: D-Roads in France - yay or nay?

Post by Mike Sales »

jacobean wrote: 10 May 2022, 6:09pm >>> Even if it's 9pm at night, the sun is setting and the nearest herbergements are 23kms away?

>>Yes.

So have you ever had to dormir alfresco?
Oui.
I have slept in all sorts of impromptu bivouacs, especially when on the thumb.
But often je fait le camping, so I have dossed in a tent, surreptitiously.
Camping sauvage.
It's a matter of temperament, I suppose.
I've been over Snowdon, I've slept upon Crowden
I've camped by the Wainestones as well
I've sunbathed on Kinder, been burned to a cinder
And many more things I can tell
My rucksack has oft been me pillow
The heather has oft been me bed
And sooner than part from the mountains
I think I would rather be dead
The Manchester Rambler Ewen MacColl.
It's the same the whole world over
It's the poor what gets the blame
It's the rich what gets the pleasure
Isn't it a blooming shame?
jacobean
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Re: D-Roads in France - yay or nay?

Post by jacobean »

>>>I have slept in all sorts of impromptu bivouacs, especially when on the thumb.

I knew a bivouac would be involved!

And as for Ewan MacColl, great interesting person. Get along, Move Along...
Mike Sales
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Re: D-Roads in France - yay or nay?

Post by Mike Sales »

jacobean wrote: 10 May 2022, 6:40pm
And as for Ewan MacColl, great interesting person. Get along, Move Along...
Dirty Old Town is a favourite too.
And The First Time Ever I saw Your Face
It's the same the whole world over
It's the poor what gets the blame
It's the rich what gets the pleasure
Isn't it a blooming shame?
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MrsHJ
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Re: D-Roads in France - yay or nay?

Post by MrsHJ »

Love, love, love D roads. Tend to avoid C roads in hilly areas as hey can have very steep climbs - as in the horror of having to get off the loaded bike.

Your description also isn’t my general experience- what you’re describing is more like C roads- D ones tend to go somewhere fairly directly but are minor routes not full of lorries.
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MrsHJ
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Re: D-Roads in France - yay or nay?

Post by MrsHJ »

Love, love, love D roads. Tend to avoid C roads in hilly areas as hey can have very steep climbs - as in the horror of having to get off the loaded bike.

Your description also isn’t my general experience- what you’re describing is more like C roads- D ones tend to go somewhere fairly directly but are minor routes not full of lorries.
Richard Fairhurst
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Re: D-Roads in France - yay or nay?

Post by Richard Fairhurst »

As andrew_s mentions, it's complicated by the fact that the State has handed down large numbers of former Routes Nationales to the départements. So a D road could cover anything from a tiny single-track mountain lane to a major route between cities.

This is a D road: https://goo.gl/maps/fqC7gnLkDc46hU4S8

So is this: https://goo.gl/maps/RraVok66NH7inEaC9

Generally the French OpenStreetMap community is pretty good at assessing roads by their traffic volumes and purpose, and classifying them accordingly. So any OSM-based planner should do a reasonable job of choosing decent ones. cycle.travel goes one further and uses real traffic data when it's available, but only about 60% of the départements actually publish it in a remotely machine-readable form.
jacobean wrote: 10 May 2022, 5:31pm However, here is the thing. Planning a trip on D-roads can be tough because sometimes the D-roads can strength sapping. A lot of D-roads have loads of little hills which ironically seem to be more tiring than big-let's-get-it-over-and-done-with big hills. Some are more sinuous. What looks like an easy 50Km cycle can actually take a whole day. Whereas on a RN (route national) road you'll cover twice the distance.
That sounds like a great reason to plan 50km days to me. :)
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