Cycling UK Forum

Hi,
I've been catching up on the TT races this week.
So far this year three people have come to grief, Plus one in critical condition, Sad really.

IIRC 250 riders have died in over 100 years of racing.
There is a policy amongst the racers that despite any death the race carries on?
I don't think there is another sport that adopts this policy?

NATURAL ANKLING wrote: ↑8 Jun 2022, 9:39am I don't think there is another sport that adopts this policy?

Horse racing. Clearly the event is too short to stop mid race but every year it ignores the issue and comes round again.

IOM TT/Street Racers are a breed of their own.They take a dangerous sport and add more danger.They know the risks and race because they love it.
Long may it continue!

Hi,
Horseracing of course is abuse of animals by humans.

As a motorcyclist I am into of course TT races/most motor races in general.
The best riders appear to be inbred with families in racing / Determined wanting to win at any cost type of people.
IIRC Michael Dunlop who is racing has had several family members killed including father uncle and brother.
corrections below-

https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Michael_Dunlop

PedallingSquares wrote: ↑8 Jun 2022, 10:12amThey know the risks...

This is often said but I've never seen any evidence for it. Of course it's a comfort to believe that it's true after someone is killed or injured.

I would guess that emotions play a much bigger part than knowledge in the decision to race.

Jonathan

I’m no motorcyclist, but I watch the TT highlights with awe and amazement. I have to say it’s mesmerising to watch. I can’t believe what these guys do.

In some respects it is nice to see an old school attitude to risk/responsibility. However, I do often wonder where the TT organisation stand from a legal perspective. What if a bereaved family sue the TT? Or is there some sort of caveat in the rider’s contracts absolving the organisers of liability and if so what level of responsibility do the organisers have in order to ensure rider safety?

Jdsk wrote: ↑8 Jun 2022, 10:57am

PedallingSquares wrote: ↑8 Jun 2022, 10:12amThey know the risks...

This is often said but I've never seen any evidence for it. Of course it's a comfort to believe that it's true after someone is killed or injured.

I would guess that emotions play a much bigger part than knowledge in the decision to race.

Jonathan

Sure, emotions are a big part - because they're not doing a job, they're racing for personal satisfaction (etc).

But that doesn't rebut the statement "they know the risks" !

audaxjk wrote: ↑8 Jun 2022, 11:19amHowever, I do often wonder where the TT organisation stand from a legal perspective. What if a bereaved family sue the TT? Or is there some sort of caveat in the rider’s contracts absolving the organisers of liability and if so what level of responsibility do the organisers have in order to ensure rider safety?

That's a very interesting question. There is a specific Act, and it includes the statutory requirement for authorisation of events, and of the required insurance or indemnity. But not the details.

Road Races Bill 2015
https://www.gov.im/media/1357476/road-r ... l-2015.pdf

Jonathan

mattheus wrote: ↑8 Jun 2022, 11:25am

Jdsk wrote: ↑8 Jun 2022, 10:57am

PedallingSquares wrote: ↑8 Jun 2022, 10:12amThey know the risks...

This is often said but I've never seen any evidence for it. Of course it's a comfort to believe that it's true after someone is killed or injured.

I would guess that emotions play a much bigger part than knowledge in the decision to race.

Sure, emotions are a big part - because they're not doing a job, they're racing for personal satisfaction (etc).

But that doesn't rebut the statement "they know the risks" !

It doesn't. But I wasn't "rebutting" anything. I stated that I've never seen any evidence that the riders know the risks.

I'm sure that they know there are some risks, but that isn't the same as "knowing the risks".

Jonathan

I rode motorbikes for a few years. One of the reasons I stopped was that I figured it was only a mater of time until I had an accident.

Nothing but respect for TT riders. They know the risks and mostly go incredibly close to the edge but stay just the right side of it.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=OmNXCJt7K3Q

Highly dangerous but in the main the people taking the risks are the ones that are hurt when it goes wrong. Their choice.

Jdsk wrote: ↑8 Jun 2022, 11:30am

mattheus wrote: ↑8 Jun 2022, 11:25am

Jdsk wrote: ↑8 Jun 2022, 10:57am
This is often said but I've never seen any evidence for it. Of course it's a comfort to believe that it's true after someone is killed or injured.

I would guess that emotions play a much bigger part than knowledge in the decision to race.

Sure, emotions are a big part - because they're not doing a job, they're racing for personal satisfaction (etc).

But that doesn't rebut the statement "they know the risks" !

It doesn't. But I wasn't "rebutting" anything. I stated that I've never seen any evidence that the riders know the risks.

I'm sure that they know there are some risks, but that isn't the same as "knowing the risks".

Are you suggesting their knowledge is incomplete? That they haven't quantified, weighed and measured the risks adequately?
Have you done some analysis?
Care to share any of this with us? Just one would help me understand your viewpoint.

NATURAL ANKLING wrote: ↑8 Jun 2022, 9:39am Hi,
I've been catching up on the TT races this week.
So far this year three people have come to grief, Plus one in critical condition, Sad really.

IIRC 250 riders have died in over 100 years of racing.
There is a policy amongst the racers that despite any death the race carries on?
I don't think there is another sport that adopts this policy?

Alpine mountaineering. Nearly all the top performers carry on until death or injury. The death rate for K2 is pretty alarming.

On Everest people climb past bodies.

A school classmate of mine crashed in an IoM.race and was unconcious for a few days.
His father had done the same, so he must have had some awareness of the risks.
I once rode pillion behind him on a riverbank path. Once was enough. He was good but rapid..

mattheus wrote: ↑8 Jun 2022, 12:22pm

Jdsk wrote: ↑8 Jun 2022, 11:30am

mattheus wrote: ↑8 Jun 2022, 11:25am
Sure, emotions are a big part - because they're not doing a job, they're racing for personal satisfaction (etc).

But that doesn't rebut the statement "they know the risks" !

It doesn't. But I wasn't "rebutting" anything. I stated that I've never seen any evidence that the riders know the risks.

I'm sure that they know there are some risks, but that isn't the same as "knowing the risks".

Are you suggesting their knowledge is incomplete? That they haven't quantified, weighed and measured the risks adequately?
Have you done some analysis?
Care to share any of this with us? Just one would help me understand your viewpoint.

Hmmm. I can't speak for jdsk, but for some reason the number of young men sustaining fatal and life compromising injuries suggests that something might be a little awry...

On my first weekend climbing in Wales we camped at Pont y Cromlech. We were called from our campfire to search for a walker who had gone over a waterfall. He was dead.
Next day, as we descended after a climb we came across the body of a fallen climber.
We carried on climbing, but I guess we were very careful!