Does saying "sorry" help?

[PedallingSquares]

Come on - Yes or No!

You are using a quite frankly discussing accusation/insinuation to try to prove your childish point.If you care to reread my posts I clearly stated in most cases a one word answer is sufficient.
Domestic abuse is not funny and should not be used to prove a point.

Excellent

Bored.

[Jdsk]

It's inherent to the "Have you stopped beating your wife?" trope that there isn't any domestic abuse. It wouldn't work if there were.

But in order to remove any uncertainty... it's traditionally used to illustrate that there often aren't simple answers to what appear to be simple questions:
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Loaded_question

Jonathan

[Bonefishblues]

It's inherent to the "Have you stopped beating your wife?" trope that there isn't any domestic abuse. It wouldn't work if there were.

But in order to remove any uncertainty... it's traditionally used to illustrate that there often aren't simple answers to what appear to be simple questions:
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Loaded_question

Jonathan

This

[Airsporter1st]

Thanks for that. My reason for asking is that the only time I've ever been asked to give an opinion on fault was in an insurance company's pro forma inquiry after I had given my details as an independent witness to a crash, some years after I had retired. FWIW, I think they ask the question to see whose side the witness is on, especially if the subsequent account is garbled. The opinion of somebody who's not an expert witness has little evidential value, especially if it's influenced by irrelevant factors.

Insurance companies do employ retired police officers as investigators, but their training and work experience don't make them any sort of specialists in civil law. I think Jdsk's link about contributory negligence demonstrates that here

I tend to agree with much of what you say.

The investigator was representing the driver’s insurance company, so I don’t. believe he had any ulterior motive and I would suggest that my account was anything but garbled. Every accident form I’ve ever filled in (and there have been fortunately few), asks for my opinion, so there must be some weight given to it, surely? Is there no differentiation between a witness to an event and an expert witness called at a trial?

Apologies for a lack of clarity on my part, probably the result of a misplaced attempt at brevity.

I didn't intend to suggest that your account was garbled, but many are, especially when written out on a form.

I was trying to move away from the implication that because a police officer says something about the law etc it must inevitably be so. Even more so in an area beyond their normal expertise.

An expert witness is a witness who is recognised as an expert in a particular field so they can give evidence of their opinion. A collision investigator might assess the mechanical condition and give their opinion about whether it caused or contributed to a crash, but there are experts in many field such as medicine, aeronautics you name it. In a case like yours, unless I've missed something your opinion would have no direct relevance. IMO, the wider point would be that your sympathy for the driver who you seem to know personally, and apparent disapproval of the casualty and her background might weaken your standing as an independent witness.

Points all well understood.

[pwa]

Excuse me?!
Where the hell did that accusation come from!?

Come on - Yes or No!

You are using a quite frankly discussing accusation/insinuation to try to prove your childish point.If you care to reread my posts I clearly stated in most cases a one word answer is sufficient.
Domestic abuse is not funny and should not be used to prove a point.

"Have you stopped beating your wife?" is often cited as the clearest example of a question that cannot be answered with "Yes" or "No", because the assumption is that the person being asked has never been guilty of that crime. Clearly, nobody thinks you beat your wife.

[PedallingSquares]

Come on - Yes or No!

You are using a quite frankly discussing accusation/insinuation to try to prove your childish point.If you care to reread my posts I clearly stated in most cases a one word answer is sufficient.
Domestic abuse is not funny and should not be used to prove a point.

"Have you stopped beating your wife?" is often cited as the clearest example of a question that cannot be answered with "Yes" or "No", because the assumption is that the person being asked has never been guilty of that crime. Clearly, nobody thinks you beat your wife.

This is not something I was aware of.Thank you for clearing that up.
I suppose one could also ask "have you stopped having sex with children?" too but I wouldn't use either for point scoring on a forum.
The lengths some will go to here to 'win' is quite alarming.

[Bonefishblues]

You are using a quite frankly discussing accusation/insinuation to try to prove your childish point.If you care to reread my posts I clearly stated in most cases a one word answer is sufficient.
Domestic abuse is not funny and should not be used to prove a point.

"Have you stopped beating your wife?" is often cited as the clearest example of a question that cannot be answered with "Yes" or "No", because the assumption is that the person being asked has never been guilty of that crime. Clearly, nobody thinks you beat your wife.

This is not something I was aware of.Thank you for clearing that up.
I suppose one could also ask "have you stopped having sex with children?" too but I wouldn't use either for point scoring on a forum.
The lengths some will go to here to 'win' is quite alarming.

One could, but since that's not a well-known phrase, one would look rather odd, at best.

People are reacting to your own attempts to corral difficult and complex issues into a simple yes/no answer. Relax and go with the flow and you'll enjoy it more. The forum is filled with people with strong opinions, wit, intellect, and much else besides, but most of all, it doesn't like being told what to do

[PedallingSquares]

"Have you stopped beating your wife?" is often cited as the clearest example of a question that cannot be answered with "Yes" or "No", because the assumption is that the person being asked has never been guilty of that crime. Clearly, nobody thinks you beat your wife.

This is not something I was aware of.Thank you for clearing that up.
I suppose one could also ask "have you stopped having sex with children?" too but I wouldn't use either for point scoring on a forum.
The lengths some will go to here to 'win' is quite alarming.

One could, but since that's not a well-known phrase, one would look rather odd, at best.

People are reacting to your own attempts to corral difficult and complex issues into a simple yes/no answer. Relax and go with the flow and you'll enjoy it more. The forum is filled with people with strong opinions, wit, intellect, and much else besides, but most of all, it doesn't like being told what to do

Have you ever seen the Mitchel and Webb Comedy Peep Show?Very good the way it highlighted two very opposite personalities.
The World in full of Marks and Jeremy's.
I'm a Jeremy.

[pwa]

You are using a quite frankly discussing accusation/insinuation to try to prove your childish point.If you care to reread my posts I clearly stated in most cases a one word answer is sufficient.
Domestic abuse is not funny and should not be used to prove a point.

"Have you stopped beating your wife?" is often cited as the clearest example of a question that cannot be answered with "Yes" or "No", because the assumption is that the person being asked has never been guilty of that crime. Clearly, nobody thinks you beat your wife.

This is not something I was aware of.Thank you for clearing that up.
I suppose one could also ask "have you stopped having sex with children?" too but I wouldn't use either for point scoring on a forum.
The lengths some will go to here to 'win' is quite alarming.

You find the example chosen distasteful, and I suppose it is. Domestic violence is nasty. But the point is meant to be that the question is ridiculous and the demand for a "yes" or "no" should be refused because either would be wrong. A longer answer is required for honesty and clarity.

I posed the OP to give folk a chance to mull over the question of whether apologising counts for anything when you have messed up. I think that merits more than just "yes" or "no". The individual case I picked turns out to be more of a "no" because it does look as though the apology may well have been insincere and aimed at minimising punishment. But I think a sincere apology is essential when I myself have got something wrong. It reduces any psychological harm I may have done. Thankfully it is something I rarely need to do.

[mattheus]

Excuse me?!
Where the hell did that accusation come from!?

Come on - Yes or No!

You are using a quite frankly discussing accusation/insinuation to try to prove your childish point.

Fair enough - I will bow to your declarations of what points are worthy. Thankyou for putting me right, I'm sure we'll all benefit

[Cugel]

Posts of this kind generally reveal noting about the particular case, which is "understood" via nothing more than some mass media blurb - not exactly the truth, the whole truth and nothing but the truth, eh? Why opine on a particular case or individual that in reality you know nothing of? It's modern mental disease, this notion that we all have to have opinions on everything and that they're all somehow of value.

However, such posts are revealing of two other interesting things: general case arguments and the personalities or mindsets of the participants offering those arguments.

Cugel