Any recommendations on chains?

[Chris75]

Hi Guys,

As per my previous post, I'm converting my bike over to a MidDrive E-Bike, well I've completed the strip down and am ready to start the build, pending the arrival of the motor kit; having inspected and checked all the components that are going back, I noted that the drive chain is old and a bit stretched!

So my question for you guys is, are there any recommendations on the best brand of chain, bearing in mind that this is now going to be powered, rather than just peddled?

Regards
Chris

[Pebble]

what size chain ?

[Chris75]

what size chain ?

Hi Pebble,

It's 5.8mm wide, going onto a 10-speed rear hub.

Regards
Chris

[Vantage]

I don't think there's a chain out there designed explicitly for ebikes so I think whatever worked in the past for you will do.
Kmc seem to be the most popular. Personally, I'd go for the cheapest they offer for the simple reason that it's going to get thrashed. Not so much due to the power going through it, but the chain line will be a mess. Mine sure is. Big front ring going to big rear cog territory.
I've seen a few suggestions to partially solve this online.
Cheapest is to do most of your riding using the bottom half of the cassette. Being powered that's not a big issue. Unless you live somewhere hilly. In which case you 'could' damage/kill the motor/controller using too high a gear on too steep a hill.
2nd cheapest is to rearrange the sprockets on the cassette so that the lowest geared cogs are in the middle of the cassette. You'd end up losing a few gears but again, with them being powered, not a huge loss.
3rd is a smaller front ring. About £25 will get you a spider and ring (32-34t) to replace the 44t. You can then use the middle of the cassette for a similar cadence with the lower gears in reserve for stupid steep stuff.
There's a company which offers the same 32t ratio but with a customised ring and motor cover which further improves chain line but it's costly. About £130 at least from my googling.
Or you could leave everything as it is and replace the drive train more often. I'm in the 3rd category personally.

[Cugel]

There are now many chains supposedly designed for e-bikes. Do you need an e-bike specific chain? Whilst a mid-motor does add power to your own, going through the chain, its likely that the sum total is still well within the capability of most standard chains.

Still, e-bike chains do tend to come made of rather more resilient materials, often stainless steel; and with added coatings of hard stuff to reduce wear. They don't cost a huge amount more than ordinary chains but they are more expensive, generally.

Here's a page full from one of the big on-line retailers of cycling stuff:

https://www.bikester.co.uk/parts/e-bike ... ke-chains/

Personally I'm trying the Wippermann Connex e-bike chains. This is partly to try and get more miles per chain but mostly because I like their forever-reusable quick link that requires no tools to put in or take out, as many times as you like. So far the chain is working well enough although it doesn't change quite as silently as does the latest Shimano chain made to work with their sprocket and chain ring ramps. But the Wippermann does change cleanly without stutters - it's just a bit noisier when doing so.

There's also this "review" although I'm always wary of such web articles as they may be advertising in disguise. But if you believe the claims in the article, a Wippermann stainless steel chain is a long-laster on an e-bike.

https://cyclingtips.com/2020/04/wipperm ... in-review/

Cugel

[Bonzo Banana]

I think KMC are the highest regarded chains for quality and I think they do some ebike specific chains or maybe they do some mountain bike specific chains which would also improve lifespan. You can get gear change sensors now for mid-drive ebikes which sense when the derailleur is moving and cut power while shifting these can improve chain life. It used to be that mid-drive on average wore a chain down 3x as fast but that is really more about e-mountain bikes. Clearly if you have 2, 3 or even 4x the power of a normal person going through the chain and drivetrain components they will wear faster but there are so many variables, heavy people will wear chains faster as will people who shift more frequently or have a bike setup for more cross chaining more of the time. There are many low power mid-drive ebikes just for light leisure riding and commuting and those I'm sure will not compromise chain lifespan like the big powerful mid-drive motors fitted to e-mountain bikes. Whatever KMC keeps coming up as a brand for long lasting chains suitable for mid-drive ebikes.

[Vantage]

I see there's a 9 speed version....which is now on my wish list.

[PH]

I keep hearing that mid drive motors add wear to the drivetrain, which makes sense, but has anyone objectively measured it?
I've just replaced chain and cassette on my Bosch E-bike which has highest torque motor, used exclusively for urban delivery work, lots of stop start which must be harder on a chain. 9 speed, 11-34 cassette, both quite low end Shimano, kept well oiled but not particularly clean, had started skipping in the two most used gears, 4,800 miles. It's a few years since I did that sort of mileage on any other derailleur bike, I don't recall ever getting significantly more than that.
If the cassette cost considerably more than the chain, I'd have sacrificed one for the other, but as the pair cost £34 I didn't bother.

[freeflow]

I keep hearing that mid drive motors add wear to the drivetrain, which makes sense, but has anyone objectively measured it?

But it doesn't make sense. There is no difference between a mid drive bike and a bike with an elite rider on it. We don't hear of many complaints of people wearing out chains or drivetrain components because they are a powerful rider.

Its more likely that these myths arise because inexperienced riders on new ebikes use bad chainlines because there is no incentive to change gear and that this is the reason for the excessive wear, not the presence of an electic motor per se.

[Cugel]

I keep hearing that mid drive motors add wear to the drivetrain, which makes sense, but has anyone objectively measured it?

But it doesn't make sense. There is no difference between a mid drive bike and a bike with an elite rider on it. We don't hear of many complaints of people wearing out chains or drivetrain components because they are a powerful rider.

Its more likely that these myths arise because inexperienced riders on new ebikes use bad chainlines because there is no incentive to change gear and that this is the reason for the excessive wear, not the presence of an electic motor per se.

True, true - many myths and dollops of scuttlebutt are posted about all sorts of bike things, including chain wear. For such simple subject matter, where the various factors involved are relatively easily isolated, well designed testing regimes can reveal just how wrong a lot of the scuttlebutt is. For example, here's a geet long article about testing chains for various qualities and capabilities:

https://cyclingtips.com/2019/12/the-bes ... mendations

As ever, one must still watch out for adverts and PR in disguise. However, there does seem to have been an attempt to conduct tests in an objective (as possible) fashion. If not, Jonathan will point out the holes, whilst providing a better regime himself.

Another good website that examines various cycling tech myths:

https://www.renehersecycles.com/?s=myths

Cugel

[saudidave]

KMC Bike chains are around £15.00. It takes 15minutes to take the old one off and put a new one on.It's a total no brainer, change them regularly. My last ebike had a Shimano 8 Hub gear, thus a straight drive line and minimal wear, but I still tended to change it annually, every spring when I changed the brake pads as well and gave the bike a thorough once over. For the sake of £40.00 all up it's peace of mind.

I recently accquired a new ebike with a Gates belt drive and I'm thoroughly enjoying the cleanliness and silence it had brought.

[simonineaston]

I bought a job lot of SunTour sprockets and freewheels last month - imagine my excitement when the packet arrived to find that there were 5 unused chains included - and my disappointment when I couldn't see any branding on the links...

[PH]

KMC Bike chains are around £15.00. It takes 15minutes to take the old one off and put a new one on.It's a total no brainer, change them regularly.

And a cassette is £19, so you're throwing away half* the use of a £15 chain to increase the use of a £19 cassette.
So, you buy two chains, I buy a chain and cassette. That works out at £30 V's £34, less the time and effort to frequently measure and then replace. It's up to you which you do, but describing it as a no brainer isn't the way everyone sees it.

* Bit of a guess based on how much usage others report.

My last ebike had a Shimano 8 Hub gear, thus a straight drive line and minimal wear, but I still tended to change it annually,

What a waste, straight chainlines ought to do tens of thousands of miles.

[saudidave]

[quote=saudidave post_id=1708108 time=1657697090 user_id=7385

My last ebike had a Shimano 8 Hub gear, thus a straight drive line and minimal wear, but I still tended to change it annually,

What a waste, straight chainlines ought to do tens of thousands of miles.

Tens of thousands? On an ebike? I suspect we are on different planets. 2-3000 miles is the recommended service interval for a chain on an ordinary bike. (Google it). On an active line plus ebike, chains are subject to up to 270% assistance and 50Nm of torque. Add to that my weight at the time of 210 lbs, the bike weight of 70 lbs and the fact that I cover lots of miles on gravel tracks in wet conditions and you have a very highly stressed chain with grinding paste on it. It's the level of forces one might expect from a professional racing cyclist and they can get through chains in a couple of days racing.

I can assure you that on a bike with a Bosch Active line plus mid drive I got 700 miles out of the first chain that Raleigh supplied it with and I then fitted another three KMC chains over the course of a further 4000 miles. I cleaned & relubed them every couple of weeks quite religously. All three were showing signs of wear when I replaced them. It wasn't wasteful in any way, it was common sense and preventative maintenance, otherwise known as a no brainer. I also get considerably more wear on rear tyres than I do on a non ebike. My Dawes Galaxy had two pairs of Schwalbe Marathon tyres (rotated rear to front at mid point) over the course of 12,000 miles. I put a new pair on my last ebike at 4,000 miles.

[PH]

I can assure you that on a bike with a Bosch Active line plus mid drive I got 700 miles out of the first chain that Raleigh supplied it with and I then fitted another three KMC chains over the course of a further 4000 miles.

I'm sure people can make their own mind up what is and isn't a no brainer for them. As I stated upthread, I've just replaced a chain and cassette, after 4,800 miles, on my Bosch 85Nm E-bike, at a cost of £34. It would have been a no brainer, for me, to have done any different.