Cargo bike deliveries

[531colin]

.......... they have a nominal ability to be pedalled .........

To conform with the E bike regulations, electric power is only available in addition to pedalling....isn't it?

[PH]

.......... they have a nominal ability to be pedalled .........

To conform with the E bike regulations, electric power is only available in addition to pedalling....isn't it?

Yes, though there's no requirement about the proportion of the power that has to be contributed by the rider. It's known as ghost pedalling, turning the pedals without contributing to the propulsion. The Escuta bikes, that look a bit like like mopeds from the 60's, which are popular with delivery riders, don't take much pedaling.
https://www.eskuta.com/pages/commercial

I think there's a place for small low powered eclectic vehicles, for personal transport and cargo, I think they should be closely aligned with the speed and power of a non assisted cycle, I don't see any need for there to be a requirement to pedal.

[Nearholmer]

Looking at the regs, even ghost pedalling isn’t necessary, because “twist and go” is permitted, provided that the pedals are capable of propelling the vehicle. It’s intended to benefit the elderly and disabled, but I guess it could benefit parcel companies too.

I agree with PH that, so long as vehicle capability roughly matches a reasonably fit person on a real bike, I’m not really bothered, even on shared-use paths. What I’m very bothered about is more powerful things being used on shared-use paths (illegally, but barely of at all policed).

[hemo]

They likely come under the quadracycle heading. Like pedelecs as long as they conform to 250w regs and the 25km/h limit then no registration is required. If they have a twist and go they will need to be type rated as per the 250w regs to be legal, it is only a UK dispensation that our regs allow them.
Simpy put it has to be type rated if it doesn't meet the basic EAPC rules which means no twist and go operation.

[Jdsk]

I think hey're great, the more vans they replace the better.

Me too.

More here, including Amazon's:
viewtopic.php?p=1705631#p1705631

Jonathan

[Psamathe]

One of my concerns about them using the cycle lanes is not so much riding on the dedicated cycle only lanes but that they'll likely be regularly stopping in those lanes blocking them, slowly accelerating only to be stopping a short distance for the next delivery. I have no experience of their blocking lanes and obstructing them (I don't cycle in cities where they are appropriate) but I'd not be atall surprised if people started reporting such issues.

Ian

[Aikon]

Likely coming under the category quadricycle, so legally ok in a cycle lane.

With more companies using cargo bikes, ebikes & quadricycles to reduce the cost & increase the agility of their delivery fleets cycle lanes are indeed likely to become much busier.

[Nearholmer]

A positive thing that might come out of this is that the firms using them might become voices in favour of cycling infrastructure provision, which is something that I don’t think has ever happened before: somebody rich and powerful asking for cycling infrastructure provision.

[jimster99]

.......... they have a nominal ability to be pedalled .........

To conform with the E bike regulations, electric power is only available in addition to pedalling....isn't it?

I found a promotional article and it says you don't need to pedal to pull away athough you do have to turn the pedals once you get to 6mph to keep accelerating to full speed.

https://electricdrives.tv/ev-biz/eav-su ... eliveries/

[jimster99]

One of my concerns about them using the cycle lanes is not so much riding on the dedicated cycle only lanes but that they'll likely be regularly stopping in those lanes blocking them, slowly accelerating only to be stopping a short distance for the next delivery. I have no experience of their blocking lanes and obstructing them (I don't cycle in cities where they are appropriate) but I'd not be atall surprised if people started reporting such issues.

Ian

Exactly, that was my experience, I went past one of these stopped on a wide 2-way cyclepath and I could only just get past. I'm all for increasing bikes & reducing car pollution (although electric vehicles do of course emit their own pollution), but I think if too many of this particular style of quadracycle (new word for me!) end up hitting the cycle lanes, I'm just not sure they'll all fit. They're much wider than a normal bike.

Not to mention lowering of road safety standards for the companies using them (no training requirement, no test to be passed, no licence required, no insurance required, no number plate to track the company down in the event of an accident etc.) and no road tax to be paid.

I wonder if this class of vehicle should be subject to a width limit & rate of acceleration limit if being used for commercial purposes on cycle paths?

[Psamathe]

One of my concerns about them using the cycle lanes is not so much riding on the dedicated cycle only lanes but that they'll likely be regularly stopping in those lanes blocking them, slowly accelerating only to be stopping a short distance for the next delivery. I have no experience of their blocking lanes and obstructing them (I don't cycle in cities where they are appropriate) but I'd not be atall surprised if people started reporting such issues.

Ian

Exactly, that was my experience, I went past one of these stopped on a wide 2-way cyclepath and I could only just get past. I'm all for increasing bikes & reducing car pollution (although electric vehicles do of course emit their own pollution), but I think if too many of this particular style of quadracycle (new word for me!) end up hitting the cycle lanes, I'm just not sure they'll all fit. They're much wider than a normal bike.

Not to mention lowering of road safety standards for the companies using them (no training requirement, no test to be passed, no licence required, no insurance required, no number plate to track the company down in the event of an accident etc.) and no road tax to be paid.

I wonder if this class of vehicle should be subject to a width limit & rate of acceleration limit if being used for commercial purposes on cycle paths?

Width doesn't concern me (they are only a few inches wider than my bent tadpole which is only a few inches wider than my 2-wheel DF with loaded panniers). Just that on my <anything> I wont be repeatedly parking to deliver parcels, starting, stopping, etc.

Ian

[Nearholmer]

I’ll express no opinion on the size of the current ones, but was amused, if that’s the right word, to understand that there is actually no particular size limit on them at all ….. in theory I think one could build a huge one, up to the limits for any other road vehicle, and send it toddling along at 250W at about 0.0000001 mph up hill.

I hope someone can prove me wrong, before someone proves me right by doing it!

[Bmblbzzz]

.......... they have a nominal ability to be pedalled .........

To conform with the E bike regulations, electric power is only available in addition to pedalling....isn't it?

I found a promotional article and it says you don't need to pedal to pull away athough you do have to turn the pedals once you get to 6mph to keep accelerating to full speed.

https://electricdrives.tv/ev-biz/eav-su ... eliveries/

Is that what's called "walk mode"?

[Bmblbzzz]

A positive thing that might come out of this is that the firms using them might become voices in favour of cycling infrastructure provision, which is something that I don’t think has ever happened before: somebody rich and powerful asking for cycling infrastructure provision.

It might <optimism mode> lead to the creation of sufficiently wide cycle lanes. And it's not as nothing (ie cars) parks in them already.

[Cugel]

<Repeat mode on>

We already have an excellent cycling infrastructure known as "the roads". The only issue is that some fool allowed them to become infested with dangerous polluting vehicles of many tons going at silly speeds whilst "driven" by the inept, the aggressive, the foolish and even the outright loons. So why waste time, effort and materials on building a cycling infrastructure that will immediately prove inadequate except as a carpark or fly tip?

<Repeat mode off>

The solution to better cycling infrastructure is obvious, is it not? Get rid of the heavy, speeding, polluting dangerous vehicles. If this is inconvenient for some, let's start by legally restricting their velocity to 20mph whilst auto-prosecuting all who fail to drive them safely. The penalty will begin with permanent confiscation of the car or lorry, ensured by scrapping them for the valuable materials they contain.

It won't happen, of course. What will happen is that the figure of several tens of thousands maimed and killed by mad transport technologies each year in Britain alone will expand to millions a week as climate change gets truly violent to the person in response to the profligate fuel burning. This sad state of the future could at least be delayed a little by moving swiftly to ban the cars, vans, lorries et al right now.

No, not a chance.

And whilst we're at it, how about banning spurious aeroplane flights such as those for holidays abroad?

No, interference with "living my one life" freedumb cannot be contemplated let alone allowed.

Cugel, just imagining, you know.